Develop Bugs

[Q] Neo - Question about camera compression

I'm thinking to buy a Neo this week and it will be my first Android phone. In a few reviews I've seen some complaints about the .jpg's being over compressed using the stock camera app. If you use a different camera app are you able to set it for less compression and better pictures?

Hi mattarse
The jpg compression is fine as it is, I believe the discussion on the compression has been started due to very high expectations of the camera in the new xperia phones. The camera IS very good I think considering it is a mobile phone with a very small camera sensor.
Pictures will when you magnify them on your pc never look as good as a dslr or newer compact camera with bigger sensors and better optics. This is probable what started the jpg compression discussion as it would have been nice to just change the jpg compression level and have super sharp pictures even when you zoom in.
The Camera Advance app will give you the option to change the compression but my own tests show no visual difference from the xperia camera app and the picture from camera advance. File size differences was 1MB from xperia camera and 2.2MB from camera advance app.
Camera360 Ultimate will give pictures at the same sizes as the xperia camera app even when you select the finest compression level.
I personally prefer to use the xperia camera app compared to camera360 and camera advance.
I have allways enjoyed photography and normally use a dslr. This is actually the first mobile phone where I have started to use the camera as I have allways disliked the picture quality from my older mobiles. It is amazing to see pictures at iso 1600-2000 being useable from this small camera, the low light performance is very good and the dynamic range under sunlight is also very good.
I have the xperia arc and not neo, but I belive the camera is the same on both mobiles. Have seen some samples from neo where it actually looks like it is producing better pictures, could be due to different optics in the slightly bigger mobile or just differences in firmware.

Well I've bought a Neo for my wife recently. But was surprised also to see the size of the files for an 8mp camera. I was also surprised there is no option for the level of compression.
What is more important that the camera does not produce good quality for darker rooms.(in a room with 15*10W halogen light bulbs). The pictures have a visible yellow-greenish tint and a lot of noise. I haven't tried on outside just yet.
May be my expectation are too high. But I still think this is a marketing trick. They could have easily put a sensor with less density (5mp or 6mp) which is supposed to produce less noise.

valqka said:
Well I've bought a Neo for my wife recently. But was surprised also to see the size of the files for an 8mp camera. I was also surprised there is no option for the level of compression.
What is more important that the camera does not produce good quality for darker rooms.(in a room with 15*10W halogen light bulbs). The pictures have a visible yellow-greenish tint and a lot of noise. I haven't tried on outside just yet.
May be my expectation are too high. But I still think this is a marketing trick. They could have easily put a sensor with less density (5mp or 6mp) which is supposed to produce less noise.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do believe the exmoor sensor has improved low light performance compared to a regular mobile camera sensor. But this is still only a small camera and even my dslr would struggle indoor with only artificial lighting unless flash is added.
Have only shot a couple of low light pictures with my arc both outside and inside and agree that pictures especially at iso1600-2000 contain a larger amount of noise. I would say the pictures are very good compared to my old mobile which was useless in low light and good compared to my compact camera.
You can change the scene mode to make the xperia use slower shutter speeds and lower iso, that will give you some very nice scenery shots in low light with little noise. I have to my surprised shot a few sharp fotos at 1/4 shutter speed in low light, that would not be possible without fixed mounting on my dslr or an extremely steady hand.
You will ever only be able to archive good low light pictures with expensive slr and optics. One thing I have learned using slr is that light is king, you can not get enough light if you want sharp, good looking, strong colors etc.
Now you got me interested in doing some tests to compare the low light performance with my dslr and compact camera

Well hygge, I am quite an amateur in shooting but I also know from my extended zoom camera that noise in low light is a nightmare (at least I use Program mode and not automatic ).
I really got the phone form several days and did not had the time try it good. I've just changed settings from 6mp 16:9 (strange for default settings) to 8mp.
Then the LED flash came on automatically. But the result was not good. (3 from 4 shots were with yellow-green tint and one was too bright (or is more correct over-exposed). But I must confess the scene was complicated if this matters at all: my baby in the bathing tub. So there is water, reflection.....
But anyway I put my bet on the dslr with a huge distnace

valqka said:
Well hygge, I am quite an amateur in shooting but I also know from my extended zoom camera that noise in low light is a nightmare (at least I use Program mode and not automatic ).
I really got the phone form several days and did not had the time try it good. I've just changed settings from 6mp 16:9 (strange for default settings) to 8mp.
Then the LED flash came on automatically. But the result was not good. (3 from 4 shots were with yellow-green tint and one was too bright (or is more correct over-exposed). But I must confess the scene was complicated if this matters at all: my baby in the bathing tub. So there is water, reflection.....
But anyway I put my bet on the dslr with a huge distnace
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would have been a nice picture, but it do sounds like a challenging picture with the reflecting. Remember to record movies of your baby in the bathing tub. My daughters now 3 og 5 years really enjoy looking at short movie clips of them as babies splashing in their bathing tub
(they love playing games on the xperia, mostly drawing apps )
What I have seen so far is that the xperia tend to prefer low shutter speeds in low light situations. I still only have a handfull of shots to base my conclusions but with flash on it was using 1/25 sec shutter. This is too slow taking pictures of moving kids, you will need 1/60 or even 1/120 which is normally only available on slr's. Without flash it has been 1/8 and high iso, must admit it was under circumstances I would never have used my dslr without flash and maybe a bit unfair to judge the xperias camera capabilities.
I agree that the wrong color balance will totally screw up the pictures, have you tried setting the white balance manually in the camera? A setting I have not yet changed on my xperia and are not aware what options are available.

I have now made some quick comparisons of my three cameraes under low light conditions.
Might upload test pictures later when I have the time, for now you will have to trust me
Camera 1. Xperia Arc 8MegaPixel
Camera 2. Olympus u Tough 12MegaPixel
Camera 3. Konica Minolta 5D dslr 6MegaPixel
Test 1 without flash
Xperia 1. Kamera advance app with lowest compression, no flash
ISO: 1000
Exposure: 1/8
Olympus 2. Default settings with disable flash
ISO: 400
Exposure: 1/4
KM 5D 3. Full auto, no flash
Could not focus, too little light, camera suggested 3-4 sec shutter speed
(was using OEM lense with bad aperture which gave it problems focussing, could have used a better lense but decided to use OEM lense to keep the comparisons fairly)
Results:
Olympus had only a tiny bit more details and allot more noise, picture was looking very bad up close.
Xperia Arc, even at iso 1000 the noise was lower than my Olympus and the picture looked more clean with nicer colors. I definitely prefered the Xperia result.
The olympus will not go lower than 1/4 shutter speed and iso 400. I selected night scenery on the Arc and got a picture with iso 160 and shutterspeed 1/2. This picture had even less noise but was slightly blurred at 1/2, need a more steady hand but still a very useable result.
My DSLR would not take a picture without focus.
Winner:
Xperia Arc, higher shutter speeds and a cleaner picture with less noise. I was surprised to see the loss of details on my 12MP Olympus at ISO 400 compared to the Xperia Arc.
Test 2
With Flash:
Xperia 1. ISO 400, shutter 1/24
Olympus 2. ISO 100, shutter 1/30
KM 5D 3. ISO 100, shutter 1/60
Result:
The Olympus with flash and ISO 100 gave a sharp, low noise picture and the 12MP provided better details than the xperia could show. The flash on the xperia is not very strong and it was not possible for me to configure it to use lower ISO than 400. The xperia arc picture did give a nice result with low noise.
The 6MP DSLR with flash give the same amount of details as the 12MP Olympus, my old DSLR is still going strong and a better lense will give an even sharper picture
Winner:
KonicaMinolta 5D wins, followed by Olympus. Xperia Arc still gave a nice result but with less details and more noise than the other two devices.
One last test at a really dark area without flash also proved xperia arc to be the winner. My Olympus would not go lower than 1/4 iso400 while xperia used 1/8 iso2000. The motive was only visible on xperia arc and even a fairly noisy picture at iso2000 is better than no picture at all
My own conclusion is that the xperia arc/neo is really good at low light performance and even outperforms many compact cameras, but the the weak flash give some serious limitations. The low shutter speeds will probably also be an issue taking pictures of moving motives in low light.
(did shoot a couple of shoots with sony camera app and did not notice any difference from Camera Advance, I used the 3PP camera to use as little jpg compression as possible but I doubt the pictures visually differ much)
It would be interesting to do some tests during daylight as well, it will not benefit from the improved low light performance compared to other camera sensors. I am curious to see how the dynamic range of this sensor is, can it compare to my Olympus compact camera then it would be a serious contender as my primary point and shoot camera as long as flash is not needed.

Thanks forthe replies - I'm not expecting amazing things from camera on a phone Just want to make sure that software isn't unnecessarily hindering the hardware.
It also looks like it will be a couple of weeks before I pick one up...Unless i opt for something else in that time, but for a smallish screen size Android phone this currently looks the best. I do wish it had gorilla glass - but you can't have it all
Now I've found a confusing thread about in line remotes on the headphones that I need to figure out (yes I do seem to put way too much thought into these things!).

valqka said:
I really got the phone form several days and did not had the time try it good. I've just changed settings from 6mp 16:9 (strange for default settings) to 8mp.
Then the LED flash came on automatically. But the result was not good. (3 from 4 shots were with yellow-green tint and one was too bright (or is more correct over-exposed). But I must confess the scene was complicated if this matters at all: my baby in the bathing tub. So there is water, reflection.....
But anyway I put my bet on the dslr with a huge distnace
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the yellow green tint you're seeing will be from the lights in the room - you see this on most cameras of any quality, if you have a white balance setting you should have one for indoor/halogen lights. It's also normally easy to fix in Photoshop.

Arc S has a horrible camera quality

Hello, i bought a new Arc S. I found, that camera produces really low quality pictures. Is there any way to improve compression? I heard, that CM has a improved quality camera.
Thank you

Hello there
Unfortunately, there is currently no option available to improve the crappy quality of the camera output (compression).
Neither CM7 nor MIUI have any significant improvement in this area.

Are you sure you bought an arc because my arc takes good pics but it isn't an arc s but I find this hard to believe maybe your only taking pictures in the dark ?

Check your settings. Some phones have the camera set to poor quality from start.
Sent from my Sensation using xda premium

I've bought an Xperia Arc S too about a month ago, but in my opinion the camera is fantastic! Maybe you have to set the camera in high quality. My camera was also standard at 2 MP 16:9. Now I'm using 6 MP 16:9 and the pictures are great, even in the dark.

septix said:
Check your settings. Some phones have the camera set to poor quality from start.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Resolution is already set to 8Mpixels.
Which other settings could I check?

rioka said:
Resolution is already set to 8Mpixels.
Which other settings could I check?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd recommend 6 MP, because it has a 16:9 instead of a 4:3 format.

Mine works awesome with 8MP...
Could you post a pic made by your cam?
Sent from my iPad 2 using Tapatalk

I would also recommend you post the picture you have taken, x10 and arc are best known as their 8M camera, they should be able to take impressive picture compared to all the phone available back then and even able to compete among all phones on the market to date
Sent from my Sony Tablet S using xda premium

I don't understand people who say Arc camera is crappy.
It's the best I've ever used in a mobile phone to date.
It can't be compared to my compact camera but it's a phone after all
and the results are more than decent for quick shots.

I don't say my arc is perfect but It's not really that bad in taking picture .
I'm ok with it ...
Using 6MP 16:9,
maybe Your lens is dirty ! clean it if it's needed.

arc is one of the best camera phones out there.if not the best.

Best camera 2011/2012, it won that price
Sent from my LT15i using XDA Premium App

The camera is great - no 2 opinions about that.
But after I downgraded from .62 to .42 with data&system wipe, because of the root, my phone started to take really low quality pics in low light - identical conditions, the same camera settings, but now pics appear with a great level of noise, nomatter how I adjust the settings. On videos also. This is my second time downgrading from 62, the first time without wipe - everything was OK, but now I think smthing must have gone wrong - lots of noise and heavy purple dots...
Any ideas how to fix that, cause I really miss the good low light pics - one of the reasons I bought it.

iridaki said:
I don't understand people who say Arc camera is crappy.
It's the best I've ever used in a mobile phone to date.
It can't be compared to my compact camera but it's a phone after all
and the results are more than decent for quick shots.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Maybe some users are expecting a miracle out of arc's camera (e.g. comparing the pictures against DSLRs' large sensor and lens)
Its great for casual shots and videos imo.
It even won an EISA award.

The camera is great, the software is horrible. MIUI and CM7 support to change the jpg compression, which the stock ROM doesn't. The jpg compression sadly ****s up everything and destroys the overall quality of the shots.

I find the quality of the arc's shots to be great, I don't understand why so many people complain. Yes the output file is pretty small for an 8MP resolution photo because its been compressed to ****, but I don't really notice this, even when plugging into my 42" TV it still looks great (until you start to zoom in) Take a range of shots, when shooting in darkness you will find a decent amount of noise but this is just the Exmor-r working wonders - without it, you'd find you'd just have a very dark picture.

Like many people already said, I'm totally happy with the picture's quality of my ARC, especially on 6MP 16:9. I love the colors, the tones, the clarity.. I'm sure that Sony (still SE for me ) will improve a little about JPEG compression in next ICS release..

iridaki said:
I don't understand people who say Arc camera is crappy.
It's the best I've ever used in a mobile phone to date.
It can't be compared to my compact camera but it's a phone after all
and the results are more than decent for quick shots.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. Only my old Nokia N95 comes close, but that also was a little sony carl zeiss optic if i recall correctly.

Arc S camera is crappy.
I know it, because i used a Samsung mobile for a long time before Arc S, to take more than 4K pcs photos, so i can compare them.
It makes a lot of color noise under low light conditions of scenes.
Even a bit better when the light is enough, but then it makes white burned photos
The objective is distorted (fish eye aka barell), and also makes color noises in its corners.
The video record of this mobile is blurred, shaked, in low light condition makes color noises too.
You have to use Noiseware, or similar software to remove unwanted color noises from photos which are dotted by Xperia Arc /s
I don't know what is the meaning of the Exmore r, because i can't find a reason, maybe it' s only a commercial thingy
Sorry for my bad english.

Z1 compact and Z3 compact camera or Z2

Hi,
I have great offer to buy Z1 compact. Is there any difference in camera between Z1, Z1 compact, Z2 and Z3 compact? Any important improvements etc? Please help me fast
Thanks!

No big difference, I had Z1C, I had Z1, they have the same camera

MARKOZD15 said:
No big difference, I had Z1C, I had Z1, they have the same camera
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And photo quality is good? I have HTC Sensation with 8 Mpix camera and I want to have better photos. Weakly I'm taking 100 photos of documents etc. So the most important for me is photo quality, not video recording

Picture quality is unpredictable, just don't use superior auto, use manual mode with auto ISO, still a lot better than superior auto because it just can't always recognise scenes well..
When you use Manual Mode+Auto ISO, you will get amazing picture quality, still one of the best on the market

MARKOZD15 said:
Picture quality is unpredictable, just don't use superior auto, use manual mode with auto ISO, still a lot better than superior auto because it just can't always recognise scenes well..
When you use Manual Mode+Auto ISO, you will get amazing picture quality, still one of the best on the market
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can see that you own Nexus 5. Wat about Nexus 5 photo and Z1c?

Z1C is miles ahead in picture quality, better in daylight, low light without flash, indoors, N5 is only better in macro shots and low light with flash

MARKOZD15 said:
Z1C is miles ahead in picture quality, better in daylight, low light without flash, indoors, N5 is only better in macro shots and low light with flash
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So it is not worth to pay much more money for camera in Z3c?

That's right

But Z3C had better camera -
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/ca...mpact,Sony-Xperia-Z1-Compact/phones/8744,8283
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=3&idPhone1=6538&idPhone2=5753

mmm273 said:
But Z3C had better camera -
http://www.phonearena.com/phones/ca...mpact,Sony-Xperia-Z1-Compact/phones/8744,8283
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=3&idPhone1=6538&idPhone2=5753
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Difference is not hudge
Thanks for all replays. I already bought it

The light flare in z1c is horrible for mine. When there is a strong light in a corner of photo, my photo gets either wash out of darkens or have a area that seemed misty. Slightly better in z2 camera. No such thing in note3, mi3 etc.
But under strong light, photos can barely be touched by other phone.
Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk

Z3 Camera

Hi peeps,
I am not sure about you guys, but I am very happy abt Z3 camera and its features, I came from Z1 and the camera is good too!
I notice some did mention or some of my friends saying Sony camera suck and that the Z3 camera is not as good as samsung s3 or other brands bah bah bah....
But I asked, what Sony phones are you conparing with and what are the camera or display settings of the Z3 phones. Then I reliased the following issues
1) Some are using Xperia Z ultra to compare with Samsung S3. Z ultra only have 8 MP and no ISO settings so if u want to use a mid range camera to fight with a higher range phone who will lose out? Just like I used a 20MP Z3 with the same setting I will surely win...
He also mention the Z ultra camera pic cannot tell the color difference between white and yellowish white but when I took the same pic, with my Z3, he was shocked....
2) Z3 camera by default has set to 8/15 MP for 16:9. So the pic is not the best yet. You need to change the settings....
3) Off the HDR & Display Enhencment settings, u will see a better quality photo on screen and on PC...
4) If you are using matt, anti finger print or privacy screen protectors, please dont even bother to complain abt the screen quality.... You are using a few dollar to cover up 100 dollar stuff...
5) Only a few case is factory defects which need u to send out for repairs... Nothing is perfect just that u are the few unlucky ones to get a defected product...

Oh man, please check where are posting, this forum about Sony smartWATCH 3, not about xperia z3.

and as a z3 owner (and z ultra by chance) I dont even know where to start with the actual content..
Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk

Flashben said:
Hi peeps,
I am not sure about you guys, but I am very happy abt Z3 camera and its features, I came from Z1 and the camera is good too!
I notice some did mention or some of my friends saying Sony camera suck and that the Z3 camera is not as good as samsung s3 or other brands bah bah bah....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are off topic here, should move to z3 board. This is a general problem we've heard many times on net. From my personal experiences, the answer is mixed. Overall, I would say Sony camera sometimes can be very good but in some situation it can be very bad. On the other hand, Samsung, HTC the camera performance is more consistent and most people prefer a stable camera(so most guys said iphone camera the best).
Sony camera generally poor on focus in my degrees of view while the quality can be very good when it can manage to get the focus right which is very annoy for most guys. Plus the Sony camera always compressed the image too much, in some photo when the object/environment is hard to compress, it will just lost the fight for Samsung which is a very clear answer.

Some questions about Z5

So, my question are basicly
Looking at the camera shutter and focus speed, like in G2 ,,Sport Mode'' is way darker, because the shutter and focus speed is way faster then normal mode.
Does it means, that in low light situation the Z5 Premium will be also dark and the only think to make clear and crispy night photos is to focus like 2-3 seconds to do a decent shot?
Manual settings
Looking at LG G4 the photos with manual focus are incredible, looking at todays technologies. So what about Z5 ? Will they support Camera2 Api? Will it be with manual mode to? Or just modes that Z5 will give it to us?
What you guys opinion about this phone? After Christmas I will look at new one, and this beast is in my eyes not as Number 1 .

harkis123 said:
So, my question are basicly
Looking at the camera shutter and focus speed, like in G2 ,,Sport Mode'' is way darker, because the shutter and focus speed is way faster then normal mode.
Does it means, that in low light situation the Z5 Premium will be also dark and the only think to make clear and crispy night photos is to focus like 2-3 seconds to do a decent shot?
Manual settings
Looking at LG G4 the photos with manual focus are incredible, looking at todays technologies. So what about Z5 ? Will they support Camera2 Api? Will it be with manual mode to? Or just modes that Z5 will give it to us?
What you guys opinion about this phone? After Christmas I will look at new one, and this beast is in my eyes not as Number 1 .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pre-note:
i dont own a Xperia Z5 Premium but i plan on getting my self one and till then ill be keeping my eye out on it for info
1. Sport mode will try to reduce ISO while keeping shutter speed fast but also slow enough to capture pictures, it may take a couple attempts to get a decent pic but be sure to take plenty in which case
(usualy in any phones case aka manual is good here)
1.2 not sure about focus time in low light, if the phone can see the target well enough then focusing should be as fast as day but if the target is hard to see it may take some time or even multiple tries
2. im not too sure but it does have most of the camera2 api which is only lacking raw support but this isnt too bad as an app like manual camera or open camera can take full control of the camera allowing the user to create somewhat DSLR like photos
- if that doesnt work out you can use some of the xda mods or cameras.
in my opinion after seeing what it has to offer its a extremly worth it device, its been noted to have one of the best phone cameras of 2015 and it also is way faster than any other xperia EVER which is showing a Nexus Esk experience in performance and it has a Snapdragon 810 without heating issues so its actually a extremely well worth device in my opinion
(excuse my poor grammar)