Hey there everyone, I'm making this thread to follow my plans on attempting to convert MiFare classic/1k tags to Desfire of FeliCa type tags.
Before people go telling me it cannot be done, IS THIS NOT THE 'NFC HACKING' FORUM!?
Let me have my fun and see what i'm able to do and learn on my own.
For now, I'm getting my hands on some different types of tags and cards, and i'm getting a Sydney Opal card soon (don't know what this uses yet)
I have also ordered a Sony RC-S320 Contactless IC Card Reader/Writer from eBay, got this for $30.
I know it can read/write FeliCa type, and NDEF type tags, interested in if it can do anything else too, can't find much documentation on it.. D:
Anyway basically my point with this is a family member that is techie in my family has set up some secret messages on NFC tags he got off eBay, and refuses to tell me what they are even though he got MiFare classic tags, and my I9505 cannot read them. He said just this: 'Deal With It'
>>
So my boredom helped me decide that I will get myself a bunch of different cards, a USB writer, and ill give a shot at making an app/program to do things with them.
This thread will also serve as documentation for the RC-S320 because there is none available and from the little I have seen, I THINK that it can emulate an NFC tag, which is something I see come up often on here. So I'll just write down what I find.
According to our manufacturer they're all NDEF formatted but even if it was detected as a DESFire chip it would still not work with any Broadcom controller. It's like trying to make a Pentium 4 an AMD Athlon.
TaggerNFC said:
According to our manufacturer they're all NDEF formatted but even if it was detected as a DESFire chip it would still not work with any Broadcom controller. It's like trying to make a Pentium 4 an AMD Athlon.
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Are you able to shed me some light on why it is incompatible, yet able to detect the cards and their unique ID? c:
>serious question
CountParadox said:
Are you able to shed me some light on why it is incompatible, yet able to detect the cards and their unique ID? c:
>serious question
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Simply put, we just know that NXP sell's our manufacturer the chips and they pre-program them. This can not be changed. It's not technically impossible but it would have to be done at the chip manufacturing level.
I know the MiFare Classic can have it's unique ID read by the Broadcom controller but for it to actually read the rest of the tag you would need to modify the reader itself. You can't make the MiFare Classic tag a NFC Forum type tag and unfortunately it will stay that way. I have consulted the engineers at our manufacturer that deals with NXP and he said that it's a possibility that needs to be explored but the first step he say's is to write to the read-only partitions which is seemingly impossible.
On another note, we offer competitive pricing on NFC tags. Please refer to my sig to visit our website.
There is nothing read-only if you have the right card - for example UID is fixed on all consumer cards, but cards with changeable UID still exist. So unless the card is different on a hardware-level (like some additional crypto-support) then it is possible to make it into almost anything.
zvieratko said:
There is nothing read-only if you have the right card - for example UID is fixed on all consumer cards, but cards with changeable UID still exist. So unless the card is different on a hardware-level (like some additional crypto-support) then it is possible to make it into almost anything.
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Well we only sell consumer cards so we wouldn't know much about cards that are fully rewriteable. It's easier just to buy NFC Forum type tags so that compatibility isn't a issue.
Related
Asked this in this thread but as it's a bit tangential to the topic, thought I'd ask here.
Basically wondering if I have the process right for just playing around and scanning your keycards/CCs.
1. Enable NFC on phone.
2. Install an NFC taginfo app (NFC Taginfo by Research Labs or TagInfo by NXP for example)
3. Open app.
4. Put card under/near phone
5. It should then scan it and display info
Curious because nothing seems to happen when I try and so wondering if I'm missing something obvious, if I have a hardware problem, or maybe none of my cards actually are of a scannable type (tried a couple CCs which both have chips on them, and my work badge which is some sort of contact read - not sure what sort though).
You have NFC enabled cards?
I've heard of RFID, but not NFC.
NFC is not compatible with RFID (that I know of).
adrynalyne said:
You have NFC enabled cards?
I've heard of RFID, but not NFC.
NFC is not compatible with RFID (that I know of).
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Agreed.
Card as in a credit-card, ya?
Get some tags if you want to play with nfc.
tagstand.com has 'em.
And mobile payments via google wallet at a paypass vendor.
Maybe that's it.
Just the other thread specifically was talking about RFID cards (pulling CC information, unsecured doorpass keys so you can use your phone to swipe into some locations instead of keycard, ski pass cards, etc).
So assumed there was some RFID scanning functionality as well.
ceribaen said:
Maybe that's it.
Just the other thread specifically was talking about RFID cards (pulling CC information, unsecured doorpass keys so you can use your phone to swipe into some locations instead of keycard, ski pass cards, etc).
So assumed there was some RFID scanning functionality as well.
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As far as I know, there is no app that is capable of emulating RFID (yet).
adrynalyne said:
As far as I know, there is no app that is capable of emulating RFID (yet).
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As I understand it, the code is actually already present but blocked by google for security reasons. They use that security chip they brag about in all the Google Wallet documentation to enable RFID emulation mode.
The big thing to keep in mind is that RFID cards can come in 125 kHz and 13.56 MHz variants. NFC is 13.56 MHz as well, and can theoretically emulate 13.56 MHz cards perfectly, but it cannot read or emulate 125 kHz cards, now or ever.
Here in Montreal the subway transportation card is called OPUS and is based on the MIFARE system. Can I get an app to at least dublicate the card so I don't have to card the OPUS with me?
I'd like to know that too.
Why has my messages been deleted ? Anyway, bump.
That would be awesome. Did you have any news from that?
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snoopmtl said:
That would be awesome. Did you have any news from that?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using xda app-developers app
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what is nfc?
Near Field Communication (or Communicator)
Basically like a Direct WiFi to WiFi from a device to another device. If you ever used a transport card (Here in Montreal, it's called OPUS) to validate your entry to the bus, well that uses NFC. Thing is, these devices are hard coded and "almost" impossible to crack without the official source.
Satrack said:
Near Field Communication (or Communicator)
Basically like a Direct WiFi to WiFi from a device to another device. If you ever used a transport card (Here in Montreal, it's called OPUS) to validate your entry to the bus, well that uses NFC. Thing is, these devices are hard coded and "almost" impossible to crack without the official source.
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By default, the NXP PN53X controller in your Android device doesn't support Mifare Ultralight card emulation, though it does support Mifare 1K and FeliCa. The OPUS cards are Mifare Ultralights. Your best bet for card emulation is the OpenPCD2 reader. This piece of hardware has a ARM processor instead of a Secure Element, so you can write firmware and feed it directly to the PN53X NFC controller
Read Mifare Classic Cards?
__multiplex said:
By default, the NXP PN53X controller in your Android device doesn't support Mifare Ultralight card emulation, though it does support Mifare 1K and FeliCa. The OPUS cards are Mifare Ultralights. Your best bet for card emulation is the OpenPCD2 reader. This piece of hardware has a ARM processor instead of a Secure Element, so you can write firmware and feed it directly to the PN53X NFC controller
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A couple of things 1. The OPUS card AFAICS is based on Mifare Classic. 2. My Nexus S "reads" the card but can not decipher it i.e It can't tell me basic info like rides left, who the card belongs to (I asked them to encode my address in case I loose it"
3. STM uses disposable Mifare Ultralight Cards for the "occasionnelle" user; these too are "readable" and according to the read out "Formatable" but all attempts to do so fail.
4. I read somewhere about being able to to more with the NFC controller if you plug it into a PC and use the ADB SDK
Can anyone verify this info....Thanks.
Does anyone know a good Youtube video with NFC demonstrations?
---------- Post added at 02:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:10 PM ----------
Found a good one!
ethan_hines said:
A couple of things 1. The OPUS card AFAICS is based on Mifare Classic. 2. My Nexus S "reads" the card but can not decipher it i.e It can't tell me basic info like rides left, who the card belongs to (I asked them to encode my address in case I loose it"
3. STM uses disposable Mifare Ultralight Cards for the "occasionnelle" user; these too are "readable" and according to the read out "Formatable" but all attempts to do so fail.
4. I read somewhere about being able to to more with the NFC controller if you plug it into a PC and use the ADB SDK
Can anyone verify this info....Thanks.
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1. OPUS card is apparently based on ATMEL 8820 series controller. It cannot be MIFARE Classic because Classic uses ISO 14443-A protocol, while NFC TagInfo app identifies OPUS as ISO 14443-B type.
3. Formatting "Occasionnelle" fails because they've introduced OTP bits in March 2014 and any attempt to scan a card with initial content in RW area (pages 4-15) with non-zero OTP area results in ERROR 200 and the card gets locked with all lock bits (becomes fully read-only).
This problem can be solved on emutag.com with MIFARE Ultralight Emulator called EMUTAG.
I found out my phone doesn't have NFC capabilities (Samsung Galaxy S2) and I hear there are external readers available that use the sim card slot or SD card slot. I was wondering if anyone has tried them and if there are any limitations compared to integrated NFC on a standard mobile phone.
I'm doing a project on NFC and its basically buy one of these or get my hands on a Nexus S.
Careful there buddy, your confusing things. What is it you want to do? Do you want to use your phone like a card, or do you want to read other cards? Either way, if your phone does not have any nfc capabilities, then that means you have neither the nfc antenna, nor the nfc controller, nor a secure element. The only way to get NFC capability to a non capable phone would be to use an sd card that brings all the components I just mentioned with it. I don't know of any company to currently sell that.
But before you go running after a new phone, be warned, if your project has anything to do with using your phone as a card, just let it go. Not worth buying a phone just for that as your project may probably fail.
My project deals with reading data off a card, altering the data and either writing the new data to the card or emulating it.
Are you saying this isn't possible with the SD readers or current phones ?
You could try to find a NFC-enabled battery for your S2.
Fennem said:
My project deals with reading data off a card, altering the data and either writing the new data to the card or emulating it.
Are you saying this isn't possible with the SD readers or current phones ?
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Reading and writing to a card is possible as long as it complies to the nfc forum specifications. That means your phone can read most of the NFC Forum Tags and cards that generally comply to iso 14443 A or B. Some of the phones can also write Mifare Classic cards. It basicly depends on the NFC controller inside your smartphone. Smartphones that use NXP's PN544 chip for example have the capability to read and write them.
As for the SD, this is rather an open case. Adding NFC functionality to a non capable phone is not that easy to acchieve. In most cases you ned to equip your phone with secure element, nfc controller and nfc antenna. In order to do so you need hardware that basicly provides all of that. I read about some microSD cards that may bring all the components, but I haven't seen anyone sell them. It's definitly easier to buy a new phone that has all the capabilities you need.
Emulating a card is currently a dead end for third party devs. Unless you can talk to one of the big players like MNOs, TSMs or handsetmanufacturer you will be out of luck. If you are ok with rooting your phone and loosing warranty etc. you can maybe get card emulation to work. An example for it to work would be the app simplytapp that is available only for users of the cyanogenmod 9.1 and 10.
Buy a galaxy nexus
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So the country I'm visiting has these nfc bus fare tickets and they're pretty cheap and I'd like to use them after they're useless as nfc tags. Problem is they seem to be write protected. Does that mean there's no way to write to them or can they be overwritten? I'm a total noob at this whole nfc thing but I did manage to figure out that it's mifare ultralight. Any program I could use on Win7? And if there is can I use my phone (S4) as some usb nfc reader?
Write protected means you can't override them. However, you can use your phone and NFC Retag to do some cool stuff
you can't overwrite them, but there's already something written on them that you can use to identify that tag. so you could still use it to let your phone do something when you put it near it
I-TensE-I said:
Problem is they seem to be write protected. Does that mean there's no way to write to them or can they be overwritten?
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How do you know they are write protected ?
Ive used an android app to read nfc tags which also claims to be able to write to them... I dont remember its name, but there's a few that do.
They have introduced NFC bus cards here in Australia over the past 12-18 months and ive become curious.
Stores have the ability to 'add credit' to them via some device they posses so I doubt they are (at least the ones here) write protected... just probably encrypted.
I only have a galaxy S2 which has no NFC so I havent had much chance to investigate, but I did have a quick look at a few cards with my friends S5, which reads the cards fine.
I would be curious what happens if you 'cash up' a card... read and store the nfc data, then write it back to the same card once the card runs low. Though in all honesty I doubt it is that easy... but who knows... maybe it is
We've had these cards in England... Since... Forever?
Shops can top them up, but I think that it doesn't actually write anything to them. Instead, it gets the cards ID then looks it up on the bus companies database, tops it up. And probably charges something from the guy in the shop.
I don't know for sure, but I think this is what is going on. Or someone would have cracked the encryption on these already.
there are different versions of cards, and also different security settings.
there is a soft protection, a permanent protection and it is also possible to password protect some cards
Re-Tagging the tags should do the trick, i guess
Hey guys. What I would like to ask is would it be possible to create another card for myself to school so I don't have to take my card out every time i can just use an NFC tag sticked to the back of my phone. I cannot find an answer to this and I would really like an expert to answer it. Preferable you developer guys. All i want to achieve is read the info of card then just write the read info to an NFC tag.
Thank you so much!
Sorry, it's a MIFARE Classic card MF1S50
Give this a try: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.skjolberg.nfc.clone2
Yeah i tried Tag Cloner before sadly it says it's unsupported
if its mifare classic and you have a modern phone it wont work.
the broadcom chipset used in phones like the samsung s4, nexus 5 etc, doesnt support mifare classic/s50.
try on an older device
you may ave to clone the UID though, send milkyzone a message on ebay and they might be able to get you fully blank cards that you can change the UID of....
you might wanna check with your school though if youre allowed to do this
CountParadox said:
if its mifare classic and you have a modern phone it wont work.
the broadcom chipset used in phones like the samsung s4, nexus 5 etc, doesnt support mifare classic/s50.
try on an older device
you may ave to clone the UID though, send milkyzone a message on ebay and they might be able to get you fully blank cards that you can change the UID of....
you might wanna check with your school though if you're allowed to do this
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Hey, well I have an LG G2 so it most likely doesn't have the NXP chip. Yeah the thing is i'd want to use my phone as the card reader for cloning, not sure if that would work. I was thinking of the NFC tools in Kali and booting that from my phone so maybe then it would recognize the reader, not sure though. Yeah I heard of the fully blank cards I was more concerned about doing it without buying an NFC reader for my PC. Yeah haha school might nit allow it but my goal is to just be able to do it haha, the sense of achievement.
Would i be able to write MiFare Classic cards with my phone using Kali? Or does the writing capability depend on the card? Cuz for sure my phone detects it as i used the app NFC ReTag to just assign functions depending on the UID. THanks
Simple and short answer, almost all modern Smart-phones can't read or write Mifare Classic, because they use Broadcom chips to handle NFC. And those Broadcom chips can't handle the proprietary Mifare Classic protocol from NXP. But you can try it with your computer and maybe a reader with a chip like the PN533 and libnfc.
Is it possible to clone tags to another tag. My work phone Samsung S5 mini is the reader and I have to scan the tags to say I'm at this place. My Samsung S6 Edge reads the tag type as Ultralight C, NTAG216.
Your Help would be appreciated
sammie786 said:
Is it possible to clone tags to another tag. My work phone Samsung S5 mini is the reader and I have to scan the tags to say I'm at this place. My Samsung S6 Edge reads the tag type as Ultralight C, NTAG216.
Your Help would be appreciated
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Probably not with your phone alone. As stated above these newer phones do not have a compatible chipset. If you buy an nfc reader/writer online with the correct chipset you might be able to but its not simple especially if you have to overcome protection. Investing money in this might not be worth it especially if you are not 100% certain it will work. You can buy empty or unlocked cards on ebay they aren't too expensive but to actually write them you'd have to acquire information from the TAG with a good reader. Replaying the card with your phone is not possible.