Develop Bugs

Still Worth It?

So now after a few months on the market. Is this phone still worth purchasing or is there something significantly better coming along within 3 months that will blow this out of the water. If the products that are coming out are comparable I still see this as a viable option for an upgrade from the Thunderbolt (or am I insane?).
Anyways, hope to get some feedback regarding this to assist. Thanks!

Kind of hard to answer since most new phones are announced at mobile world congress which is next month. As of this second on Verizon there is nothing better. You can argue the rezound is equal with each having pros and cons but nothing is in the pipeline yet.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App

staticx57 said:
Kind of hard to answer since most new phones are announced at mobile world congress which is next month. As of this second on Verizon there is nothing better. You can argue the rezound is equal with each having pros and cons but nothing is in the pipeline yet.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA App
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This Mobile world congress convention that you mentioned. The phones that are going to be announced here will still have release dates that are months away from the actual event right? So best case those 'new' phones will be coming out ~5-6 months from now or are they actually being released to the public at this event?
If the resound is the only comparable phone, the Verizon Galaxy Nexus does indeed still sound way better (for me at least).

it depends on what your looking for, better hardware specs, pure android with great support with updates, or themed android with a lack of updates. Not saying those phones announced at CES are crappy, but if you want a phone that is guaranteed dev support/android updates then i'd recommend the Nexus. Yea they may have other phones that may beat it in hardware specs, but will those phones get the updates and the support that the nexus is and will be getting??? I seriously doubt it, not saying that they won't get support at all, but if u want the best experience of android, i'd recommend the nexus, i had the Epic 4g Touch(Galaxy S II) and i liked it, but i LOVE my nexus, it does everything i need it to, no complaints here, and the battery is great i get right at 2 days on one charge, u should get it, u won't regret it

G1-8701 said:
it depends on what your looking for, better hardware specs, pure android with great support with updates, or themed android with a lack of updates. Not saying those phones announced at CES are crappy, but if you want a phone that is guaranteed dev support/android updates then i'd recommend the Nexus. Yea they may have other phones that may beat it in hardware specs, but will those phones get the updates and the support that the nexus is and will be getting??? I seriously doubt it, not saying that they won't get support at all, but if u want the best experience of android, i'd recommend the nexus, i had the Epic 4g Touch(Galaxy S II) and i liked it, but i LOVE my nexus, it does everything i need it to, no complaints here, and the battery is great i get right at 2 days on one charge, u should get it, u won't regret it
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I am on the verge of pulling the pin and just getting it. Is the amount of development activity similar to what it was with the Nexus One (my last nexus phone)? I remember crack flashing nightly with all the goodies that were available. I took a looksey in the development forum (I will be with Verizon if I get it) and saw a few good things in there.
Are any of you guys currently running a custom ROM and if so, has the custom ROM development still in its infancy or is there some decent work being put out by all the developers (donations to custom developers are a part of the cost of the phone in my book )?

Chopes said:
Are any of you guys currently running a custom ROM and if so, has the custom ROM development still in its infancy or is there some decent work being put out by all the developers (donations to custom developers are a part of the cost of the phone in my book )?
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Well the difference between stock 4.0.1 and AOKP+Franco was just ridiculous.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

The Galaxy S III will probably blow the Nexus away, but who knows how long until it's released after it's announced at MWC. I don't really know the timeframes for that sort of thing.

case0 said:
The Galaxy S III will probably blow the Nexus away, but who knows how long until it's released after it's announced at MWC. I don't really know the timeframes for that sort of thing.
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If I was going to buy a phone today I would still get the Galaxy Nexus. 6 Months to a year from now will of course be a different story. If you live in the United States we always seem to wait forever for the best stuff. EU seems to be ahead of us when it comes to the latest and greatest phones.
Good Luck!

case0 said:
The Galaxy S III will probably blow the Nexus away, but who knows how long until it's released after it's announced at MWC. I don't really know the timeframes for that sort of thing.
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Sure, for about 9 months. Then the GN gets Jellybean, or Jello, or whatever. Meanwhile the GS3 gets a "Value Pack" which is subsequently pulled before it's even done because Samsung wants to sell the GS4 to you. Vote with your wallet, and vote for hardware which will get 2 years of support. Even if you flash, having up-to-date drivers makes it a lot easier to build custom ROM's.

case0 said:
The Galaxy S III will probably blow the Nexus away, but who knows how long until it's released after it's announced at MWC. I don't really know the timeframes for that sort of thing.
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Since you aren't living in the United States. MWC will announce Galaxy S3 and the U.S. will get it like 8 months later because each carrier wants something to "woo" their customers with exclusive features and all these small little variants of the Galaxy S3.
By the time that all comes out, it'll be launched with a old OS and Nexus 4 will be announced.
I stay committed to only Nexus devices simply because they will last longer. Especially with a great development community.
Sometimes, the community makes the phone.

I'm back! Sold my sIII

just traded my galaxy s 3 for galaxy nexus plus 280 dollars. Running jelly bean 4.1 .1 on verizon network . I feel like a heroin addict I just got shot up. I could not definitely wait for the update on the galaxy s 3 to get jelly bean. Best decision I've made. So happy. guess I'll wait for the galaxy nexus 4. Cheers see you guys around
Sent from my verizon Galaxy Nexus running 4.1.1 using xda app-developers app

I'm doing the same thing tomorrow. Love the S3, but the bootloader issue is a deal breaker.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda premium

LOL And here I thought I was bad at deciding what phone I want
Hey, I'm glad you are happy, in the end that's really what matters, no matter how good or bad the phone is, if you are happy with it, then everything else is irrelevant. Maybe that's how all the iSheep feel like!

Lol.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

I bought a refurb SIII and base on how it is I will decide to keep the Nexus or sell it. What factors made your decision to go back to the Nexus?
tsnstuff said:
Maybe that's how all the iSheep feel like!
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Until they walk on the other side with the greener grass.

Yes, I disabled all the bloatware on my s 3. But I still can't get over the fact you can't put apps in folders . I love the simplicity of the nexus. I love jelly bean. Actually even prefer the size to the nexus.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

Fstall303 said:
just traded my galaxy s 3 for galaxy nexus plus 280 dollars
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WAYNE?! :banghead:

that bootloader issue is the same that me and many others had when the first atrix was released, it was annoying seeing others flashing roms and i'm stuck with a great phone with potential but a locked bootloader. Then by the time they finally unlocked the bootloader most devs/users had abandoned the device and it hardly got any support. But anyways, i kept my Nexus(that i bought a month after launch) and bought an iphone 4s about 2 months ago, i love it, its a great device and iOS is a lot better than what people been saying about it, but after flashing JB then trying AOKP milestone 6 made me realize how much i miss my Nexus. The SGSIII was never a factor to me(i really don't like the design, plus touchwiz is not one of my favs coming from a SGSII to a Nexus). Also another small reason that i decided to try the iphone is because every phone will get the latest update(unless it's outdated like the very first iphone) and that plays a huge role when i buy phones due to the fact i would like a phone that'll get the latest updates or at least great dev support, cause i wouldn't wanna have to buy another phone due to the fact that it won't be getting upcoming updates, or the devs abandoned it......

Fstall303 said:
Yes, I disabled all the bloatware on my s 3. But I still can't get over the fact you can't put apps in folders . I love the simplicity of the nexus. I love jelly bean. Actually even prefer the size to the nexus.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
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Not disagreeing about going from gs3 to gnex because I did the same thing, but you can absolutely put apps in folders on the gs3. You just can't drop an app onto another on the home screen, you have to hit the menu button first and then create a folder into which you can then add any apps you want and then rename the folder.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

G1-8701 said:
that bootloader issue is the same that me and many others had when the first atrix was released, it was annoying seeing others flashing roms and i'm stuck with a great phone with potential but a locked bootloader. Then by the time they finally unlocked the bootloader most devs/users had abandoned the device and it hardly got any support. But anyways, i kept my Nexus(that i bought a month after launch) and bought an iphone 4s about 2 months ago, i love it, its a great device and iOS is a lot better than what people been saying about it, but after flashing JB then trying AOKP milestone 6 made me realize how much i miss my Nexus. The SGSIII was never a factor to me(i really don't like the design, plus touchwiz is not one of my favs coming from a SGSII to a Nexus). Also another small reason that i decided to try the iphone is because every phone will get the latest update(unless it's outdated like the very first iphone) and that plays a huge role when i buy phones due to the fact i would like a phone that'll get the latest updates or at least great dev support, cause i wouldn't wanna have to buy another phone due to the fact that it won't be getting upcoming updates, or the devs abandoned it......
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...Where does the iPhone fit into this conversation?

G1-8701 said:
that bootloader issue is the same that me and many others had when the first atrix was released, it was annoying seeing others flashing roms and i'm stuck with a great phone with potential but a locked bootloader. Then by the time they finally unlocked the bootloader most devs/users had abandoned the device and it hardly got any support. But anyways, i kept my Nexus(that i bought a month after launch) and bought an iphone 4s about 2 months ago, i love it, its a great device and iOS is a lot better than what people been saying about it, but after flashing JB then trying AOKP milestone 6 made me realize how much i miss my Nexus. The SGSIII was never a factor to me(i really don't like the design, plus touchwiz is not one of my favs coming from a SGSII to a Nexus). Also another small reason that i decided to try the iphone is because every phone will get the latest update(unless it's outdated like the very first iphone) and that plays a huge role when i buy phones due to the fact i would like a phone that'll get the latest updates or at least great dev support, cause i wouldn't wanna have to buy another phone due to the fact that it won't be getting upcoming updates, or the devs abandoned it......
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Dont kid yourself with the whole my iphone will always get the latest updates stuff. Sure you will get an update, but that update will only give all the new features and bells and whistles to the newest iphone. I have owned several iphones and the problems with their updates is that they design them to be compatible with all the phones but that doesnt mean they run great on all the phones. I remember when i had the Iphone 3g and they came out with the 4.0 update, it made the phone so unbearably slow that everyone with that phone had to revert back to 3.0. Apple even just announced that the 3gs which they are still selling in stores wont get most of the features of the 6.0 update.

just saying how i came back to the Nexus too, its all relevant to the topic

Did not know that! Either way still completely satisfied with my nexus
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

A Nexus plus $280?
Not a bad payoff there.

I love my nexus but having owned a 4s out of morbid curiosity for a whole 2 weeks I have to say if I could have 1 thing iOS has on android it would be the ability to back up my phone like they do. I know we have tools and various apps we can use but that's the one and only thing that impressed me was to be able to back up your phone wipe it, and restore everything with one click. Other than that there is no way I will ever own another. They are worse than a Motorola on Verizon.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

I Am Marino said:
A Nexus plus $280?
Not a bad payoff there.
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Click to collapse
Yes plus 280 + extended life battery and case!
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

brunnels1 said:
Dont kid yourself with the whole my iphone will always get the latest updates stuff. Sure you will get an update, but that update will only give all the new features and bells and whistles to the newest iphone. I have owned several iphones and the problems with their updates is that they design them to be compatible with all the phones but that doesnt mean they run great on all the phones. I remember when i had the Iphone 3g and they came out with the 4.0 update, it made the phone so unbearably slow that everyone with that phone had to revert back to 3.0. Apple even just announced that the 3gs which they are still selling in stores wont get most of the features of the 6.0 update.
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i kno that, i'm not the type that would hold on to a phone that long to be that far behind as a 3g, i was saying in general, compared to android which is not always guaranteed an update, and no i'm not bashing android, i been using android since the G1 and definitely a huge android fan, just wanted to try something different for a change, but u do have a point though

eksasol said:
What factors made your decision to go back to the Nexus?"
Honestly the single biggest reason I switch back was because the lock bootloader and no jelly bean . I figure by the time the update jelly bean there gonna be released the galaxy nexus 4 and a new os or update anyway. 2. i hated S voice. 3.the size difference between 4.65 and 4.8 I just hope it's 3 was just too big and the nexus is felt better my hand . The nexus just felt better and the texture as well. 4. I know I only had it for a day but I just didn't like the physical keys, I love the on screen keys. 5. I think it's a better looking phone.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
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Lol I called out that you will start seeing people coming back lol!

good move........

Android 4.3 Jellybean or 4.4 KitKat?

Which would you prefer to get from Sammy as new version? A upcoming version of Android 4.4 KitKat or Last of the Jellybean kind the almighty Android 4.3..
Really curious to see that ya guys thinking.

TeddyOFLove said:
Which would you prefer to get from Sammy as new version? A upcoming version of Android 4.4 KitKat or Last of the Jellybean kind the almighty Android 4.3..
Really curious to see that ya guys thinking.
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Telstra Australia posted that their version of the N2 would be skipping 4.2 and going directly to 4.3; supposedly because that's Samsung's approach globally. Since the N3's on 4.3, and the majority of S Pen apps are probably common with the N2, you could probably assume the N2's skipping 4.2. As for timing, you could probably assume the N3 will be on the market for a couple of months before the N2 receives its 4.3 update. That would allow the N3 some feature exclusivity before the N2 gets whatever common features Samsung's planning to port down.
As for 4.4, Google's reached a new low. Taking money for commercially endorsing a Nestle product (Kit Kat) by naming an Android version after it is proof that monetization now trumps all. Perhaps Key Lime Pie will now be named Marie Callender's or Swanson's Key Lime Pie. As for timing, who the hell knows. Everyone thought the new N7 was going to be the launch for 5.0 and it got 4.3 which was less an upgrade than a fix for 4.2.2. Anyone care to take a guess what's going to be in 4.4 and why a major point release (5.0) is so long in coming? As Google's focus becomes more monetary and their scale continues to grow the quality, timing, and substance of Android releases/updates is becoming more sketchy.
All just my opinion of course

@BarryH_GEG
There was no money exchange in this deal. Read before you form an opinion. Google did it for the lulz and Nestle agreed as it was a free commercial. The article is on the BBC site.
Do you really think Google would have any reason to accept some crummy product placement for the money , how much would Nestle have to pay them for it to register in the companies budget.

lgstoian said:
@BarryH_GEG
There was no money exchange in this deal. Read before you form an opinion. Google did it for the lulz and Nestle agreed as it was a free commercial. The article is on the BBC site.
Do you really think Google would have any reason to accept some crummy product placement for the money , how much would Nestle have to pay them for it to register in the companies budget.
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So you think it's all just some lucky accident for Nestle? Google's need for monetary growth makes the potential millions they'd receive from anyone for "product placement" quite attractive. If Nestle's not paying cash I'd bet Google's receiving some type of non-cash consideration. If you're right though what a great day it is for Nestle; one of the largest food conglomerates in the world. Sorry, I don't believe that "Kit Kat" was just Google being random and that Nestle won the lottery.

lgstoian said:
@BarryH_GEG
There was no money exchange in this deal. Read before you form an opinion. Google did it for the lulz and Nestle agreed as it was a free commercial. The article is on the BBC site.
Do you really think Google would have any reason to accept some crummy product placement for the money , how much would Nestle have to pay them for it to register in the companies budget.
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Click to collapse
Doing it for the lulz? Google is a company not a charity
I'm still hoping its a joke and google will surprise us all with Key Lime Pie
Announcing the new codename and version even before the release is so not google
I started to hate that new guy they hired over from Chrome OS project

What we know for a fact is: we won't get 4.2.2, will jump directly to 4.3, but the update will only come after the Note 3's launch. So expect it around November/December.
Now, the newly announced 4.4 is another thing altogether. An older Sammobile leak informed that the Note II would receive the next version of Android (then rumored to be 5.0 Key Lime Pie). We'll have to wait and see if Samsung ends up porting the Note III version of this release to our phone. Only time will tell on this one.

I am waiting for Android 4.4.23 DönerKebab.

I can't wait 6.3 Toblerone 2017.

Q-Logic said:
I can't wait 6.3 Toblerone 2017.
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Too unstable for me, maybe 5.9 Spinach... Healthy and yummy
Sent from my GT-N7100 using xda premium

6.1 Snickers all the way for me!

So all of you are making up names, Why Marie or Swanson? If the Android is being named after desserts in an alphabetical order, the next one should start with an L.
Key Lime Pie was acceptable because K and L are present in order. The "P" wasn't, maybe the leak was true so they changed because of the P?
Can't wait to get my hands on Kit Kat and go to about>Android Version, and keep touching it, maybe a Kit Kat will hover from the screen and we eat it?

Hope for 4.3 is good. But official 4.4 update will come after note6 release , as update rollout by samsung sucks
sent from my GT-N7100. Press thanks if I helped..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9HH0vqb4q8&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Don't need either one.
Sent from my GT-N7100 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

we will get 4.3 confirmed at unpack note 3 event , will be on october for note 2 and S3

my take on this..
why wouldn't samsng release 4.2.2 or 4.3??
possible reasons :
sales of note 3 will go down.
also it will take down s3, s4 .
and they cant afford "S" series loss because that is samsung's flagship device not note series.
they have to give some excuse so that we wait for it and get less features (look at s3 's leaked fw).
if touchwiz wasnt ready then how come s3 and n7108d got 4.2.2 ..??? and we don't.
may be we get 4.2.2 first then next updates but won't get 4.4 until next year for sure.
its not even considered that note 3 also gets updated to 4.4 yet so forget about it and use the beast for next six months atleast whatever we have.
P.S. look at n7108d got 4.2.2 officially so it will go 4.2.2 to 4.3 to me not 4.4 till next year.:angel::angel::angel:

imho samsung don't upgrade note II to kitkat.. but xda help us

When android goes full circle back to the lettrr A I hope to see android 10.4 APPLE
Sent from my GT-N7100 using xda app-developers app

Ur note 2 will have the same fate like our notes u have to wait for 4.3 until note 3 makes a million mark. Or people wont buy the new note rather will go for a note 2 with 4.3 plus by the time kitkat will come there will be an s5 and samsung have 3 first priority products to upgrade first and the note 2 will be the last to get the updates. This is marketing. This is what samsug does but in the end they give the most finished update any other vendor can just think of.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app

Is it true that note2 will skip an update again & go straight to 4.4 til next year? Im glad note2 will receive an update

Sandata said:
Is it true that note2 will skip an update again & go straight to 4.4 til next year? Im glad note2 will receive an update
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If true then we can't use Samsung GearWatch this year

How many more updates do you think we will get on this phone?

There should be around 2 this year. Would we get that and one next year?

If it's anything like the Galaxy s3 we will get plenty it's slated to get kit kat even
Sent from my massive Note 3 using Tapatalk.

Better question is how many will tmobile approve?
Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

Gauging on the fact the note 2 has been announced to get kitkat. I would assume it's safe to say we'll get 4.5 or whatever the next tier will be. Anything beyond that could be speculation.
posted while using my note 3

like up to 3 major updates at least. This phone has the specs that will make it a top phone for well over a year. I mean the newest phones are still coming out with just 2gb of ram (maybe the S5 will have 3gb) and the CPU at 2.3mhz will be a beast for a long time. Then look at the S3 now confirmed getting 4.4 KK so it's easy to see 3 major updates for this phone and maybe more.

monkey hung said:
There should be around 2 this year. Would we get that and one next year?
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One at the most.

Eric214 said:
like up to 3 major updates at least. This phone has the specs that will make it a top phone for well over a year. I mean the newest phones are still coming out with just 2gb of ram (maybe the S5 will have 3gb) and the CPU at 2.3mhz will be a beast for a long time. Then look at the S3 now confirmed getting 4.4 KK so it's easy to see 3 major updates for this phone and maybe more.
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2.3mhz woooo that's fast man.
How about 2.3GHz lol.
I never look at it as official updates, because our devs will continue to bring support for the newest OS to our device. For instance the Samsung epic 4G keyboard started on Eclair(2.1) and still has JB on it from the dev support.
Sent from my SM-N900T using xda app-developers app

XxLostSoulxX said:
2.3mhz woooo that's fast man.
How about 2.3GHz lol.
I never look at it as official updates, because our deva will continue to bring support for the newest OS to our device. For instance the Samsung epic 4G keyboard started on Eclair(2.1) and still has JB on it from the dev support.
Sent from my SM-N900T using xda app-developers app
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lol yeah it's called a typo. Anyway I'm talking about official updates not ported ROMs

Eric214 said:
lol yeah it's called a typo. Anyway I'm talking about official updates not ported ROMs
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I'm not talking about ported roms and yes if you read my post you'd notice i said that. As far as Official your're looking at 3 Max they only support the phone for 2 years and then ditch support. But most XDA users don't care for Official support as our dev's have more time to just our device specific and are able to support the phone much better and give us a better overall user experience.
Ever heard of AOSP? AOKP? Source Code? Building From The Ground Up? Lol.
We all know that regardless if its Samsung, HTC, LG, Sony, Etc... They take forever because they're not maintaining one phone and that's all. they are bigger companies with several products and several things to be pre-occupied and more geared and focused on.

XxLostSoulxX said:
I'm not talking about ported roms and yes if you read my post you'd notice i said that. As far as Official your're looking at 3 Max they only support the phone for 2 years and then ditch support. But most XDA users don't care for Official support as our dev's have more time to just our device specific and are able to support the phone much better and give us a better overall user experience.
Ever heard of AOSP? AOKP? Source Code? Building From The Ground Up? Lol.
We all know that regardless if its Samsung, HTC, LG, Sony, Etc... They take forever because they're not maintaining one phone and that's all. they are bigger companies with several products and several things to be pre-occupied and more geared and focused on.
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Of course I have, but the guy asked about updates, so i was talking about from Tmo which like I said most likely 3 updates. I used to run CM/Aosp on my Bionic but I got tired of minimalist ROMs with vanilla/bland UI personally. Especially CM. When they went commercial and became Cyanogen Inc. and basically stole from a lot of developers I don't care to use there ROMs anymore. Plus I kinda like a stripped down TW at this point.

I believe google said something about a 18month upgrade.
Basically if a new update comes out, they have to make an update for it.
But im willing to bet we will only get 2 updates. Kitkat and probably a patch or what ever is after that.

touchwiz based nougat ?

This morning I got a message from Verizon advertising two new (to Verizon anyway) models, a LG k20(no misprint) and a Samsung galaxy j7 (wtf are these things lol) they are actually economy models of both manufacturers which really isn't important. What is important is both boasted nougat api. I'm wondering if it would be possible to get tw nougat port for the note 4 . if its being launched on there 99$ phone it must be out for the flagships.

Supposedly there's a rumor of a nougat update in the works for the note 4. Whether it's just a test build and if it'll ever see the light of day is up for speculation, but we might get lucky and get our hands on a leak. The note 5 is set to receive nougat though so that's probably our best bet for a TW nougat option.

kabuk1 said:
Supposedly there's a rumor of a nougat update in the works for the note 4. Whether it's just a test build and if it'll ever see the light of day is up for speculation, but we might get lucky and get our hands on a leak. The note 5 is set to receive nougat though so that's probably our best bet for a TW nougat option.
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I hope you're right and just based on the fact that they had to recall the Note 7, I hope they'd throw us a bone and develop 7.1/7.1.2 for us I could understand if they didn't go further than THAT (i.e. Android 8). I mean, us Note 4 users didn't have any real update options for current year models on the Galaxy Note line when our 2 years was up. I wonder if somehow getting a petition going would help at all, but who knows how many Note 4's are still out there in use. My mom also has one, I've got at least one coworker that had one, I'm not sure if she still does or not.

Deleted

JOSHSKORN said:
I hope you're right and just based on the fact that they had to recall the Note 7, I hope they'd throw us a bone and develop 7.1/7.1.2 for us I could understand if they didn't go further than THAT (i.e. Android 8). I mean, us Note 4 users didn't have any real update options for current year models on the Galaxy Note line when our 2 years was up. I wonder if somehow getting a petition going would help at all, but who knows how many Note 4's are still out there in use. My mom also has one, I've got at least one coworker that had one, I'm not sure if she still does or not.
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We may also have hope with ported S7 nougat ROMs as well.
I doubt a petition would do much good though, Samsung would look at it and go "lol, cute". I agree that we should at least get nougat though. I work at a VZW dealer and I still see a decent amount of Note 4s in use, so it's by no means a dead device. I tend to sort of 'bond' with the N4 users that come into my store and even though I'm obligated to try to get them to upgrade, they always say stuff like "I don't want a new phone, there's nothing out there that does everything this one does!". Makes me happy every time