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Windows mobile phone series 7...
So we went trought the weeks, we heard all the talk, we saw all the pretty images and videos, we really wanted it... and now almost everyone hates is...
however, 1 thing i heard people say OVER and OVER again on sites like pocketnow.com engadget.com ang gizmodo.com is: Dont worry, XDA will have a custom rom for the HD2 in days when its out!!
I always found that strange to hear, i mean the android development has been underway for over a year now and just recently has netripper made some breaktroughs..
so (i think you know what i'm getting at..) will this really be as easy as everyone claims? Isnt it a whole new system, build from the ground up? what are your opinions
My guess is that the HD2 is likely HTCs dev platform for wp7. If that's true I think we'll see it eventually.
if a development rom exists highly likely
if there's not then it may not be possible for the hd2 handset...I would prefer to think there is a development rom
one crazy russian people need only 10hour for rip the blue ray disc... after first time sony relase... and sony say its imposible to rip or rewrite
i think... wm7 come to hd2 but unoficial version... its best phone ever... any lg and samsung canot be better than htc hd2...
domineus said:
if a development rom exists highly likely
if there's not then it may not be possible for the hd2 handset...I would prefer to think there is a development rom
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Click to collapse
what do you mean with development rom? isnt there already 1 posted in the windows 7 forum (1 page back?)
or do you mean something else?
emulated rom is for x86 processors
a developer rom means one that is made for the htc touch hd 2
but that probably wont happen right?
from what i've read, they are indeed trying to do something about the emulator dump, anything. but mainly waiting, for an actual rom.
I guess it's all down to drivers and how similar WinPhoS is to 6.5.x. I mean if it's practically the same, maybe the 6.5.x Hardware drivers will work with a bit of tweaking.
Logicalstep
I think it's possible, It seems the man in the video is using an hd2 phone - http://www.istartedsomething.com/20100318/new-windows-phone-7-series-promo-from-mix10/
lagbaja said:
I think it's possible, It seems the man in the video is using an hd2 phone - http://www.istartedsomething.com/20100318/new-windows-phone-7-series-promo-from-mix10/
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Click to collapse
Huh?? I never saw that video thats crazy, what the hell were they thinking? also, didnt htc tell us like a year ago that we WOULD get the upgrade..
anyways, dont really wanna go off track here, there are already 34,600 threads on the HD2 not getting the upgrade, i want this one to be about how likely a custom rom would be
Here's a snapshot..
Logicalstep said:
I guess it's all down to drivers and how similar WinPhoS is to 6.5.x. I mean if it's practically the same, maybe the 6.5.x Hardware drivers will work with a bit of tweaking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We already know that the driver architecture has changed completely.
ragdoll20 said:
Huh?? I never saw that video thats crazy, what the hell were they thinking? also, didnt htc tell us like a year ago that we WOULD get the upgrade..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They definitely did not.
ragdoll20 said:
anyways, dont really wanna go off track here, there are already 34,600 threads on the HD2 not getting the upgrade, i want this one to be about how likely a custom rom would be
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It really does all come down to the question of whether or not there is a working version of WP7S running on an HD2 somewhere already; and such a thing must have been created with a great deal of input from Microsoft. If this exists, and it leaks, then that might be used as the basis for a custom ROM. If it doesn't exist, or it doesn't leak, it's not going to happen.
The problem, as already alluded to, is drivers: the only possible source of device drivers for a WP7S custom ROM is Microsoft - they need to have specifically written drivers for HD2 hardware.
Even if such a thing does leak in somewhat unfinished form, there are still some question-marks. For example, unless it allows the HD2 to treat an installed SD card as if it were built-in flash memory, you would be limited to just half a gigabyte of storage space for everything - photos, videos, apps, the lot. (Real WP7S phones won't use SD cards at all, they will only have built-in memory.)
Shasarak said:
We already know that the driver architecture has changed completely.
They definitely did not.
It really does all come down to the question of whether or not there is a working version of WP7S running on an HD2 somewhere already; and such a thing must have been created with a great deal of input from Microsoft. If this exists, and it leaks, then that might be used as the basis for a custom ROM. If it doesn't exist, or it doesn't leak, it's not going to happen.
The problem, as already alluded to, is drivers: the only possible source of device drivers for a WP7S custom ROM is Microsoft - they need to have specifically written drivers for HD2 hardware.
Even if such a thing does leak in somewhat unfinished form, there are still some question-marks. For example, unless it allows the HD2 to treat an installed SD card as if it were built-in flash memory, you would be limited to just half a gigabyte of storage space for everything - photos, videos, apps, the lot. (Real WP7S phones won't use SD cards at all, they will only have built-in memory.)
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Click to collapse
Very good point. And half a gigabyte for everything is really, really not enough.
This is why I never look at custom ROMs and stuff like that. Even if somebody gets 7 Series working on the HD2 (or Android), it will not be a good experience. If the HD2 was not meant for 7 Series, you should not try to change it's fate (or whatever haha). If you want 7 Series: get a 7 Series device. If you want Android: get an Android device.
Btw, that movie somebody posted of the man with the HD2 running 7 Series: beautiful! I knew it would look incredible... so so bad, that it is not getting that upgrade. But hey, I am looking forward to the HTC Desire
Not to nitpick but the emulator has shown that there is SD card support, just artificially disabled (likely.) If we were to get a dev ROM, I'd imagine it would had support included for that very reason (512 just aint enough!)
Again, unlikely though.
Also. MS might delibertaly put swomething in the code to make sure it will not work with the HD2.
As for the video. Yes they are using a HD2, but this doesn't mean that it was running WP7s. They could easily have overlayed the image of the OS ontop of the original video in post-production. Otherwise did you also think that the screens float in the air above the phone too? It does in the video.
Shasarak said:
We already know that the driver architecture has changed completely.
They definitely did not.
It really does all come down to the question of whether or not there is a working version of WP7S running on an HD2 somewhere already; and such a thing must have been created with a great deal of input from Microsoft. If this exists, and it leaks, then that might be used as the basis for a custom ROM. If it doesn't exist, or it doesn't leak, it's not going to happen.
The problem, as already alluded to, is drivers: the only possible source of device drivers for a WP7S custom ROM is Microsoft - they need to have specifically written drivers for HD2 hardware.
Even if such a thing does leak in somewhat unfinished form, there are still some question-marks. For example, unless it allows the HD2 to treat an installed SD card as if it were built-in flash memory, you would be limited to just half a gigabyte of storage space for everything - photos, videos, apps, the lot. (Real WP7S phones won't use SD cards at all, they will only have built-in memory.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not quite true, Microsoft have stated (see engadget) that although the OS will still support SD cards (albeit internal), they're restricting hardware makers to put the SD cards in the device to prevent users swapping them out, if one was to disassemble their device and swap the SD card, then they should lose all their data however, they could get it all back from "the cloud".
i thinks its very likely, remember years back when i had htc magician and scrapping for wm 6.1 in it, everybody says that impossible so i had to buy hermes and dang when i rest magian and use hermes, godlike collatula make wm 6.1 run on magician
so, i still believe leo can run WM7
#1 Windows Phone 7 sucks. It's actually a downgrade from WM6.5.
#2 Phone 7 should technically work on HD2, so long as someone makes a rom with it.
#3 Hope Android development progresses really fast for HD2.
Alize said:
Not quite true, Microsoft have stated (see engadget) that although the OS will still support SD cards (albeit internal), they're restricting hardware makers to put the SD cards in the device to prevent users swapping them out, if one was to disassemble their device and swap the SD card, then they should lose all their data however, they could get it all back from "the cloud".
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Click to collapse
I'm not sure that Microsoft did actually say that. What they said was along the lines of "WP7S won't support a removable memory card"; Engadget pounced on the word "removable" and the rest was based purely on speculation.
As Windows Phone 7 was launched today we wanted to put up a poll based on general perception of the device. If you could buy one today, money not being an issue, would you? We want to see whether Windows phone 7 has been received well by the community.
Cheers,
Steve & XDA News Staff
Wow first one to vote, maybe im just abit excited lol.
Omnia 7 is at the top of my list atm. GSMARENA has a good review of the device already (no idea how they got hold of it)
Im gonna hang on to my current device and by a WP7 phone when they start coming out with a second line of phones.
just bought my desire. WinMo 7 doesn't look too customizable, but only time will tell
Former long time windows mobile user, not impressed, Ill stick with my EVO for now.
Going to get a better Android phone I think... probably Samsung Epic 4G now or Evo (more than the WP7) ones now.
Once I see multiple calendar support, we'll talk. As for now: never.
Like a lot of people here, I have a HTC HD2 and am running WM6.5 and Android 2.2 on it. So, for me, I'll consider a WP7 device once my HD2 either dies (let's pray it never happens) or maybe in 6-12months when it's time for an upgrade.
Casey_boy said:
Like a lot of people here, I have a HTC HD2 and am running WM6.5 and Android 2.2 on it. So, for me, I'll consider a WP7 device once my HD2 either dies (let's pray it never happens) or maybe in 6-12months when it's time for an upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me too.... HD2 forever
Our beloved HD2s can run any OS so why switch to WP7 when the HD2 already runs it (Not public yet!)
The hardware in most (currently presented) WP7 devices is as good as our HD2's
So.. maybe I will buy one if the hardware is superior to the HD2's!!!
Intervenient said:
Once I see multiple calendar support, we'll talk. As for now: never.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Um, there is multiple calendar support.
Looks great to me, especially the Dell Venue Pro.
Sure, why not. Every HTC phone that I have had was Windows. Why would I give up now? I have played with the HTC EVO running Android, and I do not like it. I prefer Windows. That is my own personal opinion and choice from experience, and somewhat from what I have spoken with other people who have Android phones from different manufactures, which I have personaly tried and played with for a while with each and every one of them.
I just prefer Windows over anything else.
maybe and unsure is about the same.
im hoping it can be ported to the hd2. that'll save me some money
for sure i will buy the WP7 phone HD7 i think... as i am HTC fan as well as WM.
Not at this time. I love the interface. I just don't like the rest of the story. The system just locks you in. Perhaps if could be jailbroken, that would change things.
Well I got the HTC Desire on Android 2.2 and thus far I don't see anything I prefer in the Win 7 phones that would make me switch. If anything it has less functionality at present with no cut & paste, no tethering and no SD card. I do like some of the features though but will wait and see how they develop this, so for now it's a no.
I think Microsoft has missed a trick with the launch of WP7, by basing the OS entirely for phone devices. As with Android it can be used not only on phones but tablets as well and judging by how the community response to the Sammy Tab is high with enthusiasm i think MS should have looked further forward than just Windows 'Phone' 7 and evolved further ahead with appying its new OS to tablets as well, even if not making it available now but atleast showing a mock up to show its potential of being more than just a phone OS.
Grimeh said:
Well I got the HTC Desire on Android 2.2 and thus far I don't see anything I prefer in the Win 7 phones that would make me switch. If anything it has less functionality at present with no cut & paste, no tethering and no SD card. I do like some of the features though but will wait and see how they develop this, so for now it's a no.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What?!? no cut & paste and no sd cards? where can I read up on WP7 features?
Also long time and big time WinMo fan, but I got the EVO and after rooting it, nothing can come close. Win7 simply went the way of iPhone, by locking everything down, so even if it weren't for the rooted EVO being so damned awesome and far above every other phone out there, I wouldn't get a Win7 phone out of iPhone-hatin' spite.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
i've seen the video with xda.cn in it for hd2 running wp7.
however i found this one. comparing hd2 with wp7 in it with htc mozart i guess.
check it out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXuJlpu3NXU&feature=player_embedded
i was just gonna post that. its a vid from xda.cn. looks like theres more progress on the chinese site than xda-dev. they got calling and most apps worked out it seems like.
Think the speed of boot suggests it's definitely running from SD card... like Android at the mo.
Also no HTC hub - bloatware I know but it's oh so pretty!
Anyway great step forward and surprisingly smooth for an initial port. I think from this video it is pretty clear this is not fake and is not a theme as well....
I also don't think this is a fake port, and to tell the truth, even if it is, bring it on anyway, I have never seen any fake thing running this smooth and would like to try it anyway.
This only looks to be an old port, not a fake one.
Great work.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
They have some info about about it, as well as the new video
you can go to iwindroid.com because xda wont let me post links
cant wait!!! hope we get some more news soon
Please keep discussions in WP7 general! This forum is for developmental purposes only.
~~Tito~~
adamelphick said:
Think the speed of boot suggests it's definitely running from SD card... like Android at the mo.
Also no HTC hub - bloatware I know but it's oh so pretty!
Anyway great step forward and surprisingly smooth for an initial port. I think from this video it is pretty clear this is not fake and is not a theme as well....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not think it is running from SD card cus the boot text is in the top corner where normally it would be in the bottom corner. Also if it was running from sd card it would have to be lauched from within winmo 6.5. So it looks like a nand boot.
This is real, but is a VERY old beta version that was designed for testing on the HD2, they abandoned it as it is missing the hardware graphics acceleration. You won't see much higher than this on the HD2
owenw said:
This is real, but is a VERY old beta version that was designed for testing on the HD2, they abandoned it as it is missing the hardware graphics acceleration. You won't see much higher than this on the HD2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pure speculation..... all we've seen are some very convincing videos that are most likely not fake. We still don't know who is behind all this porting and the exact details of what has been done.
shaolin85 said:
i've seen the video with xda.cn in it for hd2 running wp7.
however i found this one. comparing hd2 with wp7 in it with htc mozart i guess.
check it out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXuJlpu3NXU&feature=player_embedded
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think its nice that these guys are able to do this but what good will it be without access to any services?? ie zune, xbox, facebook??
ms is blocking all phones with non official roms on them.. look here http://www.wpcentral.com/hack-xbox-live-windows-phone-7-get-perma-banned-microsoft?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+wmexperts+(wpcentral)&utm_content=Google+Reader
It would be nice to be able to boot into it to play around with... as long as it doesn't copy over winmo on nand. Also hopefully they can find a way around this or find a way to side-load apps.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
This is such an old build that any way they find will probably be patched or completely replaced/done away with in an RTM build.
owenw said:
This is real, but is a VERY old beta version that was designed for testing on the HD2, they abandoned it as it is missing the hardware graphics acceleration. You won't see much higher than this on the HD2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All we need now is just to manage how to boot the wp7 on hd2 (never mind which version), and then we can boot whichever wp7 on it, even a cooked one, it will means better than original one! End!
PS: we can also get all drivers from hd7, the twin brother of hd2... if hd7 could be updated, its' rom will also could be dumped and ported to hd2. so, if you want to stop it, just don't put hd7 in to market! ahhhh... it's too late...
So yea I have been a long time Android user and I have had no interest in WP7 after using WM6-6.5, not an iphone guy either, Android just feels right at home for me, so anyway a couple weeks ago my Captivate fell and broke, now I need a new phone, Naturally Android was my first choice and I decided that I was gonna wait for the Olympus that is heavily rumored for ATT in Jan, So all is well....until I see a WP7 commercial and it hits me! "You know what! Lemme check this out, lets see if this is even gonna last against Android and iOS" I tell myself, so I hope on my laptop and start checking out the phones and looking at UI breakthroughs/reviews. At first I thought the UI was a little weird but as the review went on I started liking more and more! Now I think hands down its the best looking OS on a mobile (I used to give that to WebOS), so with the combination of the great looking and fast UI, Single OS and updates across all phones which is important to me because as a heavy android user that has had many Android phones, I can tell you a lot of Custom UIs just SUCK, and most of these phones arent future proof as without rooting you will never get an update.
Im really interested but there are some things that do worry me, first of all I still love android and Im still trying to choose which one.
At first I was really annoyed that you have to use the Zune software to add music, Vids, Pics etc, but I guess its not as bad as that crap they call iTunes.
Wtf is up with all this MicroSD card talk? This is something that is very important to me as I listen to a LOT of music and need that extra memory, If I get WP7, The Focus is the phone I will get, but I need to know my MicroSD will work.
How about the Apps, I have yet to check out the Apps on the Zune Software but how fast do you think MS will catchup? I mean WP7 at 1000, Android at 100,000, and iOs at 300,000, quite a big gap.
Updates are very important to me, I hate to feel like I have an outdated phone, will MS send out the updates or do we have to wait for the Carriers?
And finally the biggest and most important question of all, will WP7 succeed, at this point it looks like WP7 is already at a high level in terms of UI and everything in its infancy stages, but is that enough? Will it ever catch up to Android and more importantly iOS? Will it catch on with the people? This wont be another Kin right? lol
Overall Im VERY interested and seriously considering the jump, there are some minor things that I wanna see fixed and there are some things holding me back such as the MicroSD issue (very important to me as 8gb is not enough for me), and the Olympus (waiting to see how it is).
I guess it's safe to say that WP7 won't be a next Kin simply because of a much higher level of commitment, resources and funds from Microsoft. Whether it will catch up with Android in terms of overall market share - who knows.
Re apps, there are ways to check out whether the platform has the specific apps you need. You can use Bing visual search to browse through the Marketplace, install Zune software on your PC, and there's also some third party site that allows you to browse apps (wp7appslist.com or something like that). It doesn't really matter whether they have a billion apps or 15, they need to have the ones you need, I think.
The whole SD card thing is a real mess indeed. Samsung Focus seems to be the only phone where you can realistically replace the card, but there's a list of cards that work and a list of cards that don't here on xda, check it. I personally would prefer built-in flash as it's noticeably faster, but obviously 8GB is just ridiculous. There are some phones that are announced to have 16GB, don't know whether they are available for you.
Zune: I like Zune WiFi sync.
MicroSD: If you must have removable SD, don't buy WP7. Even the ones for which you can/might be able to put in your own microSD, the card is locked to the phone and you can't swap out the card without reinitializing the phone.
Apps: WP7 is at 3,000 or something like that now. WP7 has many of the big title games that are on iOS that are NOT on Android; WP7 is insanely easy to program little apps for, and uses XNA for professional game development (same platform as Xbox). So, I think you'll see lots of high quality apps. iOS may have 300k apps, but TONS of the apps are useless garbage.
Who knows to what degree WP7 will succeed or fail? I am certain MS is committed to the platform. On the subject in general though, look how RIM and Symbian were king of the hill and how quickly have lost market share -- the same can happen to Android and iOS. People are not committed to their mobile OS in the same way they are on their computers.
Yea I agree that we dont need a million apps, just the ones we need, Its funny because on my Captivate I only used about 15 apps of the 50 I had anyway, as for the SD Card issue, I dont mind that you cant take it out without resetting I just want to have at least 20gb's not a measly 8gb.
Over in the HD7 forum many people have replaced the 16gb MicroSD card with a 32gb MicroSD Card successfully (using the hidden micro SD Card slot, being careful not to void warranty) , as far as I know only Sandisk cards work though.
Also, you can use SDCards after they've been in a WP7 but you need to stick it in a Symbian Running Nokia to reformat it first. I would imagine after the next update Microsoft will come out with some sort of app for this.
My sandisk class 4 16GB card is working very well in my Focus.. no complaints so far.
As for your other questions..
The Zune software is very nice.. and wireless syncing is an option for music, photos, etc.
They are up to around 3,000 apps..
As for updates, the first big one is planned for January.. the carriers do have the final say on an update being released, but the delays (if they happen) should be nothing like android.. because OEM and carrier customizations to the OS have been limited to applications that can be uninstalled and special sections in the marketplace. Microsoft has supposedly set up duplicates of the carrier tests in their own test labs so they can preemptively test updates and know if an update is going to pass the carrier test or not.. and provide the results to the carrier.
Microsoft is delivering the updates either OTA or via the Zune software.. but the carriers still have the final say.
I don't anticipate any delays, though.. unless there are problems with the update. As the owner of a Samsung Vibrant.. I can safely say that I will not miss that aspect of Android one bit..
Thanks for all the replys guys! The more I think about it, the more I want to get the Focus. I will admit, Ive been used to Android for a while now but it shouldnt be so bad, seeing as I have been using my bros spare 3GS, it does what I need it to do....but still just not a fan of how iphone is set up, and the syncing process is just....ugh....I just hope Zune isnt like itunes...
i was also in your boat last week. I was an avid android user and recomended it to all my friends. i had the hd2 with 6.5 and it was meh to say the least, but my new HD7 is amazing and i now tell those friends to get WP7 phones.
the UI is great and intuitive, and for being the first version of WP7... it rocks!
The market is still beta, but give it time and im sure it will florish. Like Talys said, apps are super easy to make so its only a matter of time.
i also love zune. first time using it when i got the HD7. Wireles syncing is so convienient! keeps all my music fresh and different everytime i charge my phone.
I jumped ship and not looking back. WP7 is amazing!
What about Playing Divx files? Possible?
solidkevin said:
What about Playing Divx files? Possible?
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Click to collapse
Zune takes care of most of the common video files and converts them for you.
I'll clarify a few things for you from the posts above and focus it on your original post.
Zune itself is a little different to get use to compared to other media players, but it's quite lite in running, and grows on you over time. it's very well presented and works far better than iTunes that's for sure. It actually closes properly with huge libraries (try it on iTunes and watch the processes on your PC, see how long iTunes takes to close...).
MicroSD... it is definitely confusing, but from all the chatter, if you're after space, buy the Focus, use a Sandisk/Kingston class 4 32GB card, and you'll have a total of 40GB (8gb onboard). This trumpts the iPhone 4's 32GB offering. Which takes care of your space issues. And given you're in the US, get a Zune Pass and you get unlimited streaming of music (only limited to your carrier, don't want to blow your phone bill), and you get to keep 10 songs a month which is within the Zune Pass subscription.
Apps are growing, they're just about to pass 3,000. As a developer, i'm starting to get my head around windows phone. if you want to develop, it's far easier for windows phone than any other platform, and there is a lot of support online from MS and the community in terms of C# and silverlight (which is where you'll start). If you're not a dev, there are a lot of well known apps already available, and more coming by the day (e.g. wordpress is rumoured to be working on a wp7 app, which should be great for those who are constant bloggers).
Updates, yes carriers can block them, but only 1 round. Let me give you an example, say MS says that we have an update coming Jan, but at&t haven't finished testing with this update, they can ask MS to not deploy to their phones, and MS will not. Then MS comes along (let's say in may [made up]) and says, we have another update. the update that at&t asked not to deploy will be included with this, and at&t cannot ask for it to not be deployed. So you will at most be 1 update behind. This is awesome because not only does it ensure the carrier's can have their say, but in the end the end user will ultimately get the update, and not be left shafted like they do with Android. With Android, i'm sure you've experienced it already, but devices easily get left out in the cold when OEMs and Carriers are trying their best to push new products, and not worry about the older ones. And this is where you have to then start joining xda community and start rooting your phone to just keep it up to date, but then you don't really have a consistent experience and it requires you always checking back here, and in some cases flashing nightly.
As for whether it will be around for the long haul, MS has put HEAPS into this, a lot more than the kin (verizon is rumoured to bring the kin back anyways), and they've done the UI to most extent and now can focus on improving the current set of already high quality features, and bringing in new ones. This is all uniform across any windows phone. so when you go to pick up a different windows phone you can be assured you already know how to use it (yes... the iPhone style experience, but it does work and work well). And what would you prefer... a start screen that may look a bit bland at the start, but once you pin things you really want to it, it colours up... or have a sea of app icons to filter through to find that 1 thing you want... only to realise you hit the wrong icon when you get there (what I see a lot with my iPhone friends). Don't get me wrong though, I am a bit of a fan of different start screens that Android provides, but then you have to have all these widgets, and finding the right one can take forever, and if the widget isn't programmed right, it could be more problematic (causing instability, inconsistency in experience, and possibly even loss of battery).
In the end, each has their strengths and weaknesses, that's for sure. WP current weakness is the lack of apps, not all the common features in (custom ringtones as an example), and multi-tasking which everyone seems to have a big deal about now. Like i said on a different thread, when considering a windows phone, know what you do a lot of, find out if you can do it in windows phone, and if not, are you willing to give it up. Not to say that you won't be able to do it period, it could come in the form of an update, but look at it from the here and now, and then also would you be happy waiting till that rumoured update.
The Gate Keeper said:
Zune takes care of most of the common video files and converts them for you.
I'll clarify a few things for you from the posts above and focus it on your original post.
Zune itself is a little different to get use to compared to other media players, but it's quite lite in running, and grows on you over time. it's very well presented and works far better than iTunes that's for sure. It actually closes properly with huge libraries (try it on iTunes and watch the processes on your PC, see how long iTunes takes to close...).
MicroSD... it is definitely confusing, but from all the chatter, if you're after space, buy the Focus, use a Sandisk/Kingston class 4 32GB card, and you'll have a total of 40GB (8gb onboard). This trumpts the iPhone 4's 32GB offering. Which takes care of your space issues. And given you're in the US, get a Zune Pass and you get unlimited streaming of music (only limited to your carrier, don't want to blow your phone bill), and you get to keep 10 songs a month which is within the Zune Pass subscription.
Apps are growing, they're just about to pass 3,000. As a developer, i'm starting to get my head around windows phone. if you want to develop, it's far easier for windows phone than any other platform, and there is a lot of support online from MS and the community in terms of C# and silverlight (which is where you'll start). If you're not a dev, there are a lot of well known apps already available, and more coming by the day (e.g. wordpress is rumoured to be working on a wp7 app, which should be great for those who are constant bloggers).
Updates, yes carriers can block them, but only 1 round. Let me give you an example, say MS says that we have an update coming Jan, but at&t haven't finished testing with this update, they can ask MS to not deploy to their phones, and MS will not. Then MS comes along (let's say in may [made up]) and says, we have another update. the update that at&t asked not to deploy will be included with this, and at&t cannot ask for it to not be deployed. So you will at most be 1 update behind. This is awesome because not only does it ensure the carrier's can have their say, but in the end the end user will ultimately get the update, and not be left shafted like they do with Android. With Android, i'm sure you've experienced it already, but devices easily get left out in the cold when OEMs and Carriers are trying their best to push new products, and not worry about the older ones. And this is where you have to then start joining xda community and start rooting your phone to just keep it up to date, but then you don't really have a consistent experience and it requires you always checking back here, and in some cases flashing nightly.
As for whether it will be around for the long haul, MS has put HEAPS into this, a lot more than the kin (verizon is rumoured to bring the kin back anyways), and they've done the UI to most extent and now can focus on improving the current set of already high quality features, and bringing in new ones. This is all uniform across any windows phone. so when you go to pick up a different windows phone you can be assured you already know how to use it (yes... the iPhone style experience, but it does work and work well). And what would you prefer... a start screen that may look a bit bland at the start, but once you pin things you really want to it, it colours up... or have a sea of app icons to filter through to find that 1 thing you want... only to realise you hit the wrong icon when you get there (what I see a lot with my iPhone friends). Don't get me wrong though, I am a bit of a fan of different start screens that Android provides, but then you have to have all these widgets, and finding the right one can take forever, and if the widget isn't programmed right, it could be more problematic (causing instability, inconsistency in experience, and possibly even loss of battery).
In the end, each has their strengths and weaknesses, that's for sure. WP current weakness is the lack of apps, not all the common features in (custom ringtones as an example), and multi-tasking which everyone seems to have a big deal about now. Like i said on a different thread, when considering a windows phone, know what you do a lot of, find out if you can do it in windows phone, and if not, are you willing to give it up. Not to say that you won't be able to do it period, it could come in the form of an update, but look at it from the here and now, and then also would you be happy waiting till that rumoured update.
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Excellent man! Awesome post, Ive decided that WP7 it is! Funny how things change....a couple of weeks ago I was telling my bro how Great Android is and how I would never get an iphone or a WP, Ive been literally all day though researching WP and like you said the things that are missing will come in future updates.
solidkevin said:
Excellent man! Awesome post, Ive decided that WP7 it is! Funny how things change....a couple of weeks ago I was telling my bro how Great Android is and how I would never get an iphone or a WP, Ive been literally all day though researching WP and like you said the things that are missing will come in future updates.
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disclaimer -P): there is no guarnetee that the features you want will be coming in an update any time soon, but hopefully a lot of the ones you desire (and the rest of us) will. but all we can do is wait and actually see.
solidkevin said:
So yea I have been a long time Android user and I have had no interest in WP7 after using WM6-6.5, not an iphone guy either, Android just feels right at home for me, so anyway a couple weeks ago my Captivate fell and broke, now I need a new phone, Naturally Android was my first choice and I decided that I was gonna wait for the Olympus that is heavily rumored for ATT in Jan, So all is well....until I see a WP7 commercial and it hits me! "You know what! Lemme check this out, lets see if this is even gonna last against Android and iOS" I tell myself, so I hope on my laptop and start checking out the phones and looking at UI breakthroughs/reviews. At first I thought the UI was a little weird but as the review went on I started liking more and more! Now I think hands down its the best looking OS on a mobile (I used to give that to WebOS), so with the combination of the great looking and fast UI, Single OS and updates across all phones which is important to me because as a heavy android user that has had many Android phones, I can tell you a lot of Custom UIs just SUCK, and most of these phones arent future proof as without rooting you will never get an update.
Im really interested but there are some things that do worry me, first of all I still love android and Im still trying to choose which one.
At first I was really annoyed that you have to use the Zune software to add music, Vids, Pics etc, but I guess its not as bad as that crap they call iTunes.
Wtf is up with all this MicroSD card talk? This is something that is very important to me as I listen to a LOT of music and need that extra memory, If I get WP7, The Focus is the phone I will get, but I need to know my MicroSD will work.
How about the Apps, I have yet to check out the Apps on the Zune Software but how fast do you think MS will catchup? I mean WP7 at 1000, Android at 100,000, and iOs at 300,000, quite a big gap.
Updates are very important to me, I hate to feel like I have an outdated phone, will MS send out the updates or do we have to wait for the Carriers?
And finally the biggest and most important question of all, will WP7 succeed, at this point it looks like WP7 is already at a high level in terms of UI and everything in its infancy stages, but is that enough? Will it ever catch up to Android and more importantly iOS? Will it catch on with the people? This wont be another Kin right? lol
Overall Im VERY interested and seriously considering the jump, there are some minor things that I wanna see fixed and there are some things holding me back such as the MicroSD issue (very important to me as 8gb is not enough for me), and the Olympus (waiting to see how it is).
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there are so many threads like this on this forum.... i dont get it why ppl want to load Android on WP7 still...
the Memory card issue is to stop ppl loading Android on WP7 device... and i beleive its here to stay...
come on guys if you put your self in the shoes of Microsoft you will do the same thing.... why you should allow ppl to load some other OS on your device... when microsoft have spant time, money and effort in developing a new OS (i will not say good or great as i know time will tell what WP7 will do)
truffle1234 said:
there are so many threads like this on this forum.... i dont get it why ppl want to load Android on WP7 still...
the Memory card issue is to stop ppl loading Android on WP7 device... and i beleive its here to stay...
come on guys if you put your self in the shoes of Microsoft you will do the same thing.... why you should allow ppl to load some other OS on your device... when microsoft have spant time, money and effort in developing a new OS (i will not say good or great as i know time will tell what WP7 will do)
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Umm, did you actually read the OP???
The person wants to use WP7 as a WP7 device not to load Android on it.
truffle1234 said:
there are so many threads like this on this forum.... i dont get it why ppl want to load Android on WP7 still...
the Memory card issue is to stop ppl loading Android on WP7 device... and i beleive its here to stay...
come on guys if you put your self in the shoes of Microsoft you will do the same thing.... why you should allow ppl to load some other OS on your device... when microsoft have spant time, money and effort in developing a new OS (i will not say good or great as i know time will tell what WP7 will do)
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Ok.....next time try reading the thread first before responding
lqaddict said:
Umm, did you actually read the OP???
The person wants to use WP7 as a WP7 device not to load Android on it.
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yea, he said he is coming from android and looking at windows phone.
As an owner of several devices ranging from all 4 generations of the iPhone, Dell Streak, Nexus One, HTC G2 and my most recent device the Samsung Focus I must say that the OS is just plain slick. The OS is fast and very responsive. I struggled with the whole micro sd card issue to and just went out on a limb and purchased the Transcend class 2 32gb from Amazon.
I installed the card per the instructions and had a total storage of 36.90 GB after the format was completed. I have had no problems with the phone at all without a certified micro sd card.
The phone is great, my only problem is I have to get used to how easy the phone is to use. It's very intuitive once you forget that it's not android or ios. No looking back for me.
I have tried the lot, wm5, wm6, wm6.5, web0s, android and iOS (on an iPad). Wp7 is the best for me, even with it's current limitations.
truffle1234 said:
the Memory card issue is to stop ppl loading Android on WP7 device... and i beleive its here to stay...
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The memory card thing makes sense given what they're trying to achieve.
1. They want to make it simplier for the consumer, when the consumer installs an app they don't see Onboard/My Storage/SD Card. It's arcane to the general consumer; The consolidated space makes it easier to understand.
2. Allows flexibility to OEM to choose whatever storage mechanism they see fit eg: NAND, SD Card
The Gate Keeper said:
disclaimer -P): there is no guarnetee that the features you want will be coming in an update any time soon, but hopefully a lot of the ones you desire (and the rest of us) will. but all we can do is wait and actually see.
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Personally, the biggest updates i wanna see is an iOS style of multitasking, and copy paste. Everything else, like apps for example will just take time.
ME WANT D:
mine is a tmobile one
ME WANT ME WANT D:!!!
this is the facebook page:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/pages/We-want-Windows-Phone-7-on-Our-Htc-Touch-Pro-2-NOW/162988837078172?v=wall
Let's start making noise!!!
atomiq said:
ME WANT D:
mine is a tmobile one
ME WANT ME WANT D:!!!
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it is good to want. one always desires what they cant have.
sh4d0w86.
The best you can get on a Touch Pro2 is a Windows 7 theme, which can be had from all over the site. One appeared on the frontpage recently, I believe. Neither Microsoft nor any other company will ever release an official update for this device to bring it to Windows 7. There are hardware requirements for the operating system that the Rhodium does not meet. The two biggest ones being the lack of a 1GHz processor and a capacitive touch screen. Without those two components, this operating system will never, ever make its way to the Rhodium platform. Your best bet will be to get the HTC 7 Pro when it makes its way into retail stores. This is basically the TP2 with the hardware requirements for WP7.
i know but they could make a Lite version for us at least, and work with what we have, i'm sure something can be done. i'm so tired of wm 6.5 and the slugishness, and crappy apps for wm, perfect example the facebook app, we dont even have an official app of pandora etc etc. when i tried the Xdandroid it felt so different, smoother and faster (even without the cancerous overclock).
atomiq said:
i know but they could make a Lite version for us at least, and work with what we have, i'm sure something can be done. i'm so tired of wm 6.5 and the slugishness, and crappy apps for wm, perfect example the facebook app, we dont even have an official app of pandora etc etc. when i tried the Xdandroid it felt so different, smoother and faster (even without the cancerous overclock).
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You're missing the point. The UI isn't too heavy for us. There are hard coded requirements in the OS. If the device doesn't meet them, it will not run. The OS will not function without a capacitive touch screen, 1 GHz processor, or a minimum of 8GB of storage. You are asking for the impossible here. The other matter is with the SD cards. WP7 bonds the SD card to the device in a sort of RAID 0 array. This means you would have to hard reset your device anytime you removed the SD card. That's why the WP7 devices hide the SD cards from the user. This isn't a matter of the company not paying attention to its customers, it simply isn't possible for them to put this OS on our devices. The only WM6 device that is even capable of running WP7 is the HD2.
It's rumored that the HTC 7Pro should be out next quarter. Maybe you should just wait for that. It's basically the TP2 with the specs needed for running WP7.
I don't really think the hardware is the problem, I think they dont want to take the time to figure out how to get wp7 (basically titatinium on steriods) to work on 6.5 devices.
UstesGreenridge said:
I don't really think the hardware is the problem
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You have any actual knowledge/facts to back that up? Just saying something doesn't make it so. I think its been pointed out on these forums that WP7 is written for a different ARM processor than older WM versions.
And the poll choices are dumb. Not wanting something that is impossible and will never happen does not make one a conformist.
hahaha, its as if developers are Santa Clause or something. Maybe if your good enough, one of them will provide us with a perfect android/winmo 6.5 and 7 SUPER port! Ya know, because of course the newest technology can be put on 2 year old phones.... its just that the the darn DEVELOPERS are tooo LAZY!!!
hopefully it is the sarcasm is noted.
Before you start saying "i want, I want"
maybe you should study your device and the software/hardware it came with. Its actually good to do these things BEFORE you buy the device. you see, i have a touchpro2 as well, and it is indeed the perfect device for my needs. and though it aint an EVO, i wouldnt define it as sluggish. but I guess you just have to know how to use your equipment if you want it to work right.
and i like how the "no, im conformist" vote is winning.
bro....maybe you should just get an iphone or something. i dont wanna see you ruin perfectly good htc devices.
Well, I mean, if you guys want to get completely rewrite WP7 for the Rhodium's processor, go for it! As has been said before, system requirements are not met and the actual OS is written for a different kind of processor. WP7 will never be more then a idea for our phones unfortunately. Rhods' processors are only around half of what WP7 needs bare minimum, and at most can be OC'd to 768 mb/ 787mb, about 3/4 of the minimum. Aside from the lack of the ram, space, hardware support, and really just any basis to go on, it should be easy to port. Not.
Hate to sound like a pessimist or a jerk, but before you guys go around talking about how you think it's not a hardware problem or that "someone could do it", maybe you should read up on the idea.
And before anyone asks, WP7 was ported to the HD2 because an HD2 and an HD7 are, from what I heard, almost identical hardware wise. Plus, the HD2 met the running hardware requirements.
UstesGreenridge said:
I don't really think the hardware is the problem, I think they dont want to take the time to figure out how to get wp7 (basically titatinium on steriods) to work on 6.5 devices.
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Crap in one hand and wish in the other. See which one fills up faster.
Mods this thread should be closed...
I have a touch pro 2, and I know deep down inside that it's crappy CPU (that was outdated when the phone was new) would not be able to handle Windows Phone 7.
Anyone who says it's not the hardware on the TP2 is 100% wrong, it's all about the hardware, CPU, memory, buttons, this is why it can't run WP7.
Even if it COULD be ported, it would be slugish and would never be as smooth as a WP7 phone. WP7 is about the experiance, what is the point if your going to put it on a a device that will not give it.
Just install this theme...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=859799
It really gets as close as your going to get (look at the end of the thread, there are new updates to files) with a Touch Pro 2.
I'm one who dreams for it to work but, no one is going to re-write all that code for a old outdated disco'd phone.
If your on T-mobile, sell your TP2 and get a HD7, done...
DavidinCT said:
Mods this thread should be closed...
I have a touch pro 2, and I know deep down inside that it's crappy CPU (that was outdated when the phone was new) would not be able to handle Windows Phone 7.
Anyone who says it's not the hardware on the TP2 is 100% wrong, it's all about the hardware, CPU, memory, buttons, this is why it can't run WP7.
Even if it COULD be ported, it would be slugish and would never be as smooth as a WP7 phone. WP7 is about the experiance, what is the point if your going to put it on a a device that will not give it.
Just install this theme...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=859799
It really gets as close as your going to get (look at the end of the thread, there are new updates to files) with a Touch Pro 2.
I'm one who dreams for it to work but, no one is going to re-write all that code for a old outdated disco'd phone.
If your on T-mobile, sell your TP2 and get a HD7, done...
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You know quite a bit, including how to tell the mods to do their jobs. Sounds like a Napoleon complex