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Hi,
I'd like to create a App which I want to unlock with a NFC based smart card like a Mifare SmartMX or DESfire. So the user needs the card to do certain stuff within the application.
After the smart card is programmed with "java card" for example, is it possible to communicate with android? Is android even possible to deal with the cryptosystems?
Has anybody tried that before or knows something about it?
Thanks very much for ur help..
At the moment I'm using a galaxy nexus with android 4.0.4
cheers
-eiMer
I know NFC TagInfo ( play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=at.mroland.android.apps.nfctaginfo&hl=en ) is able to communicate with Desfire card (among with a lot of other kinds).
It can even read the secured data if it is given the correct keys.
The android SDK provides classes to handle Mifare Classic card but not Desfire AFAIK. I don't know if the used an external Desfire library or if they implemented the whole protocol by themselves (it seems to be a very big research group - founded by NXP - so they might have) but it is definitely possible to use Desfire cards with Android.
Thanks for your help.
Ill try to find out how they managed the communication.
If I get some results Ill post them here.
eiMer said:
After the smart card is programmed with "java card" for example, is it possible to communicate with android?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Smartcards and also DESFire communicate using the ISO14443-4 transmission protocol (also known as ISO-DEP). Android provides the class IsoDep to communicate with these cards. Depending on the card, you would then exchange either ISO7816-4 APDU commands (e.g. with your JavaCard applet or with the DESFire card in ISO 7816-4 framing mode) or proprietary commands (e.g. with DESFire native command set).
eiMer said:
Is android even possible to deal with the cryptosystems?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Android API already provides support for a wide range of cipher suites, hash functions ... If that's not sufficient for your type of card, you could also implement your own algorithms.
Gildas35 said:
I know NFC TagInfo is able to communicate with Desfire card (among with a lot of other kinds).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Correct. I've implemented support for DESFire. For the moment, however, only authentication with the default key (DES, all zeros) is supported.
Gildas35 said:
The android SDK provides classes to handle Mifare Classic card but not Desfire AFAIK. I don't know if the used an external Desfire library or if they implemented the whole protocol by themselves (it seems to be a very big research group - founded by NXP - so they might have) but it is definitely possible to use Desfire cards with Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've implemented the protocol myself (on top of the IsoDep class). The original DESFire protocol is pretty straight forward and there's lots of help on the web. When it comes to the EV1 extensions (improved cryptography) things get a bit more difficult.
br
Michael
Does the One X have NFC card emulation enabled?
Well, does it?
No. In the future it might be possible that a custom kernel and rom might be able to crack it. However at present card emulation does not work on any android phone. It has something to do with google restricting access to the secure element.
ozaghloul said:
No. In the future it might be possible that a custom kernel and rom might be able to crack it. However at present card emulation does not work on any android phone. It has something to do with google restricting access to the secure element.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Access to the SE and card emulation are two different things entirely. The SE in only used for payment info. Given proper API support the SE is not needed to emulate a standard NFC card (like access cards).
What that being said, card emulation is not exposed in the API itself. Based on some comments made by Google I wouldn't expect it to be exposed any time soon either. They have moved forward leveraging NDEF push for transmitting data from a device to another device via NFC.
Hello there,
is it possible to use my HTC One X as an NFC Tag?
My goal is to scan a normal NFC Tag (1k) with my phone and store the informations. And then I'll provide this informations with my phone, so an other NFC Reader can read the informations stored on my phone.
Greetz
It is possible as the NXP chip most likely used by the HTC (and known to be in Nexus S/galaxy) can be put into card emulation mode but the current kernel does not support it. There has been at least one user that has gotten it to work on the Nexus S.
Nightskill said:
Hello there,
is it possible to use my HTC One X as an NFC Tag?
My goal is to scan a normal NFC Tag (1k) with my phone and store the informations. And then I'll provide this informations with my phone, so an other NFC Reader can read the informations stored on my phone.
Greetz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi i believe NFC ReTag will do the trick , or at Least NFC TagReader , can also be use as ask … but that will depend on what you will store in … as you didn’t say it ican’r help you more at this stage.
hope that help
Nightskill said:
Hello there,
is it possible to use my HTC One X as an NFC Tag?
My goal is to scan a normal NFC Tag (1k) with my phone and store the informations. And then I'll provide this informations with my phone, so an other NFC Reader can read the informations stored on my phone.
Greetz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd really like to do the same thing.. but haven't had any success in finding a way to do that. I would personally love to scan my work badge and use my phone instead of my badge which I commonly leave at home. It would also be great for hotels where I commonly lose my hotel key and could instead use my phone.
Any advice on these being a possibility. Any additional information I need to provide. I personally have the HTC EVO 4G LTE and my wife has the Nexus S 4G that I could use.
card emulation
try NFClassic.apk its in the android market, i cannot confirm it works but it appears to and i will test it tomorrow, it recognises my work card it picks up 2 tags, one will be door access and the other is canteen credit, (the app doesnt tell you this, but i know there 2 parts to the card, as i recently cancelled a card then found it, and can no longer access doors with it, but can still use it in the canteen) anyway the app reads the card and asks if you want to save the info, save it, the you will see it under saved tags click the tag, and click share tag, it then appears to emulate the tag as a card so it can be read by a nfc card reader, but i dont have a reader to confirm this, but i will try it tomorrow night at work to see if the doors accept it, ill let you know my results
and if anyone else know of any apps that can definatley emulate cards on galaxy s 3 let me know ! the more software i can try at work the more likely ill find one that works, i only got my s3 yesterday and have been of work so havnt tested any app, but NFClassic is the only one that appears to emulate my card.
note the app cannot write cards, only has options to write contact to card but when tried it force closes. i would definatly like to be able to write to card if at all possible ( free lunch copy card when it has credit , when run out of credit, re-write info = credit again its gotta be possible somehow ! )
okz19 said:
try NFClassic.apk its in the android market, i cannot confirm it works but it appears to and i will test it tomorrow, it recognises my work card it picks up 2 tags, one will be door access and the other is canteen credit, (the app doesnt tell you this, but i know there 2 parts to the card, as i recently cancelled a card then found it, and can no longer access doors with it, but can still use it in the canteen) anyway the app reads the card and asks if you want to save the info, save it, the you will see it under saved tags click the tag, and click share tag, it then appears to emulate the tag as a card so it can be read by a nfc card reader, but i dont have a reader to confirm this, but i will try it tomorrow night at work to see if the doors accept it, ill let you know my results
and if anyone else know of any apps that can definatley emulate cards on galaxy s 3 let me know ! the more software i can try at work the more likely ill find one that works, i only got my s3 yesterday and have been of work so havnt tested any app, but NFClassic is the only one that appears to emulate my card.
note the app cannot write cards, only has options to write contact to card but when tried it force closes. i would definatly like to be able to write to card if at all possible ( free lunch copy card when it has credit , when run out of credit, re-write info = credit again its gotta be possible somehow ! )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can try, but it's probably not going to work.
Bardamuz said:
Hi i believe NFC ReTag will do the trick , or at Least NFC TagReader , can also be use as ask … but that will depend on what you will store in … as you didn’t say it ican’r help you more at this stage.
hope that help
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
NFC ReTag can´t do that ... but a lot of other cool stuff
I tried nfclassic and that didn't work I'm also looking for NFC card emulation
I'm not sure about other phones but Evo4GLTE's have Android beam that should do what is wanted
This didn't even occur to me til I saw this thread. I will be trying with my work badge since I occasionally forget mine as well...
I am still deciding between getting the S3 and the EVO 4G LTE. Leaning towards evo... but haven't played with the s3 yet.
I don't have your HTC, although there's documented info for the nexus s where devs were successful in emulating mifare most of the code is still on dev android. Its not full reigns of emulation but depending on your level of tech you can do some pretty cool stuff. I don't know how far this has gone but I remember people getting some functionality on new galaxy. Check out the link.
http://techshek4u.blogspot.com/2012/01/applying-card-emulation-patch-to_03.html
How does google wallet do it? Doesn't that emulate a secure card?
Sent from my GT-I9300 using xda premium
Zanith said:
How does google wallet do it? Doesn't that emulate a secure card?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was thinking the same thing!
The most "advanced" operations that i was able to do with the Galaxy Nexus were saving actions with differents cards. But that's all.
By the way, i use NFC ReTag to achieve it.
What I was just referring to was emulation how I perceived the op was looking for. Example you use a card at work to open a door and wanted to emulate that so you could use your phone instead. However with gwallet or say paywave then you'd need to have the secure key which obviously wouldn't just be given out otherwise you would be able to emulate anyone's card. Hence the secure element. Then it would be ridiculously insecure. Ex. If I took a friends paywave and was able to emulate it then now I in theory just stole their credit card . It's also why gwallet won't work without a secure element like on my sgs2.
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium
WOW interesting topic
Nizda1 said:
I don't have your HTC, although there's documented info for the nexus s where devs were successful in emulating mifare most of the code is still on dev android. Its not full reigns of emulation but depending on your level of tech you can do some pretty cool stuff. I don't know how far this has gone but I remember people getting some functionality on new galaxy. Check out the link.
http://techshek4u.blogspot.com/2012/01/applying-card-emulation-patch-to_03.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
anyone trythis
ive seen the video after flashing and kinda dissapointed
bcos they cannot prove that nexus s can be the nfc tag anyway they donk have the reader too to test it
Hmmm...
Hey guys.. i went searching in the marketplace for an app that does just that (emulate a RFID)...
And... I FOUND ONE!It's called NFC Classic Tag Reader
It was able to read my cards and apparently emulate it but i have no idea if it works cause my door does not detect it... and i have no other NFC devices...
I'm using a SHS-5120 door lock... and that only registers the serial no of the tags programmed and allows only those to enter...
Read on the comments that ICS users are not getting it to work but previous 2.3.3 user reviewed that it was working like a charm...
Oh and i'm using a S3... which of course is ICS...
I reckoned Google Wallet will store something into the mobile NFC chip. Make the phone like a RFID card or tag.
I also noticed some Korean telecom operators has their apps integrated on the Android phones which have the Membership card, Voucher, Credit card etc. functionality. That means the NFC enabled phone can be acted as RFID card or tag.
Is there anyone know where we can find the source code sample from Google development website we could look into this kind of project?
We have HID sensors on doors at work as well as a clocking in system and both use different cards so I'm going to have a go with them on Monday with my SGS3.
SimonCraddock said:
We have HID sensors on doors at work as well as a clocking in system and both use different cards so I'm going to have a go with them on Monday with my SGS3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
any luck with doors?
Anyone any luck with being able to push/publish his phone as a card? Like for instance with doors?
We have Mifare Classic cards which open doors, reading the card isn't a problem, but being able to emulate your phone as a card has proven to be more difficult..
How does one turn his phone into 'beacon mode' (being able to receive the door's power boost and return card info) ?
Just read this article
http://global.samsungtomorrow.com/?p=16659
The interesting thing is that they must have been using the hidden API to be able to use card emulation.
From my experience with hotel nfc cards they often are Mifare UltraLight cards.
Maybe they are giving out special phones using a custom ROM made by samsung that has this enabled.
I'm currently checking the 4.1 sources to see if anything can be done with that.
So what do you guys think about this? If someone with access to this phone could dump the rom it could be easily checked with the current S3 and see the diff.
This is interesting but I think we will have to wait. The article says only 40 VIPs will get it to start, the odds of any of them dumping the the ROM is slim to none.
Fredro said:
Just read this article
http://global.samsungtomorrow.com/?p=16659
The interesting thing is that they must have been using the hidden API to be able to use card emulation.
From my experience with hotel nfc cards they often are Mifare UltraLight cards.
Maybe they are giving out special phones using a custom ROM made by samsung that has this enabled.
I'm currently checking the 4.1 sources to see if anything can be done with that.
So what do you guys think about this? If someone with access to this phone could dump the rom it could be easily checked with the current S3 and see the diff.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They have the Holiday Inn app on their phone, as shown on Engadget. I think there are already apps that let you copy NFC card data to your phone.
Product F(RED) said:
They have the Holiday Inn app on their phone, as shown on Engadget. I think there are already apps that let you copy NFC card data to your phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed copying the card is no problem, though it's the ability to use the phone to emulate the card that is interesting
Fredro said:
Indeed copying the card is no problem, though it's the ability to use the phone to emulate the card that is interesting
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All it does is transmit what was copied on the card via NFC. But in my experience most hotels don't use NFC yet; they still use magnetic strip cards, which by the way can still be easily copied. Just because they're encrypted doesn't mean you can't just copy the raw encrypted data to another card. Check this out:
Product F(RED) said:
All it does is transmit what was copied on the card via NFC. But in my experience most hotels don't use NFC yet; they still use magnetic strip cards, which by the way can still be easily copied. Just because they're encrypted doesn't mean you can't just copy the raw encrypted data to another card. Check this out:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been to several new hotels which indeed use NFC Ultralight cards.
I'm saying that, to be able to use this data you've copied from a card onto your phone, you need to be able to make the phone emulate the same card as the one you copied from. And that is the interesting part.
I'm working on a patch for 4.1.1 (galaxy nexus) that will enable this option, same as the phones used at this olympic hotel.
Google Wallet works in the same way, doesn't it? Card emulation is built into Android, but for an application (like Google Wallet) to use it, it must hold the access keys to the secure element.
Samsung controls the secure element in the S3; writing an application that can access the secure element is no problem for them.
Also, someone above said something about just copying the 'raw data' from an 'encrypted' card. You'll need access keys to access the data stored in each sector, so I doubt that would work.
LoveNFC said:
Google Wallet works in the same way, doesn't it? Card emulation is built into Android, but for an application (like Google Wallet) to use it, it must hold the access keys to the secure element.
Samsung controls the secure element in the S3; writing an application that can access the secure element is no problem for them.
Also, someone above said something about just copying the 'raw data' from an 'encrypted' card. You'll need access keys to access the data stored in each sector, so I doubt that would work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, it's correct that samsung has control over who has access to it, but it's easy to "add yourself" if you patch the software.
About the keys for each sector, this is no problem because the ultralight cards dont use any encryption, even for the classic cards the protection is broken. So this doesn't really matter, the point is that people should be able to create their own cards inside the phone for their own usage for example.
Fredro said:
I've been to several new hotels which indeed use NFC Ultralight cards.
I'm saying that, to be able to use this data you've copied from a card onto your phone, you need to be able to make the phone emulate the same card as the one you copied from. And that is the interesting part.
I'm working on a patch for 4.1.1 (galaxy nexus) that will enable this option, same as the phones used at this olympic hotel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please kindly let me know if you succeed in patching the galaxy nexus, as I really want to use my phone as a nfc to open my building entrance door!
any. outhosur
Fredro said:
yes, it's correct that samsung has control over who has access to it, but it's easy to "add yourself" if you patch the software.
About the keys for each sector, this is no problem because the ultralight cards dont use any encryption, even for the classic cards the protection is broken. So this doesn't really matter, the point is that people should be able to create their own cards inside the phone for their own usage for example.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sometimes I totally no idea why RFID card or NFC tag emulation so complicated.
fordiy said:
Sometimes I totally no idea why RFID card or NFC tag emulation so complicated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cuz of the thousands of geezers who wanna abuse cards or nfs tags
LoveNFC said:
Also, someone above said something about just copying the 'raw data' from an 'encrypted' card. You'll need access keys to access the data stored in each sector, so I doubt that would work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've succesfully copied and cracked a Mifare classic card, thus accessing all the data in the sectors. It took me just over 10 minutes for a single card. But my interest is also, how can I put this card dump file on my phone and let the NFC chip push/emulate this card dump as a Mifare card?
See also http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1706057
Is there any reason it has to be your phone? Could you write the info to a mifare tag, and get the same effect? This would allow you to clone the card to a paper sticker.
sysadmn said:
Is there any reason it has to be your phone? Could you write the info to a mifare tag, and get the same effect? This would allow you to clone the card to a paper sticker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Problem is that you can't change the ID of the card. Most applications check (only) for the ID as it is (falsely) seen by many as unique and unspoofable. So an card emulator able to let you change the ID as handy as a smartphone would be really really nice
nookieman said:
The Problem is that you can't change the ID of the card. Most applications check (only) for the ID as it is (falsely) seen by many as unique and unspoofable. So an card emulator able to let you change the ID as handy as a smartphone would be really really nice
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But this feature is normally not accessible in the phones - partly also because of these reasons.
You would have to obtain keys to the ecure element from the operator or the handset manufacturer and will surely not give it to you if you are not a bank or someone of a similar size
---------- Post added at 02:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:32 PM ----------
Perhaps you could also try to use an unofficial ROM, but I am not sure if that solves the problem
In order to emulate MIFARE Ultralight, you need the first UID byte = 0x04. NXP Semiconductors have introduced a restriction in their interface chips such that UID0 is hardwired to 0x08, meaning "random UID" according to their specifications. So even if hidden Android API get released, it will still not be possible to use the phone itself for MIFARE Ultralight tag emulation. However, EMUTAG emulator on emutag.com totally solves the problem by being portable, and can emulate any UID with almost no restrictions* (see Manual).
yeah its right.. i agree with you
From http://developer.android.com/about/versions/kitkat.html#44-hce
New NFC capabilities through Host Card Emulation
Android 4.4 introduces new platform support for secure NFC-based transactions through Host Card Emulation (HCE), for payments, loyalty programs, card access, transit passes, and other custom services. With HCE, any app on an Android device can emulate an NFC smart card, letting users tap to initiate transactions with an app of their choice — no provisioned secure element (SE) in the device is needed. Apps can also use a new Reader Mode to act as readers for HCE cards and other NFC-based transactions.
Android HCE emulates ISO/IEC 7816 based smart cards that use the contactless ISO/IEC 14443-4 (ISO-DEP) protocol for transmission. These cards are used by many systems today, including the existing EMVCO NFC payment infrastructure. Android uses Application Identifiers (AIDs) as defined in ISO/IEC 7816-4 as the basis for routing transactions to the correct Android applications.
Apps declare the AIDs they support in their manifest files, along with a category identifier that indicates the type of support available (for example, "payments"). In cases where multiple apps support the same AID in the same category, Android displays a dialog that lets the user choose which app to use.
When the user taps to pay at a point-of-sale terminal, the system extracts the preferred AID and routes the transaction to the correct application. The app reads the transaction data and can use any local or network-based services to verify and then complete the transaction.
Android HCE requires an NFC controller to be present in the device. Support for HCE is already widely available on most NFC controllers, which offer dynamic support for both HCE and SE transactions. Android 4.4 devices that support NFC will include Tap & Pay for easy payments using HCE.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Shouldn't this mean devices like the nexus 7 (2013) without a secure element should be able use Google wallet for NFC payments? I heard somewhere that the nexus 5 uses the same chip as the nexus 7 (2013)
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium
Big_Red77 said:
Shouldn't this mean devices like the nexus 7 (2013) without a secure element should be able use Google wallet for NFC payments? I heard somewhere that the nexus 5 uses the same chip as the nexus 7 (2013)
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It does indeed.
What about the AT&T HTC One?
From some general research I did earlier this year with NFC being used for contactless payments, there were three different means of implementation; a) the Secure Element on the NFC chipset itself (Google Wallet), b) The secure element on the SIM card with a SWP link (used by ISIS Mobile wallet) and c) Secure Element Emulation via the cloud (Simply Tapp)
for a) the problem dealt with the fact that for some reason(s) three of the four major United States Cellular Carriers (AT&T, T-Mobile and Verizon) would not provide Google with the required TSM (Trusted service management) credentials to access the protected memory of the secure element. It was suggested that because of the time invested prior to actual availability, the above carriers elected to adopt their own standard to implementing the secure element.
for b) The sim cards used by GSM carriers were developed with the secure element onboard. The problem that was experienced dealt with the limited availability of special sim cards (only two markets had them, Salt Lake City and Austin) as well as the poor support and backbone to the system, leaving most users calling foul on the carriers abuse of power (a personal attempt at contacting the FTC about a possible obligopy resulted in that is not).
the concept of c) was approached by Doug Yeager and Ted Fifelski, both of whom are more than knowledgeable with the POS and NFC markets. Instead of requiring the secure element hardware on the device, emulate it by using the cloud. As previously mentioned the libraries in the Android operating system did not include smart/host card emulation. Doug Yeager then created and had merged into the CyangenmodRom builds 9.1 + the open source IsoPCDA and IsoPCDB libraries.
Looking up on NFC World, Google collaborated with Simply Tapp to officially bring HCE into the 4.4 http://www.nfcworld.com/2013/10/31/326619/google-gets-around-carriers-host-card-emulation-nfc-payments/
Does this mean I can, with the proper app and so on, "emulate" NFC tags (or at least some types of NFC tags/cards)? Does anyone plan on making an app to do just this...'record' and 'emulate' nfc tags/cards of supported types (not just 'credit cards')?
TjPhysicist said:
Does this mean I can, with the proper app and so on, "emulate" NFC tags (or at least some types of NFC tags/cards)? Does anyone plan on making an app to do just this...'record' and 'emulate' nfc tags/cards of supported types (not just 'credit cards')?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is what I was wondering as well... tried endlessly searching apps or even figuring out how to do it on my own.Everything was a dead-end, always returning to that damned secure element. Does anyone know if there's any hope?
TjPhysicist said:
Does this mean I can, with the proper app and so on, "emulate" NFC tags (or at least some types of NFC tags/cards)? Does anyone plan on making an app to do just this...'record' and 'emulate' nfc tags/cards of supported types (not just 'credit cards')?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 for TJ's question, I'd love to ditch the corporate RFID tag and use my phone. I mean if it's really going to be a wallet replacement, that's one of the things in my wallet.
TjPhysicist said:
Does this mean I can, with the proper app and so on, "emulate" NFC tags (or at least some types of NFC tags/cards)? Does anyone plan on making an app to do just this...'record' and 'emulate' nfc tags/cards of supported types (not just 'credit cards')?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya I'm wondering that same. My senior project is due in 3 weeks and I build a "door unlocker" based off NFC tags. The NFC shield on an Arduino reads a tag and unlocks a door. I have a Nexus 5 and would love to be able to emulate a tag and use it to open a door.
Android 4.4 NFC HCE demo app
Please have a look at this article: blog.opendatalab.de/hack/2013/11/07/android-host-card-emulation-with-acr122/
An Android sample project that use NFC HCE is available here: github.com/grundid/host-card-emulation-sample
Any updates for this? Really looking forward to using my phone as a replacement for transit cards.
Bump? I would really like an emulation app.
TjPhysicist said:
Does this mean I can, with the proper app and so on, "emulate" NFC tags (or at least some types of NFC tags/cards)? Does anyone plan on making an app to do just this...'record' and 'emulate' nfc tags/cards of supported types (not just 'credit cards')?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Host card emulation is not to emulate NFC tags but make payment through NFC possible with Google Wallet even without a secure element chip. The devices technically could be a NFC tags (think about it, android beam can go both directions so the device beams to the other devices which acts KIND of like a tag).
NFC tags are cheap anyway so what's the need to try to emulate them? You can program them from the phone.
tiny4579 said:
Host card emulation is not to emulate NFC tags but make payment through NFC possible with Google Wallet even without a secure element chip. The devices technically could be a NFC tags (think about it, android beam can go both directions so the device beams to the other devices which acts KIND of like a tag).
NFC tags are cheap anyway so what's the need to try to emulate them? You can program them from the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought hce allows for the phone to emulate a NFC card, for example, a transit card.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
Sfkn2 said:
I thought hce allows for the phone to emulate a NFC card, for example, a transit card.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's for payments strictly. It emulates a payment card and I think the android implementation is strictly for Google wallet. I'm not sure the transit systems would use Google wallet or not. Maybe they do.
tiny4579 said:
It's for payments strictly. It emulates a payment card and I think the android implementation is strictly for Google wallet. I'm not sure the transit systems would use Google wallet or not. Maybe they do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, KitKat "supports emulating cards that are based on the NFC-Forum ISO-DEP specification (based on ISO/IEC 14443-4)...". This is a standard for Identification cards used for payments but also could be used for other use cases. Android 4.4 also supports different HCE service groups "Category_PAYMENT" and "Category_OTHER" , so I wouldn´t say it´s strictly for payments! (Although, I think, your right, that´s the main purpose Google had in mind by implementing this emulation feature ...)
Doesn´t mean that you could "clone" your (or your neighbors) company badge or transit card and use your android device instead, but that´s a completely different story.
-Psycho- said:
This is what I was wondering as well... tried endlessly searching apps or even figuring out how to do it on my own.Everything was a dead-end, always returning to that damned secure element. Does anyone know if there's any hope?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No hope, secure elements are secure by design. You can't download them wihout hacking the card. In most cases, this is just as complicated as hacking into someone's bank account.
Sorry but that is the reason why we trust these cards in the first place.
ascsa said:
Doesn´t mean that you could "clone" your (or your neighbors) company badge or transit card and use your android device instead, but that´s a completely different story.
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Although that would be awesome..
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Stupid question, but if the secure element isn't necessary anmyore, is Google wallet now secure enough?
I mean, Google kind of used this for a reason I presume before, I know why they got rid of it, but is this risky or not? Because I haven't heard people discussing this side yet.
Also, what other payment services may work with this once they support it (if ever), ISIS? Paypass?
Axe Homeless said:
Stupid question, but if the secure element isn't necessary anmyore, is Google wallet now secure enough?
I mean, Google kind of used this for a reason I presume before, I know why they got rid of it, but is this risky or not? Because I haven't heard people discussing this side yet.
Also, what other payment services may work with this once they support it (if ever), ISIS? Paypass?
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Click to collapse
A few months ago, a Google patent application surfaced that explains some details of how they did it.
1) Previously, PIN entry to GW did not require a network connection - it only unlocked the SE. Now, you cannot unlock Wallet without a network connection. Also, PINs used to be device-specific but are now common to all devices on your Wallet account
2) The patent application references creation of a virtual card that is geographically and time-restricted
So pretty much, I think what happens is that when you unlock Wallet now, it creates a "virtual" card that is restricted to the unlock timeout in time and to some sort of geographic limitations.