Develop Bugs

Why take WP7 over android?

Hello everyone!
I just have a quick question, Why should a person take a Windows Phone 7 over an android Phone? I like the UI of WP7 but i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
I am a normal/amateur-flasher user, what does WP7 give me and others like me that android doesn't?

Meatballs said:
i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In other words, it has everything android has and then some - namely, UI you like. Sounds like a reason.
I personally will most probably go to WP7 via Android as WP7 most probably won't be available here for a while, and I never start a new year without a new phone. But that'll be a temporary stop. Android for me is like buying a Ford. It may be a great deal but I just couldn't possibly love the thing.

Meatballs said:
Hello everyone!
I just have a quick question, Why should a person take a Windows Phone 7 over an android Phone? I like the UI of WP7 but i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
I am a normal/amateur-flasher user, what does WP7 give me and others like me that android doesn't?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well for me xbox live and the gaming & android was never an option for me since it just felt boring when i pick it up, i was thinking about the evo until i used it & after that i realized that i just dont like android. for you tho im not sure what your into, but silverlight should bring some amazing apps that other platforms cant match supposedly
thats all i have since i never owned an android phone I wont speak to much on it

Meatballs said:
Hello everyone!
I just have a quick question, Why should a person take a Windows Phone 7 over an android Phone? I like the UI of WP7 but i can´t really say that I find anything else worth having that android does not already have.
I am a normal/amateur-flasher user, what does WP7 give me and others like me that android doesn't?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If a spec list is important to you, Android is your choice.
If a seamless experience with a responsive UI is more important, WP7 is the better option. WP7's spec list will grow over time (probably rather quickly). It provides the "it just works" aspects of the iPhone while giving you the carrier and hardware choice of Android.
So at this point, it really depends on what you value more.

1) Hubs - WP7 is an information centric OS vs Android, which is app centric. Hubs allow you to have all of the information and applications that you need one click away, instead of jumping in and out of apps continuously.
2) Games - Xbox Live is the largest and most poplar gaming platform ever. Games will integrate into Live and will allow you to play fantastic games online, and most likely cross-platform. (Probably not until v1.1)
3) Music - Every WP7 is a Zune HD. The Zune interface is integrated and beautiful, much better than music on an iPhone (IMO) and undeniably better than the music experience on any Android Device.
4) Social Networking - Facebook and Twitter are integrated into your contacts (Similar to the Facebook updates for each contact in Sense for Winmo but much better). All of the social networking updates are also integrated into the People hub, and you can comment and such w/o even opening an app.
5) Other random tidbits -
Applications are super super easy to create (I'm taking hours instead of weeks), thus developers will jump on this, and lots of apps will be created.
Hardware minimum is very high, 1ghz snapdragon, WVGA, and 5megapixel cameras are the min (but the platform supports much higher specs).
Large phone selection! Almost all phone manufactures have signed up to make a windows phone, and you will find a couple on every carrier guaranteed.
Lastly, Android is free! this means its likely we will be able to duel boot on a WP7 device, but you will never be able to do this on an android device
Somebody help me out, this is all i could think of off the top of my head. Hope it helps

For me: the clean interface, Live (and Xbox Live) integration and Zune Pass.
I've tried Android and didn't really like it. In a post-iPhone world I don't think it cuts the mustard, it's basically Google's take on Symbian/WinMo.

I like these arguments...
Keep them coming

- Uniform design language for applications
- Better business model for distribution applications
- Trial API for letting users try-before-buy
- More strict hardware requirements (= easier to write apps)
- Larger coverage of paid apps in Europe
- Zune integration
- Xbox integration
-- Xbox achievements (oh yeah!)
- No fragmentation in OS updates
- Supports OTA updates from version 1
- Better design and development tools (Expression Blend and XNA Studio specifically)
- Support for vector graphics
- Windows Live integration
- Cloud storage
- Automatically ("it just works") sync with the PC.
- Best platform for creating mobile games
- Hubs
I could go on, but what I think is really important, is that application and games development is easier than on any other platform. It's more rapid, with larger amount of tooling.
And this means more than people think.
Combined with the good business model for using the marketplace, the market will thrive. Which iPhone proved to be a really killer point.
Apps and iTunes are two points contributed large amount of the iPhone's success. It's scary how little Google cares about these two points for Android.

sprinttouch666 said:
4) Social Networking - Facebook and Twitter are integrated into your contacts (Similar to the Facebook updates for each contact in Sense for Winmo but much better). All of the social networking updates are also integrated into the People hub, and you can comment and such w/o even opening an app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All of your points are well "supported" though there is one flaw with the above quoted statement..
As of right now, Twitter is kinda' denying Microsoft access to certain functions of the TwitterAPI [not fully], thus the Twitter Integration with the new Windows Live Essentials Suite is still... pretty much useless.
And to my knowledge, Microsoft hasn't fully announced 'out-of-the-box' Twitter Integration, as they have with Facebook Integration...
And to make a stand-point in this thread:
Why will I choose Windows Phone 7 compared to the other available Mobile OS's? Because I like being a Tech-Guinea Pig. Testing is fun, especially when it comes to products from Microsoft. I've only been disappointed with Windows ME and Vista {Compared to what Vista was SUPPOSED TO BE <- Click to see}
Apple calls themselves innovators, yet all the do is polish a pile of sh*t (idea) and release it... if you polish sh*t, it's still sh*t... it just looks prettier. Microsoft is compressing this sh*t with 40 billion PSI and making, what looks to be, the most beautiful Diamond in the world.
{Figuratively speaking}

Agent Zach said:
All of your points are well "supported" though there is one flaw with the above quoted statement..
As of right now, Twitter is kinda' denying Microsoft access to certain functions of the TwitterAPI [not fully], thus the Twitter Integration with the new Windows Live Essentials Suite is still... pretty much useless.
And to my knowledge, Microsoft hasn't fully announced 'out-of-the-box' Twitter Integration, as they have with Facebook Integration...
And to make a stand-point in this thread:
Why will I choose Windows Phone 7 compared to the other available Mobile OS's? Because I like being a Tech-Guinea Pig. Testing is fun, especially when it comes to products from Microsoft. I've only been disappointed with Windows ME and Vista {Compared to what Vista was SUPPOSED TO BE <- Click to see}
Apple calls themselves innovators, yet all the do is polish a pile of sh*t (idea) and release it... if you polish sh*t, it's still sh*t... it just looks prettier. Microsoft is compressing this sh*t with 40 billion PSI and making, what looks to be, the most beautiful Diamond in the world.
{Figuratively speaking}
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ops. Not sure what i was thinking, you are very correct about twitter. But, its time for M$ to blow that 3 year old polished turd out of the water with WP7!!!!
(P.S. Thanks for reminding me about Longhorn! I was 11 or 12 at the time!!! I'm gunna QQ all over again!! haha)

It was a minor error, so no biggy. I'm sure Microsoft will somehow introduce their Twitter Integration with an update of some-sort, assuming that they'll do "Client-Side" device updates, like they do with the Zunes.
I use both Facebook and Twitter, so both would be preferred, but if Facebook is all we can get 'out-of-the-box', then I guess I'll have to suffer.
[Actually, I don't mind.. I'm sure there will be a nice TouchTwit 7 App.]

Let me give you a real reason, instead of ****ty phone feature bullet point lists as above:
Android didn't go anywhere yet. Granted, while every app store has its rather tremendously huge share of **** applications, the respective share of good applications on Android is way smaller than in the Apple app store. Android's UI is also so-so and not consistent in itself (the system itself, third party apps don't count, since they're never consistent). Call WP7 minimalistic, but at least they're trying to go for a certain style and presentation, and that consistently. And even with third party applications, look at Facebook for Android, then at Facebook for iPhone. Maybe it's just me, but I want everything I use on the phone to be somewhat attractive. Now look at the upcoming Facebook integration in WP7. Unless you're absolutely disgusted by the Metro style, it looks way more attractive than the Android offering. This'll apply to a lot of future applications, too.
And with the easy and powerful programming environment available in WP7, you should see quite a bunch of decent and innovative applications. Because applications is where it's at in the end. An example: WP7 isn't even out yet, some guy is already demoing a panorama stitching application on Youtube, while there isn't even such a thing available for Android, and the platform's out since quite a while.
I've tried programming with the Android SDK, it was a pretty frustrating experience. Unless someone's a sperg or has tangible financial opportunities to be had (i.e. killer app or hired as Android developer), I don't see people giving it enough effort. As to be witnessed by current application quality.

Tom Servo said:
Android's UI is also so-so and not consistent in itself (the system itself, third party apps don't count, since they're never consistent)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And actually third party apps will be consistent in WP7, it's awesome \o/
The amount of games available months before launch is also staggering.

^ your opinion only.
You have several FB and twitter apps to choose from on android, so your point there is completely bogus.

And they're all winners in terms of visual prowess and usability (note: sarcasm).
Windcape said:
And actually third party apps will be consistent in WP7, it's awesome \o/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No they won't. Microsoft's obviously a gatekeeper on what it'll allow onto the marketplace and what not. But nothing forces you to keep within the Metro guidelines. You're dealing with Silverlight here, you can do whatever you want. I'm keeping a GPS logger on the backburner and am currently tinkering with a second UI for it based on the Zune desktop software. Granted, it's kinda Metro-like, but still completely breaks the norm in relation to the system UI.

I'm aware it's possible, but it's common practice for UI developers from the .NET / Windows stack to stick to the design guidelines. The vast majority will be using the Metro design language, and utilizing pivot/panorama controls, and so on. (Except for games, of course).

Tom Servo said:
No they won't. Microsoft's obviously a gatekeeper on what it'll allow onto the marketplace and what not. But nothing forces you to keep within the Metro guidelines. You're dealing with Silverlight here, you can do whatever you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are right, however, judging by all the demos so far, a lot of applications actually are very close to the standard. Simply because the Metro concept is pretty strong I guess. So we can at least reasonably expect a lot of "apps" that conform.
Tom Servo said:
I'm keeping a GPS logger on the backburner and am currently tinkering with a second UI for it based on the Zune desktop software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A GPS logger for WP7? Running in foreground all the time?

vangrieg said:
You are right, however, judging by all the demos so far, a lot of applications actually are very close to the standard. Simply because the Metro concept is pretty strong I guess. So we can at least reasonably expect a lot of "apps" that conform.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not opposed to custom UIs. But I very rarely see good ones. Hell, even myself am copying an established UI for **** and giggles, because most other things I've tried looked like **** in practise (I'd say I've at least a baseline talent in graphical design).
For that matter, the current templates shipped with the latest SDK don't match the system that well. They're close, but not exact.
For some reason, Microsoft figured to write WP7 with Iris UIX, while giving us developers Silverlight instead, with clones of the various system controls.
vangrieg said:
A GPS logger for WP7? Running in foreground all the time?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. That obviously relies on the application continuing to run on the phone, if you lock the screen. Sadly I couldn't test this yet, since the emulator locks up when you set a screen timeout and let it happen.
As for running in foreground, I don't see the problem in that. Personally, when I'm on my way with a bike, I have the phone stashed away in the backpack, so I don't need anything else running.
Remains to be seen, if calls interrupt the application. Not sure how to initiate fake incoming calls on the emulator.

Tom Servo said:
I'm not opposed to custom UIs. But I very rarely see good ones. Hell, even myself am copying an established UI for **** and giggles, because most other things I've tried looked like **** in practise (I'd say I've at least a baseline talent in graphical design).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's hard to beat a professional design, with some talent or not. People spend a lot of time on those for a reason.
Tom Servo said:
For that matter, the current templates shipped with the latest SDK don't match the system that well. They're close, but not exact.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True. They promised to supply Pivot and Panorama in the final version of tools, AFAIR.
Tom Servo said:
For some reason, Microsoft figured to write WP7 with Iris UIX, while giving us developers Silverlight instead, with clones of the various system controls.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess it was difficult to do it in Silverlight when it wasn't ready? Apart from that, you don't want a web browser done in C#.
Tom Servo said:
As for running in foreground, I don't see the problem in that. Personally, when I'm on my way with a bike, I have the phone stashed away in the backpack, so I don't need anything else running.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't use GPS loggers myself but always thought one of the core usecases was logging your track while you're using satnav.

I would not take any win oh no matter what version over Android. Personally windows phone 7 def.ly is a major upgrade but it still can't be compared to the open source Android. You will def.ly be by far more restrictive with win 7 ph, plus the apps market for WP7 can't be compare to the Android market.
Don't get me wrong WP7 is a total and competely new UI with a bunch of features that would def.ly be useful to some, but at the end of the day it's MS.
Sent from my Evo using XDA App

Lets see how fast MS will push an update now :)

now that we can sideload app's (something like a jailbreak)I am really interested how fast Microsoft will release his first wp7 update to fix this

ceesheim said:
now that we can sideload app's (something like a jailbreak)I am really interested how fast Microsoft will release his first wp7 update to fix this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a suspicion MS wanted this hack out there. MS has never been much of a locked down company, like Apple is. So I see something like this happening with their blessing.

ceesheim said:
now that we can sideload app's (something like a jailbreak)I am really interested how fast Microsoft will release his first wp7 update to fix this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They won't i think imo, Look at the Xbox, We get wave bans/Yearly updates even though they have teams following the forums for what's going on.
Jtags were aloud on-line for years until recently.
I'm just happy i have another device in C# so i can continue to make games and apps to make myself laugh.
MS thrive off hackers and modders imo telling them what's wrong and what people want without risking doing it themselves or overloading this first release scaring people off like the previous WM versions. it's all open source in a hackers mind, but the hacker can't sell the modified ROM can he , MS just release an update with more features*clever really*, where's the white line ? they just wait to see what's popular, same like FSD did for the xbox imo with all the media functionality.
*thats my 2pence *

The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios

adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here. I like what MS is trying to do with WP7 but I fear the worse because Balmer isn't resolved like Jobs is.
Actually I don't think it really matters because what the Market is loaded with right now is pure crap. If MS lets this continue, forget about this platform surviving.

WP7 is great, I just have technophilia lol

adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't worry WP7 won't die... ease of use/speed will not need to be sacrificed for outlook connectivity or some file access

Very true I mean the info. Is more secure on microsoft or Google server than it is on ur personal computer. Don't know why people are so scared of cloud based integration. It makes life a lot easier for people who dont wanna deal with syncing stuff on their own.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

MartyLK said:
Same here. I like what MS is trying to do with WP7 but I fear the worse because Balmer isn't resolved like Jobs is.
Actually I don't think it really matters because what the Market is loaded with right now is pure crap. If MS lets this continue, forget about this platform surviving.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The reason the market is so flooded with rss readers and flashlight apps is because that is about all that is currently possible with the current api.
Allow multi tasking, access to the compass, side loading of files into apps and a whole world of app opportunity opens up

AceofSpades25 said:
The reason the market is so flooded with rss readers and flashlight apps is because that is about all that is currently possible with the current api.
Allow multi tasking, access to the compass, side loading of files into apps and a whole world of app opportunity opens up
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't say "type" of app. I was talking about the quality of those apps and the devs who are crooks being allowed to post false and misleading apps.

mwako said:
They won't i think imo, Look at the Xbox, We get wave bans/Yearly updates even though they have teams following the forums for what's going on.
Jtags were aloud on-line for years until recently.
I'm just happy i have another device in C# so i can continue to make games and apps to make myself laugh.
MS thrive off hackers and modders imo telling them what's wrong and what people want without risking doing it themselves or overloading this first release scaring people off like the previous WM versions. it's all open source in a hackers mind, but the hacker can't sell the modified ROM can he , MS just release an update with more features*clever really*, where's the white line ? they just wait to see what's popular, same like FSD did for the xbox imo with all the media functionality.
*thats my 2pence *
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to clarify on the jtag thing, it was most definitly not years, more like weeks. When the first freeboot was released it was only a few weeks later which Microsoft made changes to ban anyone in a few hours after logging on live with a jtag. Sure you could use the king kong shader hack and run a bit of custom code long before freeboot but it was nothing amazing and you could not get online with the latest dash.
I think that Microsoft only really takes quick action when it poses a serious security threat, as with the jtag it allowed custom code and modified xex's to be run online whereas with just modded firmware you cannot, and modded firmware mostly just leads to piracy and a few cheaters with modded games. So as for WP7 at the moment I dont think that they will rush an update out just to patch up this hole.

Too much investment to let it die
adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi all
I don't think M$ will let WP7 die. They've invested too heavily in it to let it go. I am in the minority camp here but I think that a lot of average users quite like what is on offer. I've shown my HTC Mozart to a few people who haven't ever used a smartphone and they were all "Wow! What is that? It looks amazing!"
I think it will do OK.
Cheers
andrew-in-woking

MartyLK said:
I didn't say "type" of app. I was talking about the quality of those apps and the devs who are crooks being allowed to post false and misleading apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it's the same for any app store. iTunes app store probably has the same proportion of good apps to bad as does windows phone, it's just iTunes has 100 times more apps.

andrew-in-woking said:
Hi all
I don't think M$ will let WP7 die. They've invested too heavily in it to let it go. I am in the minority camp here but I think that a lot of average users quite like what is on offer. I've shown my HTC Mozart to a few people who haven't ever used a smartphone and they were all "Wow! What is that? It looks amazing!"
I think it will do OK.
Cheers
andrew-in-woking
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i've shown my phone to a bunch of iPhone users and they like it's look and feel. i don't have them throwing their iPhones away, but they definitely see it as a good phone and perhaps when it comes to them renewing their contracts (most of them have 3GS), they might think twice about just getting "another iPhone".

Where the hell all the talk of WP7 dying come from weeks after it's launch lol...
The marketplace is riddled with people rushing to get an APP out there. Will be like anything else every few days or so when we see a good app coming out.
Yipes.

adesonic said:
The bigger issue is that the buzz from all the 'I want local outlook sync because I am scared of the cloud' brigade and the 'I want file explorer' gang is going to kill the platform before long, Microsoft are going to have to hack about with wp7 to meet their needs which is a shame, because if people took the time to think they would realise that:
1. Cloud solutions for syncing stuff can be simple and free ( hotmail, gmail mail forwarding)
2. Their emails are in the cloud already
3. Skydrive is a simple and free way to sync docs (although office integration needs to improve)
4. In terms of privacy, if you have something private on a laptop that you connect to the Internet and someone really, really wants it, they will get it!
5. Privacy again, with a cloud connected handset that you lose, you have the option of remotely erasing it.
I feel like I am in a minority that likes the way ms are going but I worry that because of all the negative rubbish on these forums and others, wp7 will die and I will have to go back to android or worse still ios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No the whole point of using Microsoft product is the way all their BUSINESS products offer tight and nice integration. I have no problems with cloud per say (I still don't trust them with security but that is just me I guess). Many people have invested heavily in Outlook and their work and life harmony depends of Outlook. Not giving them the ability to simply sync to Outlook is just pure lazyness. I am a software developer and I can see how they have taken simple route to eliminate sync issues.
You want ppl to use cloud contacts and calendar? Fine, ask Microsoft to first provide 50% of the available fields in Outlook! It's missing the most basic field such as Anniversary for a contact! The WP7 phone has that field but the Windows Live contact doesn't.

I doubt MS will rush to close this hole, if indeed, it's classed as a hole at all. Simple fact is, this sort of stuff is good for them, generally speaking. Particularly since they'll be able to block pirated apps from using live services, it deters piracy and promotes homebrew software to fill the gaps that would take them a lot of time and effort to fill. It's much more cost-effective to get a good base out there, and let the community pick up the slack and build on top of what they provide.
The fact is there are still other, much stronger protections that negate some of the traditional disadvantages a company may have with exploits of this kind. The protection that prevents people from porting WP7 to phones that have not had the licence paid for - means MS always gets their cash. The integration of the cloud also means they can detect pirated apps much more easily - for example, a Game accessing Xbox Live can have it's legitimacy checked server-side. Has that user purchased that game from the Marketplace? No? Deny them access. It adds a premium to staying genuine, and therefore, many will. That leaves the prime use for sideloading as homebrew, unverified software. Now, because it's unverified, they don't have to go to the trouble of supporting it, ensuring backwards compatibility as they move forward at a rapid pace, but yet their platform can still do *everything* it should be able to. And frankly, right now, MS know that profit is secondary to Market Share. A strong side-loading homebrew development scene can make serious inroads to the "open" environments that they are competing against, particularly Android.

The Gate Keeper said:
it's the same for any app store. iTunes app store probably has the same proportion of good apps to bad as does windows phone, it's just iTunes has 100 times more apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right now the WP7 app store is averaging 100%. The very first app I buy from this new store and it's false. That never happened with Android Market or iPhone App Store. But it is true, I need to give it time to get filled up. I'm just peeved at the bad del I got and the lack of a response from the money grabber.

MartyLK said:
Right now the WP7 app store is averaging 100%. The very first app I buy from this new store and it's false. That never happened with Android Market or iPhone App Store. But it is true, I need to give it time to get filled up. I'm just peeved at the bad del I got and the lack of a response from the money grabber.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought all apps came with a trial period?

hounsell said:
I doubt MS will rush to close this hole, if indeed, it's classed as a hole at all. Simple fact is, this sort of stuff is good for them, generally speaking. Particularly since they'll be able to block pirated apps from using live services, it deters piracy and promotes homebrew software to fill the gaps that would take them a lot of time and effort to fill. It's much more cost-effective to get a good base out there, and let the community pick up the slack and build on top of what they provide.
The fact is there are still other, much stronger protections that negate some of the traditional disadvantages a company may have with exploits of this kind. The protection that prevents people from porting WP7 to phones that have not had the licence paid for - means MS always gets their cash. The integration of the cloud also means they can detect pirated apps much more easily - for example, a Game accessing Xbox Live can have it's legitimacy checked server-side. Has that user purchased that game from the Marketplace? No? Deny them access. It adds a premium to staying genuine, and therefore, many will. That leaves the prime use for sideloading as homebrew, unverified software. Now, because it's unverified, they don't have to go to the trouble of supporting it, ensuring backwards compatibility as they move forward at a rapid pace, but yet their platform can still do *everything* it should be able to. And frankly, right now, MS know that profit is secondary to Market Share. A strong side-loading homebrew development scene can make serious inroads to the "open" environments that they are competing against, particularly Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agree with the above.

Apps so buggy

Ive had so many apps that suck so bad, they are so buggy and barely work. Such as Opentable, podcast, and several others. Makes me weary to even purchase full apps even though you can try them. Most apps available suck anyways.
I need:
Best buy app
Chipotle app
Panera bread app
Good podcast app
Good radio app
Good turn by turn navigation app
Opentable that actually works
and im sure there are several apps that I would like to use but not yet available, marketplace is full of bull crap. lets get some stuff people will actually use on a daily basis.

This whole market place concept is a bust.. just because it worked for iphone dosent necessarily mean it will work for wp7. They said marketing stuff like 'oh we have 6000 applications in marketplace!' Reality is its not even worth except for more than 1-2 of them to even download and waste time on.

937dytboi said:
Ive had so many apps that suck so bad, they are so buggy and barely work. Such as Opentable, podcast, and several others. Makes me weary to even purchase full apps even though you can try them. Most apps available suck anyways.
I need:
Best buy app
Chipotle app
Panera bread app
Good podcast app
Good radio app
Good turn by turn navigation app
Opentable that actually works
and im sure there are several apps that I would like to use but not yet available, marketplace is full of bull crap. lets get some stuff people will actually use on a daily basis.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Zune is great for podcasts. What do you want a podcast app to do? The Maps app has great TBT nav - no voice, though.

937dytboi said:
Good radio app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm going to guess you don't like the radio that's already in there.

This is the kind of thing that may suck on WP7 phones for a little while...but i expected that didnt you?
The iphone apps were all full of crap when they first came out....it took time for people to get used to making them, I think the promising thing is that big companies are starting to bother making apps, so it shows people are getting serious.
I read it in an article that MS is a software company and if theres anyone who is going to be able to make it work at this sort of 'late entry' into the market its them.
I have at least 12 APPS I really like and that I use all the time
I think we are just guna have to wait for a bit

The marketplace idea is not a bust.
Developers who want to earn money selling their apps and games have a better chance when all the customers are funneled to one place, as opposed to having to search obscure sites, to find their product.
At that point, it's up to the developer to try to make a compelling enough product for the customer to think it's worth purchasing.
For the customer, they could go to one place to look for anything that is currently available for their phone. They can try out any application without risk, and if they feel that the product is worthy, they can purchase it easily. The rules for purchasing each app/game will be universal. They don't have to go through different payment processes with different companies.

Purple11 said:
Reality is its not even worth except for more than 1-2 of them to even download and waste time on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? So which one or two out of the following do you feel is worth downloading?
Twitter
Facebook
Youtube
Microsoft Tag Reader
Adobe Reader
Shazam
IGN
IMDb
eBay
Flixter
These are just some of the apps I couldn't live without - however, if you manage to witter it down to 1 or 2 I'll post an updated list of all my "important" apps. Although, IMO, 99% of people would have maxed their 2 apps from the top 5 in the list above.

emigrating said:
Really? So which one or two out of the following do you feel is worth downloading?
Twitter
Facebook
Youtube
Microsoft Tag Reader
Adobe Reader
Shazam
IGN
IMDb
eBay
Flixter
These are just some of the apps I couldn't live without - however, if you manage to witter it down to 1 or 2 I'll post an updated list of all my "important" apps. Although, IMO, 99% of people would have maxed their 2 apps from the top 5 in the list above.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This and more and more and more.
OP and hater beneath him, you're just being a little narrow minded tbh.

given that A LOT of the applications are data based, how is your network coverage? is it quite patchy? if so, this would explain why a lot of applications appear very bad constantly not responding/loading data.
as for the market place, i think it's a bit of a good and bad thing. the iPhone model is good for itself, but WP can't copy it completely because of the differences it has. for example, WP offers in app trial mode. this needs to be made more promonent and needs to encourage the end user that these apps work as a trial. with this, then more people who list their apps as a paid app would get better usage as people don't instantly think they have to pay anything to use it.
i personally don't buy any app unless i get a bit of a play with the app first. but the problem is, i have to go to each app to see if it has trial available. the market place needs to adjust to this variable in greater force because it's actually what makes the WP market place a great prospect and cancels out the duplicates which you see in the iOS market place (the free and paid version of apps).

emigrating said:
Really? So which one or two out of the following do you feel is worth downloading?
Twitter
Facebook
Youtube
Microsoft Tag Reader
Adobe Reader
Shazam
IGN
IMDb
eBay
Flixter
These are just some of the apps I couldn't live without - however, if you manage to witter it down to 1 or 2 I'll post an updated list of all my "important" apps. Although, IMO, 99% of people would have maxed their 2 apps from the top 5 in the list above.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Other than Adobe Reader all other software you mentioned are useless to me. I am a smartphone user, not an Iphone user.

Oookayyy... so what do you want then?

zukа said:
Oookayyy... so what do you want then?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Better: Calendar, Appointments, Time Management, Alarm, Wallet, Book Keeping, Expense Records, Maps, Navigation, SMS/Mail Organizing, Dialer, Auto-Call Record, Call Management, Data Management etc etc you should get an idea ..

Purple11 said:
Better: Calendar, Appointments, Time Management, Alarm, Wallet, Book Keeping, Expense Records, Maps, Navigation, SMS/Mail Organizing, Dialer, Auto-Call Record, Call Management, Data Management etc etc you should get an idea ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most of which is part of the core OS - now if all you want are better implementations of the above, feel free to discuss what, specifically, needs fixing in the core experience.
If you ask me, the calendar, appointments, time management, alarms and email are all working fine out of the box - sure, we need better exchange support (server search etc), but it does what it's supposed to for now.
As for Book Keeping / Expense Records (why are you listing both?) - there are apps for this.
Bing Maps is included out of the box. Navigation may be poor, but there are apps for this that help somewhat.
In any case - if you need enterprise features like what you've listed above you're really not part of the target audience for WP7 at the moment. Something which has been very clear ever since the February unveiling of WP7 last year.

emigrating said:
Really? So which one or two out of the following do you feel is worth downloading?
Twitter
Facebook
Youtube
Microsoft Tag Reader
Adobe Reader
Shazam
IGN
IMDb
eBay
Flixter
These are just some of the apps I couldn't live without - however, if you manage to witter it down to 1 or 2 I'll post an updated list of all my "important" apps. Although, IMO, 99% of people would have maxed their 2 apps from the top 5 in the list above.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See we are just two different people, KI dont have a twitter or Facebook account. So thats useless to me, Shazam I wont really use. But everything on your list is fine. My problem is that some apps that ive downloaded seem not to work like advertised and they crap out by running slow or not working at all. But I think im jumping the gun here, I just think we should have a better marketplace selection but I have to realize that the marketplace has just really opened to be honest. Just felt I needed to gripe about my experience

What's also a problem (for now) is that development for Windows Phone is so similar to developing for regular Windows environments: same tools, same programming languages, etc. A lot of "normal" Windows / .NET developers are early adopters of the platform and are having their go at developing a Windows Phone app. Unfortunately they don't always consider the limitations that the platforms has. They'll use a lot of heavy animation, request huge amounts of data, use imagery not optimized for mobile use. Thus: crappy apps.
I think over time this will all settle and the apps will become better.
That said, Microsoft does need to increase the overall app performance on the phone. There's a noticable difference between the built-in (native) apps and the managed apps.

stringray said:
What's also a problem (for now) is that development for Windows Phone is so similar to developing for regular Windows environments: same tools, same programming languages, etc. A lot of "normal" Windows / .NET developers are early adopters of the platform and are having their go at developing a Windows Phone app. Unfortunately they don't always consider the limitations that the platforms has. They'll use a lot of heavy animation, request huge amounts of data, use imagery not optimized for mobile use. Thus: crappy apps.
I think over time this will all settle and the apps will become better.
That said, Microsoft does need to increase the overall app performance on the phone. There's a noticable difference between the built-in (native) apps and the managed apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this is blatantly false. First of all unless you're doing game programming you can only make Silverlight apps. Most regular windows applications do not use silverlight! You would think the web designers who use that stuff can create better apps, guess not.
Secondly the reason for crappy apps is entirely microsoft's fault. To get your app published, you need to pay 99$ a year for a developers license and get your identity verified by some thirdparty. After that when you submit an app, it is supposed to get reviewed by a team at microsoft to verify that your app meets many of the app guideliness set (like not crashing!).
I remember going to Tech Days (microsoft developer conference) and hearing them bragging about how their app reviews ensured that only quality apps were released but lately the amount of **** apps that have been appearing on the app marketplace makes me think they are just auto approving anything without even checking to see if it works.

pillsburydoughman said:
this is blatantly false. First of all unless you're doing game programming you can only make Silverlight apps. Most regular windows applications do not use silverlight! You would think the web designers who use that stuff can create better apps, guess not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Zero windows applications use Silverlight. WPF maybe, but Silverlight is a web-only subset. What stringray actually said was:
Windows Phone is so similar to developing for regular Windows environments: same tools, same programming languages, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which is correct. Visual Studio is the primary development tool for desktop and C# is very popular development language for desktop.
The rest of what you said is probably true. But you can never test an app and say that it will never crash. Do you remember WM6.5 when you downloaded an app to find it didn't even launch on your device? Well at least it's filtering out all that crap

Silverlight is not only for web development. I believe since Silverlight 3.0 you can use them as desktop applications as well.
pillsburydoughman said:
Secondly the reason for crappy apps is entirely microsoft's fault. To get your app published, you need to pay 99$ a year for a developers license and get your identity verified by some thirdparty. After that when you submit an app, it is supposed to get reviewed by a team at microsoft to verify that your app meets many of the app guideliness set (like not crashing!).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How is the way you pay and get verified the reason why the apps are MS' fault?
Yea, they check them but rarely have I seen an app crash (actually I haven't yet but I'm not going to state that all of them have).

I just want to quickly point something to the ones you have hated apps.
Why don't you give feedback to developers? I have given serveral and emailed several feedback and have gotten a response each time. And each time, they take my feedback into consideration and either plan to implement them in the future.
As the end-user don't we want the best product? To get the best, we have to critique and help evolve the marketplace/apps. Only this way do developers know how to improve and what needs to be improved.
Otherwise they believe everything is dandy.

pillsburydoughman said:
this is blatantly false. First of all unless you're doing game programming you can only make Silverlight apps. Most regular windows applications do not use silverlight!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, Silverlight development does resemble WPF programming a lot (afterall, it is a subset of WPF). And we've been doing WPF programming for years now, haven't we? Actually, if you stick to simply placing controls on a page and adding event code it resembles WinForms very much. And that last thing is what I see happening a lot. Many developers create some spaghetti app, which totally messes up tombstoning or page navigation.
Once developers get more comfortable with Windows Phone (Silverlight) programming, they'll see that things like the MVVM pattern, async processing , etc. actually do make sense and can be very helpful. And that's when the good apps are starting to get made.
Secondly the reason for crappy apps is entirely microsoft's fault. To get your app published, you need to pay 99$ a year for a developers license and get your identity verified by some thirdparty. After that when you submit an app, it is supposed to get reviewed by a team at microsoft to verify that your app meets many of the app guideliness set (like not crashing!).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In general I think they do a really good job. Of course they had to learn in the beginning and a lot of faults were made. But the test department is getting better and better. The reports you get when an app fails certification are often very detailed.
Don't forget they check apps against the Guidelines. I agree there are a lot of stupid apps (Peace Sign app, anyone?). But those apps do follow the Guidelines.
Crashes are hard to predict and it's not that easy to test for them. Personally, I haven't experienced much app crashing on my device. In fact, I've seen more apps crash on my iOS devices than on my WP7.
Microsoft has said they collect crash dumps from all apps on the phone (at least, if you've opted in for that). I hope that someday they'll give us developers access to those dumps, so we can do post-mortem analysis of our app's crashes.
But lately the amount of **** apps that have been appearing on the app marketplace makes me think they are just auto approving anything without even checking to see if it works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally disagree. The apps may be not to your liking, but most of them do work according to the Guidelines. And did you give feedback to the developers of those apps? They often actually listen!

thoughts on WP7 and future of Windows Mobile

Hello.
Few years ago, there were hundreds of different OS for mobile phones, everyone with its pros and cons.
But with these phones, we only could send/recieve calls and sms, take photos and crappy videos and store some music.
every phone had its own file extensions and file compatibilities, only java was able to unify some programms.
The browser were also unusable, despite the small screens, and high costs of internet, there was no compatibility with activex and some frameworks.
I can remember, I had a Samsung sghP910 with 320x240 screen and Nvidia chipset, enough to do many things, but completely disabled by the bad Samsung OS.
Later there was the unification of mobile phones with PDA with Windows Mobile.
I think this was the biggest step in history for mobile phones.
I bought the HTC Touch 3G WM6.1, and I could virtually do anything I could do on my computer. Download programs, remotely connect with my office PC, and surf the internet without any compatibility issues.
for any problem or need, ther was a program on the internet to download!
The only big issue, was the small resolution display 320x240, that complicated my life a little bit.
Now i was searching for something newer, that could totally replace my netbook, I was thinking about some HTC with this brand new WP7 but today I tried out the new HTC trophy of my girlfriend, and was really disappointed!!!!
I mean, very high resolution that could finally activate some remote desktop function, fast processor and relative lightweight.
I saw that junk OS of Iphone, made for rich and useless people, the nokia junk Symbian that I'm actually using for work, and that new IPhone-like Android, that is here today, but maybe not tomorrow.
Blackberry is another useless junk, my sister got it.
I'm searching for some desktop remplacement handheld, but the new WP7 is back to this kind of Multimedia useless stuff, no SD support for upgrade, and this whole windows, that only makes you take more time to find the right application (like the start in WM6.5)
I saw that instead to make a step forward, Microsoft mad a big big step backward!!!!
I'm asking myself why, because handheld should be every-time more like Desktops, but like this, you're bound to stupid aplications, and you have to pay for it.
No file-manager, no desktop, no start button and no task manager, nothing!!
Someone can tell me if there is a possibility that with some tweaks, it would be posible to go back to real Windows Mobile???

If you want all that, buy yourself a HD2 and run WM or Android. Has RDP, file-managers galore, task managers, useless SD support and those all important crashes and slow-downs all the time.
While I agree, the lack of RDP on WP7 is disheartening, judging from the number of quasi-remote-desktop apps available there is actually a real want for this. So I have no doubt it will become available sooner rather than later.

Yes it would be possble, go to your nearest provider and purchase a 6.5 enabled device.
A mobile OS should absolutely not evolve to look and act like a desktop OS. That's what windows mobile was. And it was awful. A mobile OS should be really what wp7 and iOS is; quick, easy to use, and accelerate what you're doing, not hinder it.
XxAndrexX said:
No file-manager, no desktop, no start button and no task manager, nothing!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah see this is exactly the reason I switched to wp7. I was so sick of tweaking and managing. and tweaking. The endless tweaking and managing. My mobile device should not give me a headache whenever I use it and watch it lumber through its operations. Wp7 has no task manger to keep an eye on, no tweaks needed, no file manager to navigate (what do you need one for... seriously), and it's awesome. Seemless and quick. And what's the purpose of the start button? Why do you want one? What do you want it to navigate you to?
I'm really having a hard time understanding why so many people don't research what wp7 is before getting it. It is not windows mobile. Those days are gone. A mobile OS should be what iOS and wp7 is, quick and painless. Let me do whatever I want without having to worry about an app now running in the background or what my memory is at.

Why not just get an HD2 or similar that is designed to run "real" Windows Mobile and not buy an OS that obviously does not suit your needs?

I ave had several wm phones and was a fan, however, windows mobile as it was nearly finished off microsoft in the mobile Market, wp7 may save them

Right now there is nothing more to do for me than wait for an upgrade and see how MS will act. WP7 is a great foundation.
But yes, smartphones - opposed to dumphones - should replicate most of PC abilities.
They should not act like racing horse with 3 legs - and this is what WP7 is right now.
I am able to compromise my needs to wait now. I can't wait however for very long, year is too much, to get features instead of their basic forms like maps, word etc.
So for me, if MS will not make it soon and accelerate development, bring the features an make it capable, I am off to Android.
But now I wait, I want to see MS cards open.

doministry said:
I am able to compromise my needs to wait now. I can't wait however for very long, year is too much, to get features instead of their basic forms like maps, word etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which features are you after exactly?

I think you get me wrong. I mean, its very good that everything is getting "easier", more beautiful and so on, but normally they should add tools, without quitting the old good ones.
with my touch 3g, 6.1 i have to use the pen to go through the menus, its complicated, but i know where to find my applications, and configurations, like windows.
But the worst thing, i heard that's a whole new OS and no longer compatible with cab files.
that means, if i want some new programs, maybe i've got to pay for them, and the old ones are lost.
am I right???

XxAndrexX said:
I think you get me wrong. I mean, its very good that everything is getting "easier", more beautiful and so on, but normally they should add tools, without quitting the old good ones.
with my touch 3g, 6.1 i have to use the pen to go through the menus, its complicated, but i know where to find my applications, and configurations, like windows.
But the worst thing, i heard that's a whole new OS and no longer compatible with cab files.
that means, if i want some new programs, maybe i've got to pay for them, and the old ones are lost.
am I right???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes. WP7 is made "from scratch" so no, no .cab files.
Everything has to be purchased from Marketplace.

emigrating said:
Which features are you after exactly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which? Well: marketplace support for all users, bing maps supporting all countries at least in Europe, PC Usb transfer of all documents, multitasking, video send by email, word at least on the level of docs to go featurewise, greater openeness for developers, and some other stuff.

doministry said:
Yes. WP7 is made "from scratch" so no, no .cab files.
Everything has to be purchased from Marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
aha...
And you like this new feature?
Instead of downloading third-party freeware???
what does it means made from scratch?

XxAndrexX said:
aha...
And you like this new feature?
Instead of downloading third-party freeware???
what does it means made from scratch?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To be honest the app distribution is not a problem for me right now.
From scratch = from the beginning. Not based on WM6.5.

doministry said:
To be honest the app distribution is not a problem for me right now.
From scratch = from the beginning. Not based on WM6.5.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmmm maybe i'll wait until they'll put Intel Atom instead of Arm, and run normal Window 7, because even if I buy somenthing like HD2, it will be sooner or later discontinued damn

WP7 is super system, till you use it as M$ engineers thought you would be.
I mean there's plenty things missing. Many people will say, who needs tethering, for example. And those many will be satisfied with other advantages of WP7. But me, who need tethering all the time, I'm stuck. I'm really keen on WP7, it's speed, live sync, zune sync,... but who will tell me when tethering will be possible. I didn't even consider such phone systen doesn't have tethering.
Now I spent whole week hacking the HD7 phone with Chevron unlocker and DFRouter xap. As I'm reading the thread about tethering I must be lucky that I didn't mess it all up cause some can't connect to zune after that.
So, as sbdy said, if you use your phone for most phone obvious things, than WP7 is really great. But if you need a bit more, than you're stuck. So I'm probably selling my HD7 and waiting for Nokia MeeGo device. There I think I can expect more as computer device and a bunch of things WP7 doesn't have: tethering(USB and WiFi), FM transmitter, open platform, video calling. That is what I can think of what matters to me.

Mango is here... Where are the apps?

Remember when people were complaining about a lack of good apps and all they could hear was "There's no API for that, wait for Mango, bla bla bla...".
Developers have had the tools since when? May, June, July? Yet the only worthy app we've seen is WhatsApp. At a time when people are preordering the iPhone 4S like crazy, isn't it time WP crank it up a bit?
Why can't I have something as simple as Audible for instance (heck, there isn't even an Amazon app outside the US)? It's like the world stopped with Mango, I don't get it.
[Insert "you're to impatient", "buy an iPhone" comments here]

a good chat client. WhatsApp, IM+ DO NOT count as good chat clients. They are both broken, slow, buggy, laggy and half the time don't even work. If someone now says IM+ works then I'll ask them to use it on iOS or Android and see what 'works' REALLY means.

I must admit I was all excited about getting Mango and having Live tiles on the home screen.
Sadly there are hardly any good apps to use, And even fewer with live tiles.
{I would love Twitter to have a live tile}
The little things like no WiFi tethering and no decent Navigation app for WP7 is testing my patience as well. I am hoping Nokia will rectify these short comings as I really do love the windows software.
I just hope the hardware that this platform deserve is released soon.

TuneIn radio has been updated to Mango, and now supports background audio. That's the best update I've had - use that app all the time. Other than that a few of my map apps (Bingle Maps, GMaps) open quicker, but that's it really.
Yeh is a bit of a let down so far; still no augmented reality apps yet, or properly good WP7 exclusive games (could we have *one* FPS please?)

another complaining thread sighs....

sayonical said:
another complaining thread sighs....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well WP7 isn't a bed of roses as you might think it is. For those who paid through the roof have the right to complain if the platform doesn't meet their expectations.

agp64 said:
..... The little things like no WiFi tethering and no decent Navigation app for WP7 .....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe Navigon Navigator does'nt support your region but for 95% of the users Navigator IS a decent navigation app (and version 4 should to be released soon to the market i read somewhere).
There will never be an OS that will fully forfill YOUR needs but when it does what the majority of users want it's on the right way.

I dont get the "no good gps apps" argument. Is Garmin Streetpilot not available in the US or Europe?

How about this. Let's come up with a list of the apps that we really want and some of us can start to ping them (via twitter or email) to see whether or not they are working on a WP7 app and any idea when it's coming.

Im getting 5+ updates everyday and most are for mango. It takes time.
Sent from my T8788 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

PG2G said:
How about this. Let's come up with a list of the apps that we really want and some of us can start to ping them (via twitter or email) to see whether or not they are working on a WP7 app and any idea when it's coming.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's an idea I can run with instead of countless posts moaning and groaning!
I'll start
Ereader.com (Back when I had my pocket pc, then android so I have a lot of books on there, would love to have this on wp7) However Barnes and Nobles own the company now and they have the nook so probably a hopeless cause....
A Barnes and Noble Nook app wouldn't hurt though...
sent the tweet: @BN_care will you be releasing a Nook app for Windows Phone 7? I'd also like to read my ereader.com books on my windows phone. Help!

the92playboy said:
I dont get the "no good gps apps" argument. Is Garmin Streetpilot not available in the US or Europe?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Garmin is US only, Navigon so far is only available in Germany (?)
Sent from my Samsung Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

Peew971 said:
Garmin is US only, Navigon so far is only available in Germany (?)
Sent from my Samsung Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Canada also has Garmin, and works awesome for those interested.

This is pretty much the reason I can't see myself switching. I have an iPhone. Why do I want to move to a platform where I can do less than I already can? I really want certain apps on WP7 before I move or I just cannot justify moving. It may be an unimportant app to most people, but an app like Grindr is something I don't want my platform without. Not to mention I have a free turn-by-turn app with iOS(which I believe Nokia is going to be addressing, and is most likely the hardware I'd be buying if I got a Windows Phone).
A lot of people on here(from what I've noticed) are saying that WP7 needs to get more unique apps. While that's nice and all, I want already existing apps. Most of my friends also have iPhones, and I don't want them to tell me to pull up an app and be unable to. I don't really care about the "look what my phone can do and yours can't." I care about being able to do all that they can at the very least.
Many people on here care about games and think that could be the main selling point of WP7. I just don't see it happening. While it's a small sample size, most people I've met pretty much only pick up simple games like Angry Birds or Cut the Rope(if that). I just don't feel that a large majority of smart phone owners want to play action-packed RPGs on their phones. We have computers and consoles for that. And while it might be a nice novelty to be able to once in a while, again, the only games people I know as well as myself play are the simple pick it up for a few minutes and put it back down games.
Next comes the photography apps. I almost never take pictures, but many, many people do. I don't have a WP7 to compare apps with, but I'm curious what the photo apps on there are like. I have Camera+, Hipstamatic, and Instagram on my phone. How do non-native apps(and I guess the native app) on WP7 stack up to those? I hope Nokia will save the day in terms of excellent camera quality, but the in-app editing is also a pretty important feature to me(when I do actually take pictures) and others.
The Windows Phone OS looks pretty amazing, but I just can't justify moving until it can do all that my iPhone can in terms of apps relevant to me. I'm hoping by WP8 it will be all I want and more, and just maybe it will be able to suck me out of the Apple ecosystem. The live tiles are a pretty excellent concept, and while it's compelling, I need more apps to be available. People almost always develop for iOS before they develop for Android or WP7, so it definitely leaves something to be desired in that department.
The only thing I'd be pleased with is the fact that Skype integration is coming. On that token, I already have a Skype app with video calling on the iPhone. So Microsoft has definitely got to step up their game, get existing apps on this platform at all costs, and make sure their own in-house apps completely blow the other platforms' alternatives away.

the92playboy said:
Canada also has Garmin, and works awesome for those interested.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While iOS and Andorid have MapQuest for free with virtually all the features of Android's Google Maps and Navigation for free.
http://wireless.mapquest.com/
Uses Navteq map data, BTW. Guess they were better at negotiating a licensing deal than Microsoft...

whistler-nl said:
Maybe Navigon Navigator does'nt support your region but for 95% of the users Navigator IS a decent navigation app (and version 4 should to be released soon to the market i read somewhere).
There will never be an OS that will fully forfill YOUR needs but when it does what the majority of users want it's on the right way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's all well and dandy for those that have access to it. But there are many areas in Asia that still have no way to navigate offline.
It seems to me that a majority want WIFI tethering to avoid having 2 data plans, The same reason I want it.
My 4 year old Nokia had WIFI tethering and world GPS maps.
I do love this OS. I am hopping Nokia maps will make it our way soon.
---------- Post added at 10:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:54 AM ----------
Bl4ke said:
This is pretty much the reason I can't see myself switching. I have an iPhone. Why do I want to move to a platform where I can do less than I already can? I really want certain apps on WP7 before I move or I just cannot justify moving. It may be an unimportant app to most people, but an app like Grindr is something I don't want my platform without. Not to mention I have a free turn-by-turn app with iOS(which I believe Nokia is going to be addressing, and is most likely the hardware I'd be buying if I got a Windows Phone).
A lot of people on here(from what I've noticed) are saying that WP7 needs to get more unique apps. While that's nice and all, I want already existing apps. Most of my friends also have iPhones, and I don't want them to tell me to pull up an app and be unable to. I don't really care about the "look what my phone can do and yours can't." I care about being able to do all that they can at the very least.
Many people on here care about games and think that could be the main selling point of WP7. I just don't see it happening. While it's a small sample size, most people I've met pretty much only pick up simple games like Angry Birds or Cut the Rope(if that). I just don't feel that a large majority of smart phone owners want to play action-packed RPGs on their phones. We have computers and consoles for that. And while it might be a nice novelty to be able to once in a while, again, the only games people I know as well as myself play are the simple pick it up for a few minutes and put it back down games.
Next comes the photography apps. I almost never take pictures, but many, many people do. I don't have a WP7 to compare apps with, but I'm curious what the photo apps on there are like. I have Camera+, Hipstamatic, and Instagram on my phone. How do non-native apps(and I guess the native app) on WP7 stack up to those? I hope Nokia will save the day in terms of excellent camera quality, but the in-app editing is also a pretty important feature to me(when I do actually take pictures) and others.
The Windows Phone OS looks pretty amazing, but I just can't justify moving until it can do all that my iPhone can in terms of apps relevant to me. I'm hoping by WP8 it will be all I want and more, and just maybe it will be able to suck me out of the Apple ecosystem. The live tiles are a pretty excellent concept, and while it's compelling, I need more apps to be available. People almost always develop for iOS before they develop for Android or WP7, so it definitely leaves something to be desired in that department.
The only thing I'd be pleased with is the fact that Skype integration is coming. On that token, I already have a Skype app with video calling on the iPhone. So Microsoft has definitely got to step up their game, get existing apps on this platform at all costs, and make sure their own in-house apps completely blow the other platforms' alternatives away.
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Great post Bl4ke.
The cross platform apps are a must for WP7.
I still cannot believe Skype is not available for WP7. My friends laugh when I tell them I do not have Skype on my phone.

It is a disappointment ... coming to WP7 from Android ... I patiently heard the argument that the apps will come once mango is here ... and considering such quick deployment of the update, I was hoping the developers will take notice and flood the market with apps... instead all I see on the marketplace is the same set of apps being repeated in the featured section ...
1. There isnt a decent chat client for WP7
2. Youtube playback seems to be slow
3. No third party browsers ... IE9 does not support text reflow ... i see myself scrolling sideways and downwards ...
4. Bing navigation is so crippled ... thanks to their deal with Navteq
5. Facebook client looks ancient .. Twitter client is marginally better ... where are the live tiles though ?
I can continue ranting but honestly, I feel really sad about how slowly the new apps are coming in ... It was almost the same when I was with Symbian and the Ovi store basically did not grow ... I sometimes get so annoyed with WP7 that I wish to put my sim back in my LG Optimus One (a very midrange phone) ... but heck, I can do a lot more with it ...

k4ce said:
It is a disappointment ... coming to WP7 from Android ... I patiently heard the argument that the apps will come once mango is here ... and considering such quick deployment of the update, I was hoping the developers will take notice and flood the market with apps... instead all I see on the marketplace is the same set of apps being repeated in the featured section ...
1. There isnt a decent chat client for WP7
2. Youtube playback seems to be slow
3. No third party browsers ... IE9 does not support text reflow ... i see myself scrolling sideways and downwards ...
4. Bing navigation is so crippled ... thanks to their deal with Navteq
5. Facebook client looks ancient .. Twitter client is marginally better ... where are the live tiles though ?
I can continue ranting but honestly, I feel really sad about how slowly the new apps are coming in ... It was almost the same when I was with Symbian and the Ovi store basically did not grow ... I sometimes get so annoyed with WP7 that I wish to put my sim back in my LG Optimus One (a very midrange phone) ... but heck, I can do a lot more with it ...
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I am coming from WM 6.5 and its an utter let down and nothing but regrets..
following are some apps which dosent need any further API release, nor any hardware shortcoming:
A 'decent' wallet app. (code wallet pro)
A decent agenda and appointments app (pocket informant)
A call monitoring app, calculating PEAK/offpeak/weekend minutes (phone dashboard) Basic call times is missing from call history.
An application to send SMS on particular time and date, like a SMS scheduler.
SMS backup application.
A Data monitor to calculate how much 3G/WIFI data I am using, weekly/daily/monthly/yearly.
A call/SMS blocker.
Audio recorder to record incoming/outgoing calls automatically. (resco audio recorder)
Last good game which lasted more than one day from start to finish was on 5/18/11: plant vs. zombies. You dont need APIs to make a good nor is their any hardware limitation. There were games in begining but now its just pathetic.. COLLAPSE? Burn the Rope? I mean seriously.. Why we still call it a 'smartphone' with dumb games like that?
All the apps right now are so basic.. and all the 'mango' updates have been equally basic. I guess mango was all about flipping that tile to show other side.. thats it.. we got the flipping tile.. NOW WHAT? WTF can I do more with this phone than just stare at that flipping tile??

Quality apps take time to make. MS did give a decent window to prepare apps, and Kinsoft apps was able to get their apps updated, but we only enabled fast resume - the easiest Mango feature to add. Some of these other features/API's take more time to add or even require a ground-up approach. So give it time.

Wp7 is new. You knew what you were getting yourself into when you bought into the platform.
WP7 won't be perfect overnight. Takes time. If you don't have the patience or certain features are as vital to you as oxygen then by all means sell your wp7 and jump to the flourishing app store of iOS or Android.
Sent from my HTC HD7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App