Develop Bugs

Multitouch bug on Nexus One on Desire,too?

Hi,
I read about the Google Nexus One having a bug with multitouch. It tracks the finger position wrong.
It seems to be a hardware error.
Does this affect the Desire too? (N1 and Desire are close in hardware)
Source:
http://androidandme.com/2010/03/news/is-multitouch-broken-on-the-nexus-one/

Because Desire in not in sale, nobody knows.

N1 and Desire have the same screen.
For me : Both of them have this bug.

Doesnt the N1 and the desire use same capasitive screen to the hd2 as well?

The screen of the HD2 is bigger (4.3"). The Desire has 3.7"
But those 3 devices could have the same model and manufacturer.

I'm not too worried after reading this post by Cyanogen:
Cyanogen's Solution
If this will get it to work pretty much like the droid, I'm fine with it.

Polarfuchs said:
The screen of the HD2 is bigger (4.3"). The Desire has 3.7"
But those 3 devices could have the same model and manufacturer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry yes.. Aware of that... (hd2 owner) Mean produced in the same way.. I see the nexus one has the same cross hatches as the hd2.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/06/bad-news-htc-says-nexus-ones-dont-go-in-pockets/
i hope it is not the same with the desire....

Desire has the identical "Pinch to Zoom" touchscreen... :-(

youtube.com/watch?v=7rOgFX1-EwE
This doesnt look good.. (i cant post links)

It is hard to see because of the blurry and spotlight reflections, but yeah the line jumps from one finger to the other. damn.
Here the link again http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rOgFX1-EwE

Why is there always something wrong when a phone seems to be nice

I guess we are just going to see when we get our hands on the device.. No point picking holes in it before we even have it. Im sure i can live with this if the n1 owners can.

PLenty of vids out now that show multitouch in-use, such as the pinching on homescreen and using web browser etc. with no problems. I don't think this will actually effect usability. Also, Engadget ran an article using a different multitouch "measuring" software and it had no problems...wouldn't get all upset about this

Agree,I currently own a N1 and this doesn't affect the pinch to zoom at all. It works flawlessly.

its not a big deal!
The issue appears to be a hardware issue, .. but i think there is away to solve it using a software fix, ... for example instead of the OS takes the data as it is from the touch screen that provides it (which appears to be flawed), another layer should exist, that can process the data from the touch screen and fix that issue and then pass it on.
I am not sure how this is can be done, or what is the effect of it on the over all performance, but I dont think it will be a problem with the Desire hardware specs.
Even with this issue, i dont believe it is a big deal, ... why do you need multi-touch? IMO to zoom in, zoom out (impress your friends and family), which works perfectly. other than that I hardly find any useful applications for it, ... ok maybe some games need this functionality to work properly, but i think i can live with not having games that require multi touch.

irkan said:
Even with this issue, i dont believe it is a big deal, ... why do you need multi-touch? IMO to zoom in, zoom out (impress your friends and family), which works perfectly. other than that I hardly find any useful applications for it, ... ok maybe some games need this functionality to work properly, but i think i can live with not having games that require multi touch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Typing is one thing that comes to mind
I am not trying to sound like a fanboy, but the multi-touch keyboard on the *cough*iphone*cough* is awesome. I have owned numerous HTC phones and the difference between say the MyTouch 3G and the iphone keyboard is like night and day.
Now, if there is a keyboard in the android market that is comparable then I will take back my previous statement. I haven't tried Swype, but have heard it is really good.

redrazr7791 said:
Typing is one thing that comes to mind
I am not trying to sound like a fanboy, but the multi-touch keyboard on the *cough*iphone*cough* is awesome. I have owned numerous HTC phones and the difference between say the MyTouch 3G and the iphone keyboard is like night and day.
Now, if there is a keyboard in the android market that is comparable then I will take back my previous statement. I haven't tried Swype, but have heard it is really good.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This feature is not effected by the hardware "bug" of the touch screen, .. if you used both ur hands (2 fingers) at the same time to type and clicked "pressed the screen" on two different letters without moving them than you're completely safe
My point was that the type of multi-touch (mutli touch gestures or call it whatever ...) that is effected by the bug (IMHO) is negligible to most users
and that is exactly why am getting the Desire XP

irkan said:
This feature is not effected by the hardware "bug" of the touch screen, .. if you used both ur hands (2 fingers) at the same time to type and clicked "pressed the screen" on two different letters without moving them than you're completely safe
My point was that the type of multi-touch (mutli touch gestures or call it whatever ...) that is effected by the bug (IMHO) is negligible to most users
and that is exactly why am getting the Desire XP
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for clearing that up

http://www.youtube.com/user/androidpit#p/u/1/5_rT9YzE-xg
Watch from 5:40 till the end. Pinch-to-zoom is definitely there and is HELLA smooth too

[Q] Should I buy the HTC Desire Z or a newer phone?

I have the HTC Wildfire S but I am thinking of buying the Desire Z because the screen on my phone is too small to text! The buttons are so small. I have tried the Desire Z and like the physical keyboard. But I'm not sure if it's good enough for fast typing?
But maybe since newer android phones are bigger it would be just as easy to type on an on screen keyboard just as a physical keyboard? They don't make many physical keyboard anyway nowadays. I would like an HTC or Samsung.
So should I get the HTC Desire Z, or get a newer HTC phone with just an on screen keyboard?
How good is the physical keyboard?
How good is the on screen portrait keyboard?
how good is the on screen landscape keyboard?
Thanks

The screen on the Z isn't that much bigger, so I don't know if you'd be able to type any better/faster on the screen than the Wildfire S. But the physical keyboard is very good. Not actually as good as older HTC phones, like the Touch Pro 2. The keys could stand to protrude a bit more, and press down farther. And the lack of dedicated number row is also a step backward. But still very good compared to keyboard from other manufacturers. Typing is definitely faster on the Z's physical keyboard than on the virtual keyboard, and probably rivals or beats virtual keyboards on bigger screened phones.
Have you tried the Swype keyboard on your Wildfire S? I pretty much can't stand typing on-screen without Swype, which makes it more bearable. Get Swype by going to their website and signing up for the beta:
http://beta.swype.com/
As for opinions on whether to buy the Z or not, there is another recent thread, with plenty of responses/opinions for you to consider:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1566749

redpoint73 said:
The screen on the Z isn't that much bigger, so I don't know if you'd be able to type any better/faster on the screen than the Wildfire S. But the physical keyboard is very good. Not actually as good as older HTC phones, like the Touch Pro 2. The keys could stand to protrude a bit more, and press down farther. And the lack of dedicated number row is also a step backward. But still very good compared to keyboard from other manufacturers. Typing is definitely faster on the Z's physical keyboard than on the virtual keyboard, and probably rivals or beats virtual keyboards on bigger screened phones.
Have you tried the Swype keyboard on your Wildfire S? I pretty much can't stand typing on-screen without Swype, which makes it more bearable. Get Swype by going to their website and signing up for the beta:
http://beta.swype.com/
As for opinions on whether to buy the Z or not, there is another recent thread, with plenty of responses/opinions for you to consider:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1566749
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have already read that thread. I'm still unsure. It the Desire Z fast? Also, how are the on screen keyboards? Is the an on screen landscape keyboard?
By the way, my Wildfire S does not have Swype

Dolphin2 said:
I have already read that thread. I'm still unsure. It the Desire Z fast? Also, how are the on screen keyboards? Is the an on screen landscape keyboard?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Define "fast". Its a phone that is about a year and a half old. Its acceptable for most tasks. And with the right ROM and overclocking, it can be made to perform smoother. But its starting to show its age versus the 1.5 GHz multicore flagship phones coming out now. And the One X looks like it may redefine tasks and blow away even the phone currently on the market.
---------- Post added at 08:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:33 PM ----------
Dolphin2 said:
Also, how are the on screen keyboards? Is the an on screen landscape keyboard?
By the way, my Wildfire S does not have Swype
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I've already mentioned that I have to use Swype, otherwise screen keyboards drive me crazy. And I'm on CM7 right now, so I can't tell you much about the stock Sense screen keyboard. It works well enough, from the times I've used it. But I tend to make lots of typos on this size screen.
If you mean that the Wildfire S is not supported by the Swype beta, then there are plenty of similar apps available. Or more recent HTC firmware (and custom ROMs) contains HTC Trace, which is their Swype clone.

You have 2 choices get a galaxy nexus or wait it out til HTC announces a qwerty device whenever that may be.

Vision is really fun to upgrade it and change roms and the other things... Its fun to wait for those fully working ICS roms, to dream about stable sense 4.0 roms, flash kernels, radios, mods... If I would buy a Nexus, it wouldnt be such a great experience. I would just download some apps and maybe root it...
Anyway Im very satisfied with Vision and I will change it only, when it gets really weak behind the newest devices. Kinda like wildfire now... Not the wildfire S
Sent from my Vision using XDA

Dolphin2 said:
How good is the physical keyboard?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Physical keyboard is for me very good, no typo errors when typing, big enough. And with beta.swpe.com I use, it is for me sufficiently good combination for daily drive.

tarroyo said:
You have 2 choices get a galaxy nexus or wait it out til HTC announces a qwerty device whenever that may be.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why do you say there are only 2 choices? The HTC One X looks to blow away the Galaxy Nexus in terms of CPU speed, and will be released in most markets in April/May.. And the Galaxy S3 is probably going to be announced/unveiled at some point in the next few months. And that is if you are recommending the absolute top performing phones. There are plenty of other existing phones on the market that would also meet the OP's needs.

redpoint73 said:
Why do you say there are only 2 choices? The HTC One X looks to blow away the Galaxy Nexus in terms of CPU speed, and will be released in most markets in April/May.. And the Galaxy S3 is probably going to be announced/unveiled at some point in the next few months. And that is if you are recommending the absolute top performing phones. There are plenty of other existing phones on the market that would also meet the OP's needs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm also on a bit of a budget. In Canada (where I live), Bell does not longer sell the Derise Z. I found one being sold online for $200 in my area. I will either buy the Desire Z or get something like the HTC One X once my contract is up in 2 years. Also, I was looking at the Samsung Captivate Glide as a very good up to date phone with a physical keyboard.

redpoint73 said:
Why do you say there are only 2 choices? The HTC One X looks to blow away the Galaxy Nexus in terms of CPU speed, and will be released in most markets in April/May.. And the Galaxy S3 is probably going to be announced/unveiled at some point in the next few months. And that is if you are recommending the absolute top performing phones. There are plenty of other existing phones on the market that would also meet the OP's needs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Reason I said that is because One X comes with sense preinstalled, Our vision devices did not.

For me I think if u r going to mainly use the phone to send emails, sms .... Desire z is the best choice to go with. If ur focus is on browsing, games,music I think u should go with a newer version like htc one
Sent from my HTC Desire Z A7272 using XDA

I love my g2. It's much easier to send thoughtful emails/texts than any other phone out there. The hercules is the obvious replacement phone at the moment, though.Rocking em both.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-T989 using xda premium

TehHector said:
For me I think if u r going to mainly use the phone to send emails, sms .... Desire z is the best choice to go with. If ur focus is on browsing, games,music I think u should go with a newer version like htc one
Sent from my HTC Desire Z A7272 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My main use is for sending emails and SMS.

Buy it if you like to type much and in a comfortable way
tarroyo said:
Reason I said that is because One X comes with sense preinstalled, Our vision devices did not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As your Vision didn't come with Sense: did you buy it as a G2? I've read that they just feature the stock Android interface. Anyways, my Desire Z had Sense preinstalled.
To answer the OP's questions:
Dolphin2 said:
...
So should I get the HTC Desire Z, or get a newer HTC phone with just an on screen keyboard?
How good is the physical keyboard?
How good is the on screen portrait keyboard?
how good is the on screen landscape keyboard?
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1st question: The only on-screen keyboard I can imagine to reach half the typing comfort of the Desire Z's physical keyboard is the Galaxy Note's one. But to lead to the
2nd question: The physical keyboard is quite comfortable and the keys are perfectly arranged for my (medium sized) hands.
3rd question: If you mean the Desire Z's on-screen keyboard - install a different one! The stock Sense keyboard is quite slow compared to the stock Android one. I also prefer Swype for daily use but the Sense one is definitely not optimal. If it comes to typing comfort itself - the on-screen keyboard is good for one-hand typing if you really have to or are just too lazy to "slide" out the physical keyboard.
4th question: If you mean the Desire Z's on-screen keyboard - one-hand typing -> portrait on-screen keyboard | two-hand typing -> physical keyboard (no need to use a landscape on-screen keyboard )

As much as I love my Desire Z, I can definitely tell it's getting dated.
If possible, I would suggest you find a phone with perhaps a bigger screen (for your typing/texting needs) and with a newer processor. With some more intensive tasks or games, the desire Z definitely shows its age.
Although, I understand that you have a budget, and if you cannot find something dual core, you are probably very well off with a Desire Z.

N4n45h1 said:
...
With some more intensive tasks or games, the desire Z definitely shows its age.
...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's true but
Dolphin2 said:
My main use is for sending emails and SMS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I think that the OP will not have much of a problem with performance
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA

The keyboard is very easy to use. I have my phone ever since it first came out in the US. I have used the phone so much I can text with it without looking at the keyboard.

TpmKranz said:
As your Vision didn't come with Sense: did you buy it as a G2? I've read that they just feature the stock Android interface. Anyways, my Desire Z had Sense preinstalled.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did, In the U.S our Vision devices are stock android.

The HTC One X looks very nice and I can imagine that it will be touting a hefty price tag when available. I currently have a G2 which I am very pleased with, for the most part. Typing emails and text is very fluid and fast but I am asking for more (especially for browsing and gaming).
I guess I need to start saving my pennies.

Really concerned about the One X browser

I've watched and read many reviews of the One X including the phonearena one, and while I disagree with the total score they gave to the One X (7.5/10 I think which is ridiculous, it's better than that) i did see some lag and stutter here and there so let me explain. According to the vids, sense restarts from time to time which is very annoying on a phone with monster specs as this One. Also the browser looks inconsistent as HELL!!! I mean you double tap to zoom in an area and it shows you another part of the page. Pinch to zoom doesm seem very fluid at first but once you keep doing it its like butter but still. Again on the browser, when you scroll up and down sometimes you get this menu at the bottom page that appears and that also look annoying. I hope you can download the stock ICS browser from google play but these things shouldn't happen. I personally don't have the phone yet so I still have to check for myself but from what I saw I am very unimpressed by the browser. Don't mean to troll or whatever you called it

get Chrome Beta
Fixed. No issues with chrome beta in any way on my one x

Wtrt said:
get Chrome Beta
Fixed. No issues with chrome beta in any way on my one x
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Could you post some footage of yourself playing around on the browser, please?

You know that there is a very good chance these stock browser issues will be sorted in the OTA update on the 5th right?

Wtrt said:
get Chrome Beta
Fixed. No issues with chrome beta in any way on my one x
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea but it doesn't support flash. I just finish watching a comparison between the one s vs one x browser, the one s destroys it in speed, fluidity. I'm just saying.

OysterCatcheRR said:
You know that there is a very good chance these stock browser issues will be sorted in the OTA update on the 5th right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Those browser issues shouldn't happen in the first place. Look at the one s my friend.

I can't recall your problems.
My HTC One X browser is super-fast, fluid and overall.. just perfect.
I absolutely love it.

McSic said:
I can't recall your problems.
My HTC One X browser is super-fast, fluid and overall.. just perfect.
I absolutely love it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's cool. I just saw the phonearena review that's why I'm concerned but I'm glad you like yours!

Just use Chrome.
It's better than the stock browser even on my Galaxy Nexus.

dude, give it 2 or 3 months your talking like the phone has been out for a year..wait till dev's start making custom roms, firmware, radios, etc..all of those problems that you see or hear are going to be fixed soon

tsekh501 said:
Just use Chrome.
It's better than the stock browser even on my Galaxy Nexus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea but it doesn't support flash

I use to be a huge HTC fan till the GS and GS2 but I did own the sensation in between those releases but I usually buy an HTC and wait for CM to come out for the device to fix a lot of the junk HTC does in their devices. So what i'm saying is that if it isn't a HW issue i wouldn't worry about it not being fixed some how.
Just a thought.

Bxsteez said:
I use to be a huge HTC fan till the GS and GS2 but I did own the sensation in between those releases but I usually buy an HTC and wait for CM to come out for the device to fix a lot of the junk HTC does in their devices. So what i'm saying is that if it isn't a HW issue i wouldn't worry about it not being fixed some how.
Just a thought.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You've got a point

So I am unsure how this all works but I was able to use Sense 4.0 on an HTC Sensation recently and it seemed to me that the browser used for Sense 4.0 is exactly the same as the Android Browser on ICS. I felt like it was snappy and responsive. Definitely impressed me

You are not alone. The browser on the one x is a mess. Unresponsive scrolling, unpredictable menu popping out at random, slow choppy zooming, funky text reflow, terrible memory management. Switching to another app or even the homescreen and back causes browser to quit and all the tabs to reload. Multitasking is non existent despite being the latest quadcore. Hate to say it but my old nexus one with a measely 512 ram and and primitive single core cpu provides better browsing and multitasks better.

Anyone tried Dolphin with OneX?
Found it pretty awesome on my Desire, but not seeing much mention of it being used with this device...

This really makes me laugh.... the phone is NOT officially released until Thursday, yet ppl are complaining about software bugs
OTA's
Custom Roms
Custom Kernals
Custom Radios
Just think of the HTC One X as a nice cold pint of Guinness - "Good things come to those who wait"
Or at least wait till Thursday

nativestranger said:
You are not alone. The browser on the one x is a mess. Unresponsive scrolling, unpredictable menu popping out at random, slow choppy zooming, funky text reflow, terrible memory management. Switching to another app or even the homescreen and back causes browser to quit and all the tabs to reload. Multitasking is non existent despite being the latest quadcore. Hate to say it but my old nexus one with a measely 512 ram and and primitive single core cpu provides better browsing and multitasks better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The browser has that behavior on all ICS roms. SGSII and Galaxy Nexus included. It isn't isolated to this phone.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium

joshnichols189 said:
The browser has that behavior on all ICS roms. SGSII and Galaxy Nexus included. It isn't isolated to this phone.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sorry but that is simply not true at all. The Gnexus browser is nearly perfect. Double tap zoom is very good so is pinch to zoom. I'm guessing downloading the ICS stock browser from google play might help. The one x browser is all over the place.

Just sayin', Phone Arena is really weird with their reviews.
Lumia 900, Windows Phone 7.5, get's a 8.
Infinitely superior One X gets a 7.8 just because it has a bulky soft keyboard(easily replaced), a clunky browser(easily replaced), etc.
Cum grano salis.

Is the official Facebook App sluggish on One X?

So here is the deal, I had a Sensation before my One X, and since this phone has Tegra 3 I would assume it run a lot smoother! And overall it does, actually every single app is much more fluid, and switching apps are fast and smooth, but the Facebook app is horrible! I know, it's always been, but compared to my old Sensation, the One X isn't doing well here..
Yes I know FriendCaster is available, but I actually prefer the official app on a phone.. So is anybody experiencing this? And is this really where we can see the power of custom kernels? Or am I completely stupid and alone on this..?
Edit: And sorry if this has been discussed.. Haven't been on here that much lately..
Sendt fra min HTC One X med Tapatalk2

I havnt noticed it as being any worse then my S2 but the official app, being the pile of gash it is, I wasnt expecting any improvement

not really sluggish at all for me
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

It really depends what you call 'sluggish'. Coming from the Facebook app on an iPhone for example, the official Facebook app on the one x takes longer to start and also does not provide a smooth scrolling experience as on the iPhone.
Compared to other Android devices, it feels pretty much the same on most of them. Looking at LG 2x and SGS II they all feel quite the same.

The facebook app is just crap at the best of times, it was naff on my HTC Desire and its still crap on the One X, its nothing to do with the phone, just the app was made by monkeys... My mum could code a better app! Heh.
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

Rageypeep said:
The facebook app is just crap at the best of times, it was naff on my HTC Desire and its still crap on the One X, its nothing to do with the phone, just the app was made by monkeys... My mum could code a better app! Heh.
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 - I HATE the facebook app. They really need to sort it out!
The worst recent change they made was to wait until you get a gps position BEFORE???? loading the news feed. so you could sometimes end up waiting a loooong time before you see anything. Its shocking coding by them.
I heard a while ago that they only have one dev working on the android one, but a team who do the iphone one. Maybe this has changed now, but if not, they need to consider some changes!

The FaceBook app could really do with GPU Acceleration.
Theres no reason to why clicking out the sidebar should be choppy, and the fact that the loading spinner is sluggish

I actually like how the official FB app is, EXCEPT how delayed and laggy scrolling can become!

lawrence750 said:
+1 - I HATE the facebook app. They really need to sort it out!
The worst recent change they made was to wait until you get a gps position BEFORE???? loading the news feed. so you could sometimes end up waiting a loooong time before you see anything. Its shocking coding by them.
I heard a while ago that they only have one dev working on the android one, but a team who do the iphone one. Maybe this has changed now, but if not, they need to consider some changes!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeh that's real crap you can however stop it, if your rooted get lbe security it allows you to controll the permissions of everything system apps included.
I want to know why it need my location on the news feed? I could understand on the status updates screen.
Sent from my HTC One X using xda premium

HTC: Sense is better than stock android

Bwhahahahahaha
http://blog.laptopmag.com/htc’s-sense-guru-stock-android-4-0-just-not-good-enough
Thought you guys might need a good laugh today

Gotta appreciate the confidence.
captcha: 30 arvits

"According to Drew Bamford, HTC’s AVP of user experience...."

When I read this article I'm reminded of what it sounds like when the teacher is talking to charlie brown.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

well is the same as every mother thinks his ugly kid is the most beautiful in the world

He says,
"There are some subtleties to our design that I think make an improvement over the ICS design. For example, when you press that recent apps button, the current app zooms out and then moves over to the right so that the one that’s in the center was the previous app. And then probably 80 percent of the cases, at least, you’re switching to the most recent app, the previous app, and in that case ***you just press right in the center and there you are. So it actually optimizes for that most common case of going to the most recent application.***"
Huh. Kinda like with stock ICS where the last app is right in the bottom right where my thumb already is?

Yes I agree, HTC Sense is better then stock Android. I bought Nexus to use it with CM9 and AOKP, stock Nexus sucks....One S/X is much better

kolyan said:
Yes I agree, HTC Sense is NOT better than stock Android. I bought the Nexus to use it with CM9 and AOKP, stock Nexus is awesome....One S/X is terrible....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I fixed your post for you .
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium

kolyan said:
Yes I agree, HTC Sense is better then stock Android. I bought Nexus to use it with CM9 and AOKP, stock Nexus sucks....One S/X is much better
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good for you. CM9/AOKP are based off of Stock(and look very much like stock from what I've seen). Personally, Sense has always seemed like it tried to hard to look "elegant", but came out looking cartoonish. The added features didn't really seem all great either. Mind you, this is from my experience with the HTC Rezound. Plus, simple tasks like changing a ringtone was awkward and didn't work well. They never stuck.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

The recent apps window in Sense 4 is One (heh) of the few features I genuinely dislike about it.
A key point of the menu is to access apps you have been previously using. As the article says, In Sense 4, you can see one full app screen, and the edges of the two on either side. In stock ICS you get four full apps shown. Sure, HTC's one looks nice, but it's far less practical, regardless of what the guy who designed it claims. Add some fancy reflections to the stock ICS and it'd look every bit as flashy, too.
And don't get me started on white menu backgrounds. They look nasty, and now I can't use them in the dark without going blind!
The guy even says they didn't have long to tinker with it. Google, on the other hand, has been iterating this UI for a long time. They didn't just make a utilitarian, functional UI at the last minute to get ICS out the door. The fuss they made over Roboto should tell you that much.

Coming off of 3 years of using Sense (had the Hero, Evo 4G and Evo 3D), Sense is nice to look at--but if you want a quicker, more streamlined experience, then stock Android is the way to go. I missed it way too much after I got rid of my G1 a couple years back.
Stock ICS > Sense 4.0.

Coming from a sensation 4g using ARHD, there are a few sense features that google should pick up on.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA

well he does work for HTC, so I could imagine they are proud of their work, it is the prettiest overlay for android and its has some useful widgets

Reading off of many reviews about Sense 4 (particularly The Verge's) many say that it does not bring anything new to the table that stock ICS already has.
Plus, many of the things Sense has can be implemented via third-party apps anyways. I never understood their need to insert their proprietary software in the device. Seems so limited and closed. Part of the reason why I hated Sense 3/3.5 on my EVO 3D.

IMHO, Sense was relevant and useful prior to ICS. Now, it just looks dated.
I appreciated sense on my Dinc but would never install a rom with Sense 4.0 on my Gnex.

Sense influenced the evolution of android back in its pioneering days. Since google hired Mathias duarte from webos to apple-ify the interface to make it more elegant and intuitive, there's no need for sense. I wish that these companies would just stick to proprietary apps or something for differentiation rather than screwing with the os. The only thing lacking from ics stock is pull down toggles and customize able nav bar icons. Aokp and some others solve that without ruining ics.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

What made sense amazing however is what it did for windows phone before android came out or just after. It actually made that crap useable.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

Jayrod1980 said:
What made sense amazing however is what it did for windows phone before android came out or just after. It actually made that crap useable.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
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Ahhh....
*reminisces about Touchflo3D days*

chlehqls said:
Reading off of many reviews about Sense 4 (particularly The Verge's) many say that it does not bring anything new to the table that stock ICS already has.
Plus, many of the things Sense has can be implemented via third-party apps anyways. I never understood their need to insert their proprietary software in the device. Seems so limited and closed. Part of the reason why I hated Sense 3/3.5 on my EVO 3D.
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Marketing, that'd the only idea i can think of why the manufactures put it on, if they all ran vanilla (oh what a world it would be) they just pick thier style and run with it to separate themselves from other Android phones
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Isn't it true that having an HTC phone means, if you root, that you always have the choice of stock android or sense? Something any other phone lacks.