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Source: http://m.intomobile.com/2012/06/18/samsungs-new-ceo-talks-develping-its-own-mobile-software/
Samsung developing its own Sortware and leaving Android success behind? Although I doubt it and this article is probably about TW refresh but the idea of Samsung software will personally keep me away. To me Samsung is a sexy hardware but it's own implementation of TW etc drives me nuts. Say Samsung does abandon Android, I personally will say Goodbye, how about you? Imagine sexy software but no Android... Will you stick with Samsung?
Samsung must be mistaken to have me follow their TW or anything even better.
They've tried this multiple times most recently with Bada...for Samsung Android is just a way to gain money while behind scenes they create a better one or thats what they think
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From what I read about the interview the high end phones will still be android and they were improving on tw read the engadget article about this and then click the source
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I agree, Samsung makes one sexy piece of hardware. However, I too will part ways if they decide to leave Android for their own OS.
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w.e I'm not a fan boy of a manufacturer. I'll just jump to HTC or moto or lg
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locoboi187 said:
w.e I'm not a fan boy of a manufacturer. I'll just jump to HTC or moto or lg
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All except moto...I don't find their phones attractive
A lot of manufacturers seem to have "Apple Envy". They see what Apple did with the iPhone and think they can re-produce it. It takes someone really good at stealing stuff and reselling it as your own to be Apple. I don't think many other companies could do it.
Or, you could go the Microsoft route and just license the hell out of everything.
Samsung is a beast.....everything in my house is Samsung ... If they wanna leave Android and do their own thing...I say go for it, they been setting back watching how Android been doin things and taking things over..now its time for Samsung to bring out the guns and strike...They have been planning this for a while...it was just a matter of time
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us....sent from my bad ass E4GT
Shadow_God said:
Samsung is a beast.....everything in my house is Samsung ... If they wanna leave Android and do their own thing...I say go for it, they been setting back watching how Android been doin things and taking things over..now its time for Samsung to bring out the guns and strike...They have been planning this for a while...it was just a matter of time
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us....sent from my bad ass E4GT
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My personal experience with Samsung = LoS, ICS almost 1 year later and still no go. TW, well I'm sure someone loves it, just not me.
Say Samsung does go off route, I think Sharp will come out striking lol. And the app market, lets start the count from 1+ lol
Samsung without Android... Hell NO!
Webos
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Alex1x said:
My personal experience with Samsung = LoS, ICS almost 1 year later and still no go. TW, well I'm sure someone loves it, just not me.
Say Samsung does go off route, I think Sharp will come out striking lol. And the app market, lets start the count from 1+ lol
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I'm not a fan of TW either but its easy to get rid of...some UI out that isn't that easy and will still run in the background if you like it or not.....Samsung pushes the button of technology.....smart TV (hello Samsung), blue led fridge, the do everything washer/dryer....lol...I know the need to work on the software portion....but I not gonna drop them cuz they wanna do it all themselves...I'm sure you can root it and someone will figure out to put the market back on and stuff just like they did with the Kindle Fire...let em try, you never know they could surprise you
What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us....sent from my bad ass E4GT
if they do i hope they will still make android phones. i personally like the match with samsung and android. makes me even more of a fan boy i suppose, but i guess im just a android guy, i just think samsung is the only competitor big enough for apple. plus i love the fact that when i pull out my samsung phone around apple people they start bashing me, then i let them know a little info, they shut up real quick. but i hope they dont move all phones over to whatever theyre gonna call this os.
If it will be better than Android, why not?
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no android no samsung
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Look at what's happened in the past 6 months alone:
1) Google closed on Motorola Mobility (right here in my backyard) - meaning Motorola is out of the mobile biz if I understand correctly. To do it Google had to promise to keep Android open for 5 more years... and I doubt it will be much longer than that for newer versions.
2) Microsoft is launching their own tablet - a big shift in things because they're adopting the idea that controlling the hw and sw sides will end up with a better product - and in general is right (so long as the dev support is there)
So if this is the model being taken - give a generic version (at a fee) for manufacturers who want it but keep the best completely in house - then Samsung has 5 years to really work on that before they'd have to even think about departing from Android on any devices. My guess is this would be on low end devices first to potentially avoid licensing fees for Android in the future - but time will tell.
But hey, this is all speculation and a lot changes every year - I'll just wait and see for now.
i hope android never goes close and restricted
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Whole new OS?
Of course we'd all ditch it.
If it's not open-source.
Unless they can unveil it with some sort of 'cant-live-without' features package.
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I don't see another OS getting huge developer support.
I'm sure the Galaxy name will help them sell but once consumers learn it doesn't have all the same apps it will flop.
garwynn said:
Look at what's happened in the past 6 months alone:
1) Google closed on Motorola Mobility (right here in my backyard) - meaning Motorola is out of the mobile biz if I understand correctly. To do it Google had to promise to keep Android open for 5 more years... and I doubt it will be much longer than that for newer versions.
2) Microsoft is launching their own tablet - a big shift in things because they're adopting the idea that controlling the hw and sw sides will end up with a better product - and in general is right (so long as the dev support is there)
So if this is the model being taken - give a generic version (at a fee) for manufacturers who want it but keep the best completely in house - then Samsung has 5 years to really work on that before they'd have to even think about departing from Android on any devices. My guess is this would be on low end devices first to potentially avoid licensing fees for Android in the future - but time will tell.
But hey, this is all speculation and a lot changes every year - I'll just wait and see for now.
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Sweet. Now my Friend can shut up about how his moto X2 is better then my Epic touch. Even stock, we all know who's is better.
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I got a new red s3 a few days ago and other than not being able to check for ot updates, I really like it. However, I have one big concern that has me wondering if maybe I should swap it out for a One X ($79.88 at wal mart). If Apple ends up winning the court case against Samsung, what will happen as far as future updates/upgrades/support? If Apple wins, apparently th s3 will be banned from future sales. And since they have already taken the local search function away, what other features are we likely to lose just to appease Apple?
Samsung and Apple will battle in court for the foreseeable future. The sgiii isn't going to get barred from being sold, at least not for any significant amount of time.
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I got mine
Apple already put a stop to sales of one of Samsung's tablets. The s3 is next on their list. But I already have one so that part doesn't concern me. What does concern me is support for the s3 if Samsung is banned from selling it. It is hard to imagine them supporting a product that they can't sell. Plus, if the software is also banned (local search), will they even be able to support it if they want to?
Umm they really don't have anything to go after the SGS3 for. It is not rectangular, it does not have uniform corners, and TouchWiz does not look like iOS, so what could the possible ban it for?
I know
I feel the same way. But you know how it is. I couldn't believe that Samsung took away the local search but they did. Apparently, pretty much everything from the icons to the touch screen is copied from Apple. But the s3 with its physical home button is the first Android powered phone to outsell the iPhone. Therefore it must go. Like I said, Apple got the Nexus tablet banned because it was too much like the iPad. I just don't want to be stuck with a phone that is constantly being stripped down bit by bit or completely removed from the market and nit supported at all. It's funny, though. The Apple TV sure looks like a Samsung to me. I wonder if Samsung will sue Apple?
Becouse they are afraid of the sgs3...
sent from my galaxy far far away...
lordjan1986 said:
Becouse they are afraid of the sgs3...
sent from my galaxy far far away...
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With good reason.
Sweet we will be only ones with s3. lol. It won't happen.
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catchesbass said:
I got a new red s3 a few days ago and other than not being able to check for ot updates, I really like it. However, I have one big concern that has me wondering if maybe I should swap it out for a One X ($79.88 at wal mart). If Apple ends up winning the court case against Samsung, what will happen as far as future updates/upgrades/support? If Apple wins, apparently th s3 will be banned from future sales. And since they have already taken the local search function away, what other features are we likely to lose just to appease Apple?
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You are on xda, you shouldnt worry about that. Devs here will do everything to add features back. atleast the common sense ones.
Even if something as far-fetched as banning the S3 does occur, I doubt that they would simply just stop supporting a device that sold over 10 million units.
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I mean really, Apple does not have nothing to stop the SGS3. The phone was designed to avoid being stopped by Apple. and even then, if they try to stop it via software, they cant, because all it takes is a software patch. hence the Galaxy Nexus.
When it comes down to it, Apple is scared. Android is light years better and they know it. They know that Google made an OS to rival theirs and did it better. So, if you can't beat the competition, then sue (sp.) their butt off! Apple will ALWAYS be a fanboy market...meaning all the die-hard robots that will do/buy whatever Apple tells them too. Meanwhile, Google will keep innovating and making their mobile OS truely the best on the market today.
ahh the beauty of living in canada us patents dont apply here! yippee! never have to worry about any of these stupid lawsuits. :good:
though even if they win, they cant really touch the sgs iii, apple is mainly targeting older samsung phones which imo did blatantly copy apple (talking about like the galaxy s originaly) , they have changed a lot since those days. id be surprised if they had any dirt on the siii.
They are scared of Samsung itself. They know that Samsung copied the iPhone, and lets be honest here, they copied the dam iPhone, but they produced a product a million times better than the iPhone.
Samsung has some great technology, which is why its one of Apple's "Key Partners". I have owned three Samsung devices in the last year and they all were really good. Samsung has what it takes, but it is being limited by Apple. Why do you think the SGS3 is so ugly looking? To avoid Apple and its lawsuits.
J Prime said:
They are scared of Samsung itself. They know that Samsung copied the iPhone, and lets be honest here, they copied the dam iPhone, but they produced a product a million times better than the iPhone.
Samsung has some great technology, which is why its one of Apple's "Key Partners". I have owned three Samsung devices in the last year and they all were really good. Samsung has what it takes, but it is being limited by Apple. Why do you think the SGS3 is so ugly looking? To avoid Apple and its lawsuits.
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Looks better than the HTC X and the iPhone itself.
Apple deserves to win this case. Look at the points and cases they are bringing up against the Galaxy S 1. The UI was completely ripped off of them. In addition, Samsung's lawyers are a bunch of jackasses in court (read the Verge if you dont know what Im talking about). Now... some of the new patents Apple is getting are utter bull****. I was pissed when they tried to ban the GNex because of the search patent .
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---------- Post added at 06:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:49 AM ----------
megagodx said:
Looks better than the HTC X and the iPhone itself.
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I lol'd. The Galaxy S3 pales in design when comparing it to those two
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Guys you cant ban something that already has tens of millions in the wild. Apple is definitely worried, because Steve only left them so much on his notes he kept and the iphone train is going to run out of steam after the next 2 iphones you mark my words, that is all he left them.
Buy another phone if you want, nothing in life is certain, but I would not worry one minute and use the phone you want now. Its already the best thing out there as is, once JB rolls out its a done deal. They have a removable battery and SD slot, doesnt sound like an iphone clone to me...And who cares if they ban the S1, its a totally different phone and old as hell to boot, it aint gonna happen. They must stop it before its released or it just doesnt work.
catchesbass said:
Apple already put a stop to sales of one of Samsung's tablets. The s3 is next on their list. But I already have one so that part doesn't concern me. What does concern me is support for the s3 if Samsung is banned from selling it. It is hard to imagine them supporting a product that they can't sell. Plus, if the software is also banned (local search), will they even be able to support it if they want to?
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Why do you need support from Samsung? Just root and install custom roms, my old HTC Hero on Telus took over a year to get an update from 1.6 to eclair, but by then I was already running a custom rom.
I didn't mean to start an apple vs Samsung vs one x discussion. Honestly, I am amazed at how far mobile phones have come since I got my first Motorola Star Tac when I was in the military. I am just concerned about the future of my s3 in the event that apple wins in court. That said, I can see where apple is coming from. However, without competition from other manufacturers, there will be very few more advancements in the industry. Especially if every time someone produces a product that may or may not be better than apple, apple sues that company into submission. Imagine how it would be if car companies did the same thing. Or even something as simple as clothes detergent. My concern is not whether or not Samsung "will" support the s3 but whether not they will be able to due to restrictions placed on them by the courts that may prevent them from having the ability to support and improve on the s3
King Shady said:
I lol'd. The Galaxy S3 pales in design when comparing it to those two
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i lol'd at your lol. ur crazy dude
I was just wondering if anyone knows the exact details of how this lawsuit could de-rail the galaxy s3. Is it a possibility that they recall it? Will the jellybean update due in the fall be delayed due to copyright violations? I know its very unlikely that this lawsuit wil get anymore, but what is the worse that could come from this?
Oh yea, by apple doing this makes me about 300% less likely to buy one of their products. You know this company is on the ropes when they are pushing for a judgement for samsung to pull all of its devices off the market.
[email protected] said:
I was just wondering if anyone knows the exact details of how this lawsuit could de-rail the galaxy s3. Is it a possibility that they recall it? Will the jellybean update due in the fall be delayed due to copyright violations? I know its very unlikely that this lawsuit wil get anymore, but what is the worse that could come from this?
Oh yea, by apple doing this makes me about 300% less likely to buy one of their products. You know this company is on the ropes when they are pushing for a judgement for samsung to pull all of its devices off the market.
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I'm not sure about the lawsuit but agree that I would be a LOT less likely to buy any more of their products!
chances are it won't do damn thing to the s3.... possibly future device's.
Sent from Pluto.
It won't do anything for the lifespan of the GS3. Regardless of who wins this week, appeals are surely to be the result that will keep this battle going for a year, at the least. Probably 18 to 24 months. Small inconveniences may occur along the way, kind of like how universal search got dumbed down, but in the end, I think lawmakers are going to have to step in and fix the problem on the books.
Samsung is starting to make chips in the US, so it makes me wonder if Samsung is trying to get some congressional support by claiming that if their phones get locked out of US markets, it'll hurt the US job market. Where Apple products are all manufactured by a foreign work force.
I what would be shocked is if nine people (jury) agree on anything covered in this trial.
Hung jury on most claims for both sides would be my guess but if the jury upholds the 3g claim for Samsung I think Apples gonna wish they wouldnt have started this BS.
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I'll never touch another Apple product for as long as I live. No one should support a company who feels self-entitled to everything and stifles innovation with needless lawsuits. Anybody read that bit in a Steve Job's Bio saying he would go to the end of the world and even thermonuclear war to protect his products and investments? Rediculous lol ..as Bobby Boucher would say, "Apple is the devil!" (waterboy)
Apple is the new Microsoft lol
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[email protected] said:
I was just wondering if anyone knows the exact details of how this lawsuit could de-rail the galaxy s3. Is it a possibility that they recall it? Will the jellybean update due in the fall be delayed due to copyright violations? I know its very unlikely that this lawsuit wil get anymore, but what is the worse that could come from this?
Oh yea, by apple doing this makes me about 300% less likely to buy one of their products. You know this company is on the ropes when they are pushing for a judgement for samsung to pull all of its devices off the market.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nothing will happen to the S3 because that actually wasn't part of this case, the case was for older devices and the galaxy tab, no need to worry for now
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Zero impact
[email protected] said:
I was just wondering if anyone knows the exact details of how this lawsuit could de-rail the galaxy s3. Is it a possibility that they recall it? Will the jellybean update due in the fall be delayed due to copyright violations? I know its very unlikely that this lawsuit wil get anymore, but what is the worse that could come from this?
Oh yea, by apple doing this makes me about 300% less likely to buy one of their products. You know this company is on the ropes when they are pushing for a judgement for samsung to pull all of its devices off the market.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why, because we already have the roms. They will roll out updates I am sure (if they have too) for the UI, but if your rooted and/or not on stock rom -you will have nothing to worry about. GET THE SIII now if you havnt, you might not beable to (highly doubt it).
If I remember correctly apple is suing over the sg3 in december...
The lawsuit ended in Samsung owing Apple 1Billion. But samsung is fighting back claiming not to steal any ideas. Can we ***** slap apple for being a child?
ilostmypistons said:
I what would be shocked is if nine people (jury) agree on anything covered in this trial.
Hung jury on most claims for both sides would be my guess but if the jury upholds the 3g claim for Samsung I think Apples gonna wish they wouldnt have started this BS.
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Click to collapse
Lets be honest, if you own any kind of android, be it samsung or not, you're likely going to be rooting for Samsung's case. And same goes for all those iPhone fan boys and girls out there. So the real problem is.... Will they honestly be able to find 9 people that don't currently own an iPhone or Android phone, and never have in their entire lives? Because that's how the jury should be comprised -- of people having absolutely no opinion about the matter. I'd venture to say that'd be enough to get for a mistrial if the jury weren't made this way.
Long story short nothing will happen. Samsung will just lose some money.. remember Samsung makes more products than apple.
1 billion dollars is a ton of money... even for Samsung. I dont see how they can survive this alone. I suspect many companies will soon team up to keep apple honest with themselves. The days of their reign are ending. Get innovative instead of suing.... its a little more respectable.
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I've had a gs2 and a gs3 all T-mobile. Why is it that we U.S users get done so dirty when it come to updates, fine tuning lol customer service etc etc. We pay as much as the next guy (most of us) for our "high end" phones If apple does do one thing well it's delivering their boring IOS updates to the rest of their devices. I still know people with a galaxy s, and if you think we are going to get a 4.1.2 update before the s4 comes out you are sadly mistaken. If i pay 500 + for a device I at least want it to be relevant for some time. Even the specs of the international why is it we are the mentally challenged little brother. I know each carrier has to add their bloatware and stuff on to the updates but that never even happens.Things need to change call me a crybaby but I work for my money like every one else and am tired of it being a great investment for only 6 months. Do they all want us to go get an iphone before they stop treating us like sheep with wallets. Let me know if i'm wrong or what you think.
What does iOS have to do with US vs Non-US customers ? iOS is made for ONE family of devices, all with the same hardware per iteration and Apple only have to worry about that one family, with is like... what... maybe four different phones being actively supported at this point ?
If OS updates are your priority, get the Nexus 4 or another "nexus" device - then you'll get updates with iOS frequency and support. It depends on what is important to you.
I'd rather have the 2Gb RAM than the quadcore.
Developers do a great job of keeping a phone "alive" and making it even better than stock so I think it's a safe bet that any popular device (like the S3) will have a long "second life" in development even after official updates are no longer pushed.
Reason why I was coating iOS was that international or us you have the same specs as the next guy and they still update their iOS on outdated devices my s3 can't even get an update an we aren't even outdated yet. Yes developers do a lot and I love em, but you can only do so much example multiwindow. Imagine if our u.s developers had a premium suite to play with. They are teasing us showing us what our phone are supposed to be.... There is a diff in thinking you can be better than knowing you can be better. On that note the international s3 just got a 4.2.1 leaked update where is our 4.1.2 official update. Imagine when the devs get a hold of that update.. And ppl think we are going to see key lime pie when we can't even get 4.1.2. Even int s2 can compete with the u.s s3 smh
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Pennycake said:
What does iOS have to do with US vs Non-US customers ? iOS is made for ONE family of devices, all with the same hardware per iteration and Apple only have to worry about that one family, with is like... what... maybe four different phones being actively supported at this point ?
If OS updates are your priority, get the Nexus 4 or another "nexus" device - then you'll get updates with iOS frequency and support. It depends on what is important to you.
I'd rather have the 2Gb RAM than the quadcore.
Developers do a great job of keeping a phone "alive" and making it even better than stock so I think it's a safe bet that any popular device (like the S3) will have a long "second life" in development even after official updates are no longer pushed.
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I think to sum up what the other guy said, id say not a lot of people know about sites like xda , while others who do choose not to root because they are scared to mess up their phone or dont want to deal with it. I do feel his pain that here in the us we dont get as much love as others do that own the intl version. Id say its a pretty sad response to say "get a nexus". 0people get a certain type of phone for a reason. Id love the nexus for the updates but screw tryinf to cradle that thing like a babt bwcause of the glass back and no sd card support. If the sgs line gor frequent updates it would def make it a more killer phone. Samsung really needs to do something about that if they completely want to wipe out the competition. Regulate the us counterparts a kittle better as to bloat and such.
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Like my bro says "Zactly".
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I agree that their should be more updates like other countries... If Google ever officially makes their own phone, that will take care of the problem
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I rooted my devices since I had a s2. Roms are great but name me one ROM that has all the 4.1.2 over the air updates. Roms are truly great when dev's have an official update and they can pimp it out.
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monkeypaws said:
I think to sum up what the other guy said, id say not a lot of people know about sites like xda , while others who do choose not to root because they are scared to mess up their phone or dont want to deal with it. I do feel his pain that here in the us we dont get as much love as others do that own the intl version. Id say its a pretty sad response to say "get a nexus". 0people get a certain type of phone for a reason. Id love the nexus for the updates but screw tryinf to cradle that thing like a babt bwcause of the glass back and no sd card support. If the sgs line gor frequent updates it would def make it a more killer phone. Samsung really needs to do something about that if they completely want to wipe out the competition. Regulate the us counterparts a kittle better as to bloat and such.
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If the OP is arguing that Apple is the ideal, I think a comparison to the current Nexus line is accurate. Lack of choice is one reason for faster updates - Apple doesn't have to implement it's OS with vastly different processors between US and International versions like with the S3. And Samsung makes a TON of different phones. Pros and cons. If a person doesn't want to try custom ROMs, I'd argue that the majority of customers don't even know or really care what Android version they're running. I think "knows what flashing I'd, but too afraid to do it" is a small camp between xda and the average consumer who only cares that the phone "just works".
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But for the ppl that do know what version they are running and the miilions of videos that broadcast and promote specs that go way past the phone just working. Yeah I know u.s and int have diff specs, and what is the valid reason for that because I never seen one. I've been pimping my phone since I had the wing. Tech spec and rom vids are not for people who are satisfied with just a working phone. If all the phones had the same specs and then the carriers make their print it'd be cool.
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Because they bring new phone for new software. And we buy new one because its their policy to sell new phone and they know we will not wait for updates.
Outside US they stick with same phone for years.
bikrame said:
Because they bring new phone for new software. And we buy new one because its their policy to sell new phone and they know we will not wait for updates.
Outside US they stick with same phone for years.
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Yeah, the subsidy model in the USA is growing outdated and I think we're seeing the carriers realise this, albeit slowly. If a person is doing contract service and expects a new phone every 2 years, it's a very different market than if people are paying lower service rates, but buying the phone outright.
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Well ive been flashing roms since the mytouch. Now that I actual have a career and family ibdontbhave hours to backup every text (theyee all business related) and picture ofy daughter, backup apps, etc, flash roms until I find a stable one and then restoew it all. It really does take a minimum of one hour + I finally gotn used to rootbox and rhen started playing a feq games. Complet glitches everywhere. So yes I fall ino the category now of "I jist want it to work the way it is supposed to and not wait for bugs to get squished" . And I dont believe im alone. I jnow there arw loyal crack flashers out there that have no problem doing all thatbstuff and flashing all the roms on this forum. It comes down to time and whats really important. Ive had all the sgs variants for tmobile and feel ive been taken for a complete circle ever year. They hold updates unril the new sgs version comes out then its another 6 months until we get one leak. When the next nexus phone comes out jm jumping ship for sure. Need to get off this wheel.
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Yeah I know there a 2 diff communities of phone users, I'm not a hardcore ROM guy all I'm saying is a 4.1.2 update and hope forbthe fyture of our devices would be nice, even theosy casual of users slowly appreciate updates. My dad is 72 lol he has the s3 he just wanted a phone. And yeah into tally understand on not flashing and wiping too much... Im not a family guy but also don't mind staying on the same rom. Im just complaining about things being thrown in my face and false promises because I could really use premium suite stock......personally.
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I understand your Rant and all the posted for and against, but this could go in the Off Topic thread for further discussion. There are some good people in this thread who know what they are talking about and how to get deep into the OS. I do hope you'll continue the discussion in the OT thread, as I think that there are some valid points to be made.
Thread Closed.
Also, even though this is a rant, you formed it as a Question and put [Q] in the title. Moved to Q&A
So I have a couple general questions I wanted to get your guys take on.
Why does Verizon choose to have there phones locked down? The HTC One in particular but generally as well. Is it a method of preserving/increasing profit? Perceived threat to their network? Something else?
A follow up question which depends on how you feel about the first question. Are Verizon's reasons for locking down phones justified? Do you feel they have a right to do this? If you were a strictly moral person, do you have any dilemmas about this?
PS As a side note, I love having my phones unlocked with custom roms, and I am looking forward to getting my sonic S-Off back.
beardedYoga said:
So I have a couple general questions I wanted to get your guys take on.
Why does Verizon choose to have there phones locked down? The HTC One in particular but generally as well. Is it a method of preserving/increasing profit? Perceived threat to their network? Something else?
A follow up question which depends on how you feel about the first question. Are Verizon's reasons for locking down phones justified? Do you feel they have a right to do this? If you were a strictly moral person, do you have any dilemmas about this?
PS As a side note, I love having my phones unlocked with custom roms, and I am looking forward to getting my sonic S-Off back.
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People screwing up their phones by crack flashing, and returning them to verizon for warranty when bricked.
Control of tethering.
Yeah, they say it's for the reasons above.
But given that, to begin with, the rooting community is a tiny slice of all mobile phone users, and then Verizon users are an even smaller portion of that. So I don't see why they even care. I highly doubt that even if ever single Verizon customer who does rooting messed up their expensive device it would cost Verizon more than .01% of their revenue, if even that.
It's all about quality control. Even if it is the fact that the vast minority root their phones, it's the minority of users who generate the majority of complaints (and that rule extends FAR beyond cell phone rooting, or cell phones in general). It takes 10 good comments to make up for one bad comment these days, and there just aren't enough good comments to go around.
How likely is it, if your unrooted phone has no physical damage that you'll suddenly find that it isn't booting up? How likely is it that, even if you don't want to do it, factory resetting your unrooted phone will fix whatever problem you're having?
Big Red's reputation, their entire brand, is built on reliability. NOT freedom.
beardedYoga said:
So I have a couple general questions I wanted to get your guys take on.
Why does Verizon choose to have there phones locked down? The HTC One in particular but generally as well. Is it a method of preserving/increasing profit? Perceived threat to their network? Something else?
A follow up question which depends on how you feel about the first question. Are Verizon's reasons for locking down phones justified? Do you feel they have a right to do this? If you were a strictly moral person, do you have any dilemmas about this?
PS As a side note, I love having my phones unlocked with custom roms, and I am looking forward to getting my sonic S-Off back.
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Hey guys feel free to elaborate as much as possible. I'm writing a term paper on unlocking bootloaders/s-off, legalities on our part and Verizon, security risk for us/Carrier, risks taken by us/Verizon, etc.. It's for a Information Security Course. I'll be creating a thread at some point but this is a good start for some sources!
Another point would be that Verizon tries to cater to business/enterprise customers so allowing bootloader unlocking could pose a giant security flaw on devices that have classified data and are meant to be secure
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I think it's far less about tethering for free. They fixed that with getting rid of unlimited data. They saw they can make more money on teired data plans with coverages. Plus I am amazed at how many people on here has given up on their unlimited data plans just to get a subsidized phone.
Locked down phones is for more like people who roots and doesn't know what they are doing so they brick their phones and Verizon takes a hit having to replace it under warranty. Plus the security reasons companies are looking for. They don't want a phone that could be hacked in to giving away possible secret info. Last but not least is to keep people from taking their phones and flashing it to another carrier as we seen a few people has done on here and other forums. It's money they are not receiving and they want to put a stop to it.
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I think they do it for tethering. Although you can use foxfi, root tethering is not stoppable unless verizon uses packet sniffing but even so, unlimited data is unlimited data. They also do it for security reasons as unlocking a corporate phone can be bad.
I will admit, I skimmed all posts and see that most everyone has bought into what they want us to believe.
If it is to prevent unwanted warranty claims, then why would they not allow us to willingly void our warranty via HTCdev when we click the box that says so?
Rather then resort to undocumented or traceable ways of doing so in which case they are stuck with more returns for soft bricks, etc,..and are stuck accepting them because they chose to not take the easy way and let us void our warranty to begin with.
I just think all that warranty replacement crap is a bunch of nonsense and can't be their main incentive.
If it is, then they have their heads buried deeper then I thought and need to realize what I just stated above...
A really good friend of mine has been a tech with sprint for nearly a decade. From what he has told me, about 27 of 100 phones they can't fix are due to installing non official software. While that's not the highest percentage with damage as the worst, it still is very costly for them to replace. Most of the guys he works with can tell if a phone has been "tampered" with. Even with such things as triangle away with the Samsung lines, they still can find out. Having a locked boot loader on this phone is just one way of attempting to slow the numbers.
As he would put it, most people who do try flashing and other modification methods have very little experience with the phones and their inner workings. A lot of these people end up bricking their phones and try turning them in for insurance claims or warranty which he deals with. He actually saved me some coin by getting me a screen for one of my s2's from a completely fried emmc that he says someone tried a bad flash with.
But yeah, keeping the people like that out of the phones is one of the major reasons as it can become costly to them... I call bs though, considering the amount of profit they actually make on each one of our accounts.
Sent from my One in Blue!
You are exactly right.
To be honest, there isn't much of a business case for a carrier, when serving as the reseller of a phone, to offer the freedom of an unlocked boot loader. The savvy of the general populace hasn't yet reached the point where the downside is offset by a marketable upside. Hell, most folks still **** around happily with iPhones which lack any freedom whatsoever.
TidusWulf said:
It's all about quality control. Even if it is the fact that the vast minority root their phones, it's the minority of users who generate the majority of complaints (and that rule extends FAR beyond cell phone rooting, or cell phones in general). It takes 10 good comments to make up for one bad comment these days, and there just aren't enough good comments to go around.
How likely is it, if your unrooted phone has no physical damage that you'll suddenly find that it isn't booting up? How likely is it that, even if you don't want to do it, factory resetting your unrooted phone will fix whatever problem you're having?
Big Red's reputation, their entire brand, is built on reliability. NOT freedom.
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We can speculate all we want here. Verizon says they lock phones because it's better for the network.
http://bgr.com/2012/03/02/verizon-explains-locked-bootloader-stance-in-letter-to-fcc/
Whether or not anyone chooses to believe that is a matter of opinion, but this is pretty much as close to an answer from Verizon that we'll ever get.
Sent from my HTC One.
Very enlightening.
To comment on wanting the phones to be secure for corporate security... wouldn't the amazing track record of dev's who contribute here and other places sort of fly right in the face of that.
It seems that every single device that gains enough users has some kind of workaround or vulnerability to allow it to be unlocked. If the corporate world was worried about it, all they are doing is showing just how unable to lock it down the manufactures and carriers are.
Blah, blah, blah.... the network. that is just their excuse. They used it with the FTC to get by with rate limiting the LTE network. Some lame a$$ excuse about the CDMA legacy junk. Don't get me wrong I am sure that the old CDMA stuff may make the network less predictable, but not less stable. It is all about money, and VZW is the 800 pound gorilla that get to control what we have to deal with. Thank goodness we have talented and dedicated developers that almost always get around the blockades these fools put in place.
+1
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From what I was told over at elevate, the biggest problem they don't want to expierence again is our phones not being able to dial to the correct 911 dispatch. There apparently was an incident where a rooting user had a modified dialer apk that didn't allow him dial to the correct dispatch. In an emergency for Verizon that is worse case scenario. Then there's a lawsuit that might be filed to both HTC and Verizon.
CNexus said:
Yeah, they say it's for the reasons above.
But given that, to begin with, the rooting community is a tiny slice of all mobile phone users, and then Verizon users are an even smaller portion of that. So I don't see why they even care. I highly doubt that even if ever single Verizon customer who does rooting messed up their expensive device it would cost Verizon more than .01% of their revenue, if even that.
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Gotta disagree. When you see people in this forum bragging about getting seven replacements, it does add up.
And it really is a PITA to figure out if it was user error or something wrong with the phone. It's all about risk mgmt
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