Develop Bugs

Ouch I feel like I am going to regret

My TP2 just shipped (I guess I'll recieve it in 2 or 3 days) and I just saw today that the Omnia Pro is set to be out in August
http://www.engadget.com/2009/06/12/samsung-b7610-louvre-rematerializes-specd-and-caught-on-camera/
Much more powerful processor than the TP2 AND slimmer phone
Aaaahhh I feel so bad
That said I think the TP2 looks better (but it's fatter..........)

TP2 still better IMO.
I only thinking of HTC Snapdragon based device after this.

Better ? Mmh I dont think so but I hope I am wrong
I also forgot about the better camera, and extra memory
But yeah I love TOuchFlo + the great support from XDA, so... at least that gives me a bit less regrets (Besides the keyboard of the TP is probably better (Though I dont care that much)

Alcibiade said:
My TP2 just shipped (I guess I'll recieve it in 2 or 3 days) and I just saw today that the Omnia Pro is set to be out in August
http://www.engadget.com/2009/06/12/samsung-b7610-louvre-rematerializes-specd-and-caught-on-camera/
Much more powerful processor than the TP2 AND slimmer phone
Aaaahhh I feel so bad
That said I think the TP2 looks better (but it's fatter..........)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I read that the interface is (at least at the moment) sluggish despite the CPU, and I hate the ergonomics (tilt, keyboard) of the device. I'm curious about 2 things on the OmPro, 1) how much battery life the AMOLED screen saves over LCD and 2) what performance increase comes from the video acceleration it advertises. For now, I actually have more good to say about the cheaply constructed acer m900.
Specs aren't everything[/sacrilege].

fortunz said:
I read that the interface is (at least at the moment) sluggish despite the CPU, and I hate the ergonomics (tilt, keyboard) of the device. I'm curious about 2 things on the OmPro, 1) how much battery life the AMOLED screen saves over LCD and 2) what performance increase comes from the video acceleration it advertises. For now, I actually have more good to say about the cheaply constructed acer m900.
Specs aren't everything[/sacrilege].
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True I forgot the AMOLED screen
Even if it doesnt save much energy, you can at elast expect it to ahve way better contrast than regular LED screens
Specs arent everything, but it is Samsung. You can expect them to do much better than Eten

Much better pics there:
http://www.techchee.com/2009/06/14/samsung-louvre-b7610-pictures-and-specs/
Aaah it looks so slim compared to the TP2
Probably lighter as well I guess

Alcibiade said:
You can expect them to do much better than Eten
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Click to collapse
That depends on what you mean by "better". Better build quality and specs, sure. But there's almost nothing on the OmPro that really draws me in yet. The TP2's processor is fast enough. TP2's RAM (not clear on what amount of memory is reserved for active processes on the OmPro) is enough to do what I want. TP2's ergonomics are untouched and its interface has been optimized and honed across several past models.
What does draw my eye on the lower quality Acer device is that, out of the box, the biometric sensor that was designed solely for checking fingerprints multitasks--without making room for a big dpad, Acer has still provided what seems to be a very usable and versatile navigation aid while still saving space and adding a nice security feature. I suspect the TP2's zoom bar will also be hacked for similar functionality, but the added options aren't there out of the box. The m900 pulled a little rabbit out of it's hat with this one, and I think it deserves props.
I also noticed that the m900 has a built-in menu for auto-rotation settings by program, out of the box. The TP2 needs an external program for that functionality, and I wouldn't be surprised if the OmPro did too.
I suspect a lot of people will be drawn to the OmPros based on the specsheet alone, and if that happens, I'm actually glad. That just means the TP2 will face some more price pressure, and I might get a better deal. If I sit down next to an OmPro user, I don't anticipate feeling envy so mush as pity, because long after they've started lusting after the next higher spec'd device (often probably for little reason other than some of the numbers are "bigger"), I'm still going to be profoundly content with my choice.

fortunz said:
That depends on what you mean by "better". Better build quality and specs, sure. But there's almost nothing on the OmPro that really draws me in yet. The TP2's processor is fast enough. TP2's RAM (not clear on what amount of memory is reserved for active processes on the OmPro) is enough to do what I want. TP2's ergonomics are untouched and its interface has been optimized and honed across several past models.
What does draw my eye on the lower quality Acer device is that, out of the box, the biometric sensor that was designed solely for checking fingerprints multitasks--without making room for a big dpad, Acer has still provided what seems to be a very usable and versatile navigation aid while still saving space and adding a nice security feature. I suspect the TP2's zoom bar will also be hacked for similar functionality, but the added options aren't there out of the box. The m900 pulled a little rabbit out of it's hat with this one, and I think it deserves props.
I also noticed that the m900 has a built-in menu for auto-rotation settings by program, out of the box. The TP2 needs an external program for that functionality, and I wouldn't be surprised if the OmPro did too.
I suspect a lot of people will be drawn to the OmPros based on the specsheet alone, and if that happens, I'm actually glad. That just means the TP2 will face some more price pressure, and I might get a better deal. If I sit down next to an OmPro user, I don't anticipate feeling envy so mush as pity, because long after they've started lusting after the next higher spec'd device (often probably for little reason other than some of the numbers are "bigger"), I'm still going to be profoundly content with my choice.
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My Hermes is fast enough too... It's a bit funny to say you pity people going for the best specs [Though I understand what you mean: implementation is key]. "Fast enough" always depends on what you are aiming for... If you want to do gaming with your phone, you are always happier to have something fast
It's very likely the Samsung camera will be better than the TP2 (Samsung is a camera maker, and the camera is supposed to have an autostabilizer + a flash)
It is quite obvious from the pics it is also slimmer and I find it difficult to say you prefer a fatter phone in your pocket (Personally I dont)
The screen is quite likely to look better than the TP2's (However the "touch" part of the screen may not be as good) and will draw less juice (how much less, that we dont know)
I do agree the interface should be better on the TP2 (though we may see TouchFlo 3D adapted for the Omnia) and the phone looks better (I dont like the Samsung black & orange look)
As far as the price is concerned you are most likely right. However I wont enjoy the pressure on price since I already orderd my unit
In the end I thnk the TP2 looks a bit better, but fatter and with specs probably not as good, for maybe a hiher price than the one rumored for the Samsung
Dont take me wrong, I love HTC (It's my second HTC device), but this doesnt prevent me from being critical and not acting like an inconditional fan boy
Anyway TP2 will be enough for me to wait for a Tegra device (We'll need it if we want decent games... Typically the new iPhone will probably rock for this (Until tegra arrives and potentially proves to be better)

I am not sure it looks thinner by a lot. Maybe a few mm. Nothing that you can really wow about it. Samsung will reveal this phone, if its true, this month. You will have some real measurements then. HTC will also be revealing a line of new phones on 24 June. So maybe there will be more surprises. Maybe some Snapdragon goodies.
Don't be sad, I have just ordered mine too and it has yet to arrive. I still waiting for my carrier to call me to pick it up (should be today, fingers x). There will always be new things arriving and new technologies that will beat todays tech. So why be sad. Knowing that this upgrade for me is what will keep me happy for another 12 to 18 months puts a smile on my face already. By then, there will be 1.0+ GHz CPUs, GBs of storage space, GBs of RAM, Millions of colours and brilliant LCDs. Maybe a TP3 even.
This phone won't be available until 3Q. Look at the Omnia HD. It was announced back in February. It came out in June (only in some countries and not even here in Asia yet). So it took nearly 4 months. And the styling of the phone changed completely. So don't hold your breath on it. If the annoucement is gonna be made in June / July. You won't see the phone until October at the earliest and we won't see it until Xmas in Asia. Samsung takes ages to launch their phones over here.
So why wait and the long face?

I think the touch pro 2 looks better, and the design (especially the keyboard) is better. Apart from the processor, I don't see any improvements..
There probably is a long way to go optimizing this new processor also.
This is the first omnia trying to get to the bussiness people, so I am curious how that will happen. I never seen the UI but it sound really good. If it's really that good, I think it will be available via this forum for us too

cocoaju said:
I am not sure it looks thinner by a lot. Maybe a few mm. Nothing that you can really wow about it. Samsung will reveal this phone, if its true, this month. You will have some real measurements then. HTC will also be revealing a line of new phones on 24 June. So maybe there will be more surprises. Maybe some Snapdragon goodies.
Don't be sad, I have just ordered mine too and it has yet to arrive. I still waiting for my carrier to call me to pick it up (should be today, fingers x). There will always be new things arriving and new technologies that will beat todays tech. So why be sad. Knowing that this upgrade for me is what will keep me happy for another 12 to 18 months puts a smile on my face already. By then, there will be 1.0+ GHz CPUs, GBs of storage space, GBs of RAM, Millions of colours and brilliant LCDs. Maybe a TP3 even.
This phone won't be available until 3Q. Look at the Omnia HD. It was announced back in February. It came out in June (only in some countries and not even here in Asia yet). So it took nearly 4 months. And the styling of the phone changed completely. So don't hold your breath on it. If the annoucement is gonna be made in June / July. You won't see the phone until October at the earliest and we won't see it until Xmas in Asia. Samsung takes ages to launch their phones over here.
So why wait and the long face?
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Click to collapse
Thanks for cheering me up. No reaso to be sad, it will be anyway definitely better than my Hermes (Cant believe all my friends switched from Hermes to iPhone...)
Anyway my purchase is exactly in the same purpose as yours: wait for mature, well balanced tegra or snapdragon phones with better screens, camera, etc... ie roughly 1 year from now

Alcibiade said:
Thanks for cheering me up. No reaso to be sad, it will be anyway definitely better than my Hermes (Cant believe all my friends switched from Hermes to iPhone...)
Anyway my purchase is exactly in the same purpose as yours: wait for mature, well balanced tegra or snapdragon phones with better screens, camera, etc... ie roughly 1 year from now
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Click to collapse
You are welcome mate!
There will be many of us sitting in the same boat for the next 12 months. Some will jump on and some will jump off. Hopefully support for this phone will be as great as the HD, so there will be many of more tweaks and upgrades to make this phone being 'THE' phone to have for 2009.

in my opinion, the TP2 will probably be the best in its class for the year to come even over any Samsung competition, mainly because of the stability and work put into the integration of the HTC software and WM OS. Samsung has great specs, but their software leaves a lot to be desired. I had an Omnia and a Blackjack 2 and they were extremely buggy, as with most WM machines I had. But with HTC Touch HD and onwards, they've really come close to making the OS as stable and quick as possible. The processor and specs look enticing on the new Samsung, but I'm confident that the TP2 will still out perform it in real life usage. (another case in point is that I had the Samsung INNOV8, the Nokia N96-killer...great hardware, but never came out with a new firmware and was always buggy and choppy to use).
So for right now, I don't think anyone should regret picking up the TP2 or Diamond 2...both excellent pieces of engineering. The real waiting should be for the next generation of snapdragon units...

tsaojam said:
in my opinion, the TP2 will probably be the best in its class for the year to come even over any Samsung competition, mainly because of the stability and work put into the integration of the HTC software and WM OS. Samsung has great specs, but their software leaves a lot to be desired...
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Totally agree! I tried playing around with the TouchWiz and it is crap. Don't like it at all. Don't like the widgets and stuff on it where you can move things around. It makes it look messy. I was never keen on those moving around thingies. I know they are trying to achieve a desktop feel but it just looks weird on a vertical screen.

Alcibiade said:
My Hermes is fast enough too... It's a bit funny to say you pity people going for the best specs [Though I understand what you mean: implementation is key]. "Fast enough" always depends on what you are aiming for... If you want to do gaming with your phone, you are always happier to have something fast
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The device comes with DLNA, a connectivity regime that I gather is for displaying video between devices. I could understand an increasing need for speed for someone who wanted to store HD vids and TV-out them to an HD set, but there, I'd be skeptical that 800mhz would do the trick (which is part of why I mentioned being interested in how much performance you could get from the video acceleration mentioned in the specs) until I actually saw it in action. It's one of those things where, unless the vid accel is awesome, it probably works JUST well enough, and then in 6-12 months once the novelty wears and the defects really shine, the user is going to be drooling over some 1+ ghz snapdragons. Once you start looking at some of these devices on a price per month basis in situations like that, they look less attractive.
I'm not sure what games are available for WinMo that really push specs. Are you plugged into that? Is it just about looking for more hertz for better emulation performance? Or are there some serious native titles available that lag on current hardware or have settings you can crank up for better performance?
The thing is, there are tons of peeps who think 800mhz MUST be better than 500mhz, even though they have no particular application category where the processor is a real bottleneck. Clockspeed is, both in mobiles and desktops, a decreasingly useful metric for actual performance increases. Infrastructure is more and more important, and software optimization is the great undiscovered country in computing performance.
It is quite obvious from the pics it is also slimmer and I find it difficult to say you prefer a fatter phone in your pocket (Personally I dont)
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Click to collapse
If you look at girth as a single feature, you're right, it's hard to argue. If you look at it as a balancing act between features, then the question isn't "fatter or thinner" but rather "fatter with better ergonomics or thinner with worse ergonomics". In this case I'm weighing the TP2's 5 row, offset, well-spaced (and potentially better tactile feedback) keyboard and tilt ability against the apparently (are there measurements yet?) thinner OmPro without them. Given that we're talking about a couple of mm, I'm totally willing to sacrifice thinner for the ergonomics. It is a personal choice, but not an indefensible one
The screen is quite likely to look better than the TP2's (However the "touch" part of the screen may not be as good) and will draw less juice (how much less, that we dont know)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Battery life in portables is a huge factor for me. It plays into usability in a big way. If AMOLED really delivers, I will be wooed, just not before I see hard proof. If Samsung can't deliver the type of resistive screen responsiveness HTC managed in this round, that might be wash.
Dont take me wrong, I love HTC (It's my second HTC device), but this doesnt prevent me from being critical and not acting like an inconditional fan boy
Anyway TP2 will be enough for me to wait for a Tegra device (We'll need it if we want decent games... Typically the new iPhone will probably rock for this (Until tegra arrives and potentially proves to be better)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This will be my very first HTC, and my very first winmo. I look at devices based on what they bring to the table, not on who made them (thus the Acer props). So I'm not trying to attack you for being disloyal , just attempting to reassure you that the two things you mentioned in the OP weren't necessarily worth hari kari.
If someone will really rip off some of HTC's best work in the very near future and throw in a snapdragon, well, yeah, then let the disemboweling commence.

Guys,
according to today's release notes Omnia Pro has 135MB RAM.
1GB is for ROM.
That's a far cry from TP2's 288 MB RAM.
If this is true, it's just not enough, regardless of the nice screen (AMOLED), potentially faster CPU (Mhz is not everything, needs to be benched) and nicer camera.
On WM devices RAM is the 2nd most important thing after CPU or your device slows to a crawl

vasra said:
Guys,
according to today's release notes Omnia Pro has 135MB RAM.
1GB is for ROM.
That's a far cry from TP2's 288 MB RAM.
If this is true, it's just not enough, regardless of the nice screen (AMOLED), potentially faster CPU (Mhz is not everything, needs to be benched) and nicer camera.
On WM devices RAM is the 2nd most important thing after CPU or your device slows to a crawl
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeha if it's true you defintely cheer me up
135MB is a little bit weird number though...
Yeah Mhz is not everything (For instance I never ever owned a Pentium P4 ehehe) hwoever in this field Samsung processor have the repuation of usually being faster clock for clock (Again I agree with you it definitely depends on the architecture of the processor)

Just got mine today as said before. Let me tell you. NO REGRETS WHATSOEVER!
You will see when you get yours mate. Man, it's a beauty!

The guys gave you technical reasons why our tp2 is still better... mine is much more simple.. the tp2 is still prettier and sexier....

Is there kind of flash for camera in TP2? My X01HT has white beam turning on when activating "flash". Thanks.
cocoaju said:
Just got mine today as said before. Let me tell you. NO REGRETS WHATSOEVER!
You will see when you get yours mate. Man, it's a beauty!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Who's holding out?

Just out of curiosity, how many of you are holding out on buying a new WP7 phone until 2nd generation? I know for the average user, these specs may seem amazing, but for the advanced/techy users, it seems under-powered.This is especially because they're using a 2 year old CPU when a more recent one that has better 3d performance and battery life is out in the market.
I, for one, will be holding on to my Touch Pro until 2nd generation WP7 comes out. Anyone have any idea when that will be?

would like to hold out, but the problem here is my touch pro's backspace, space, 1, tab, and fn key has basically died out on me

You should use the swype keyboard. I never went back to the physical keyboard once I started using swype.

tried it
don't really like it
i still prefer physical keys though
but yah, i'm looking to get the venue pro. but it seems to look like the tp's keyboard, and frankly, i do dread it a little

If i had a decent phone today i would wait for second gen, but i'm on an HTC Magic now, running Android 2.1 and everything is soooooooo slow i feel like throwing the phone into the wall. Can hardly scroll on this forum on the phone because it's so laggy.
Have set my eyes on an HTC Mozart.

I'll definitely be waiting for the 2nd gen. All the phones looks pretty ugly IMO, not to mention the old processors....and the AT&T selection sucks.

I'd like to wait, but my Fuze is on life support. As much as I would like for the specs to be better for this first gen of WP7 phones, they handily beat the Iphones specs and most WM phones. I am buying a gen one knowing that I will be buying a gen two next summer. I am considering my gen one as a 'get aquainted' with the OS phone while I hold out for a stunner in '11.
http://designfabulous.blogspot.com/2010/07/htc-1.html
Well, we can dream. HTC just needs to hire this guy.

I think people that hold out aren't as tech savvy sad they think.
Understand that android is optimized to run on various hardware specs. While windows phone 7 was designed for this specific hardware.
The same spec phone running both operating systems won't be comparible. The overall speed of wp7, the quality of the apps, and the games will be superior to android even after the dual core phones release.
The only thing that could bump the android back up is strong min specs of the new version of the OS and market apps that are only available to phones with those specs. Developers need to also commit to designing apps for a very small market of those top-of-the-line phones.
Those are the reasons why my rooted nexus one, car dock, and desktop dock will be on ebay within a month.
I love android, but I am always excite to test new things. After all, one could always ebay the phone and buy another extremely easily. I don't see any reason not to try wp7 unless you are locked into a contract and unwilling to buy an unsubsidized phone.

Nah I'm gonna get the HD7 as soon as my contract expires in late spring. Currently have the Moto Cliq with Android. If MS makes a Zune HD2, than I might think about getting a 64gb version of that and get the latest and greatest Android phone, Iphone, or Palm Phone.
Definitely not digging android anymore;
*sluggish, having to constantly kill apps and restart the phone
*Multiple OS fragmentation means I missing out on a lot of apps
*No app quality control (sick of buying an app thats sluggish or just plain buggy)
*No Easy Desktop Sync like Itunes or Zune
*NO AUTOMATICALLY UPDATING MUSIC PLAYLIST - A biggy for me.
Also I have a zune pass and hate having to convert my music just because Android doesn't play WMA DRM.
WP7 minimum specs aren't all that, but better than the minimum of Android which is still 528mhz processor for Android 2.1

The little angel sitting on the right shoulder is saying "Wait, wait!"
The little devil sitting on the left shoulder is saying "Get it, what are you afraid of? Offline Outlook Sync?"
Oh it is so hard!
But on a serious note, as soon as I am sure that it will Sync with Offline Outlook or I have a non cloud solution that I can trust, I will get it.

There isn't going to be an ideal phone for me in the first wave, but I'm gonna get one soon. Ideally I want the Dell Venue Pro but with Super AMOLED instead of AMOLED, and a MSM8255 SoC instead of the QSD8250's. But besides that, I think I will be happy with the Dell. "Dude, you're getting a Dell"
Also I really want WP7 to succeed. So in order to get a phone those next 2nd Gen phones with the Dual Cores and 32GB of memory, that means the 1st gen's need to succeed. So I'm gonna buy one to support my long term goals.

the QSD8250 has still more than enough horsepower to be used today. don't just look at what speeds and GPU does a processor holds but also take into the fact how well the OS utilizes the processor.

IMO its best to get the first wave. By the time the second wave hits (say this time next year), none of the apps/games will be fully utilising the power of the new processors anyway (since majority of WP7 handsets would have the QSD cpu and that'd be where the money for devs is). So you'll have all this power yet nothing to make use of it (basically like the Galaxy S). It'll take about 6 months imo til games start utilising the newer processors and run somewhat subpar on first gen devices.
So IMO that gives first-devices from launch about 18months of excellent performance, before it starts feeling 'old in the tooth'. By the time first gen buyers upgrade in approx. 24months, there'd be the third generation CPU's hitting the streets, and that'd be able to run second gen apps with ease, and the whole cycle starts again.

I'm definitely waiting until this gets jail broken. And if Htc comes out with a slide out keyboard for it. Not enough good phone options for me. When phones similar to the tilts come back wp7 has got my full attention then.

At the moment, I just can't justify giving up my HD2.
It'd be amazing if WP7 gets ported to the HD2 and I will, for sure, boot it up. I'm sceptical about some aspects of WP7 and so would like to see what impact (if any) these aspects have on my day-to-day usage.
If all goes well, then I will consider a WP7 device early next year. Hopefully, by then we'll have had a round of updates for stability issues (inevitable) and some missing features added.
So, in short, I think I'll hold out till wave 2 (or at least until the OS has settled a bit).
Casey

diego1985 said:
I'm definitely waiting until this gets jail broken. And if Htc comes out with a slide out keyboard for it. Not enough good phone options for me. When phones similar to the tilts come back wp7 has got my full attention then.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
then you should wait for the htc 7 pro this looks amazing and i don't think it will be long before someone jailbreaks it.

Both
Gonna get the new WP7 phone out of the gate, for sure. Then I'll be in a great position to sit back and wait for a 'dream device,' which I'm not sure will make it out before the holidays next year. If it does, I'll get it, but if not I'll have gotten my money's worth with the phone I'm going to get shortly.

I have no choice but to wait. I am on Sprint, so I can't even begin to think about getting one until they release theirs. And "sometime in 1st half of 2011" is pretty vague. So for now, I have to sit back and read about everyone's experience.
So hopefully, I will be reading good reviews.

lumpaywk said:
then you should wait for the htc 7 pro this looks amazing and i don't think it will be long before someone jailbreaks it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Microsoft updates WP7 so any exploits will be patched in record time.
You can prolly refuse the OTA, but it can suck if that fix is bundled with a fix/enhancement you need...
Clear ur jailbreak and get copy and paste, or go without? Lol...
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

powersquad said:
the QSD8250 has still more than enough horsepower to be used today. don't just look at what speeds and GPU does a processor holds but also take into the fact how well the OS utilizes the processor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a truth with some modifications. Yes, the 8250 is more than powerful enough to run the OS and any games/apps released for it - it is however not powerful enough to playback [most] HD video and this is the reason why I'm disappointed by the current wave of devices.
I have terabyte upon terabyte of [mostly] HD video stored on my server which I am unable to view on the phone without re-encoding them. This is a process I go thru at the moment with my HD2 and I was really looking forward to a little more horsepower in WP7 devices so I could simply import then rather than spend a lot of time re-encoding them first.
Personally, I have to get a 1st wave device for development purposes, but I very much doubt it will replace my current HD2 or Evo as the day to day phone. Not only for reasons of hardware but also due to lack of services offered locally (no localized bing search, no XBL integration, no 'full' marketplace, no Zune pass and the list goes on).

No manufacturers going to change it up?

I am wondering if any manufacturers are going to be different anytime soon? I am hoping that by July we will see a little "fragmentation" i.e. we have tegra 2 phone with 32GB data and a SAMOLED screen.
Or is chassis 1 very, very strict, that we are only going to see specs x.

well MS has set all minimum specs, but I'm guessing that for things like CPU, MS should define what manufacturers can use as they're all too scared to just put any chip in without causing damage to the WP image. Most of the variations at present can really come from the camera, on board memory (and sd slot), and the screen type. Everything else you'll find to be quite similar at this stage, but hopefully MS defines the other 2 chassis type so that more variations can come about.

Meh, its annoying that the closest to what I want is a slider.
I plan on never having a slider again after seeing pretty much every person who owned a slider(including me) have it break. Conditions don't seem to suit sliders much.
16GB, 4" AMOLED screen, SD slot and audio quality coming out of the phone that is just as good the the Zune HD's.
Omnia 7 just misses it by no SD slot, 16GB almost impossible to get in SA, and the audio out seems to have missed all the low bass?!
I use quality headphones + an amp, or I plug my phone into my speaker system or my car. I will notice those frequencies...
Though one thing I do not care for, definately goes to speaker quality, neer really cared about that.

Agree! if just ONE manufacture put their whole effort into 1 of their WP7 phones, it would wipe the floor with the competition and give us all an obvious choice when it comes to selecting a wp7 phone. instead, the choice is difficult and they are technically no better than the 18 month old HD2 if just one of these new phones had for example a front facing camera, 32gb nand memory or more... ive no doubt it would be everyones pick.

I think the Samsung Omnia is the best device, however its a shame that it only comes with 8GB memory and no way to expand it.

Phone Titan said:
I think the Samsung Omnia is the best device, however its a shame that it only comes with 8GB memory and no way to expand it.
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That's why the Venue Pro is better

Jim Coleman said:
That's why the Venue Pro is better
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I love this phone all except for slider if it was as slim as the HD7 I would not hesitate in getting one. The 4.1 AMOLED screen is just right and 16 GB memory will get me buy for now.

if i was patient enough i probably wuld have got the venue pro if it has 16gb

agp64 said:
I love this phone all except for slider if it was as slim as the HD7 I would not hesitate in getting one. The 4.1 super AMOLED screen is just right and 16 GB memory will get me buy for now.
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It's AMOLED without "Super". AFAIK, only Samsung phones have S-AMOLED display.

The chassis only stated minimums... The OEMS aren't building more expensive devices because they don't have to. When the OS has picked up and is selling more, then you'll see the superphones (The first Android phone was not an Evo)

rexian said:
It's AMOLED without "Super". AFAIK, only Samsung phones have S-AMOLED display.
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Click to collapse
Sorry my mistake.[Fixed] I was just reading up on the difference and the super looks a fair bit better again.

Picking your next Windows Phone... What is your priority feature?

Thought this might be interesting if I go by things I read on different threads.
This won't be the case but let's assume you can get any phone on any carrier and price isn't an issue.
How would you pick your next phone?
I allowed for multiple choice but try not to vote for 6 out of 8 or this won't teach us anything specific. And if you picked "Other", what did you have in mind?

Other: gyroscope support and > 1 GHz processor

My most important features: Screen size (less than 4"), Camera (high quality with dual led), and something not there build quality.
I am pretty much all in for the Nokia 800. Second choice is the Samsung Omnia W.

For me there has to be a hardware keyboard - I just hate capacitive touch keyboards.

Price, can't be more than $100 with no contract. And of course, significantly better than my LG Quantum, otherwise I have no reason to upgrade.

I LOVE massive phones, I went from my HD2, to an HD7, and if God would answer my prayers, the Titan would come to T-Mobile, though, soon enough it won't matter as I'm hoping we become AT&T. So, I voted for FFC since it's already a given to me that I'm going for a big phone. Screen type would probably be a close second for me, as I like the HD7 screen, but really wish it were a higher quality, but hey, I'm asking to be spoiled now, right?

It's odd to see one user out of two ready to buy a phone on its brand alone
I personally go for what I find better overall regardless of the OEM.

species5618w said:
Price, can't be more than $100 with no contract. And of course, significantly better than my LG Quantum, otherwise I have no reason to upgrade.
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Yeah I guessed price would come up for many people as well as choice given by the carrier which is why I said in the first post regardless of price and availability

Peew971 said:
It's odd to see one user out of two ready to buy a phone on its brand alone
I personally go for what I find better overall regardless of the OEM.
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I personally love HTC, I know I'm probably in the current minority, for some odd reason as they're the only phones to consistently update without an issue, but Nokia is also winning over my heart.

I really want my Mozart to be my last HTC ever. But it's been my desire to abandon them since like 2005, and I still was forced to buy their stuff because others were mostly even worse.
In your list, it goes like this: screen less than 4", 16GB minimum (64 preferred), usable camera, 1500+ mAH battery. No pentile crap. Looks are also kind of important, but I can live with something less than stellar.
The leaks and announcements really make me sad, I don't see anything really attractive. SeaRay is almost there but it looks like it'll come with PenTile, so it's most probably a no go...

I'm with FiyaFleye, I like HTC and and have seen problems that would affect with other OEMS that I don't have with my Fuze. Nokia I have no idea on that but haven't had one in 4 yrs and it was a dumbphone. However not willing to wait another 3 months+ for them either. I would like a hardware keyboard with a smaller screen would be first choice, or go with a big screen so I can type well. Extra nick nacks are always a plus if they are usable, and 1 gig > processor for some future app usage is good too.
This list would have been so much easier in Aug before they started announcing phones, I'm just waiting for mine to come to the USA.

I'd love to get my hands on a Nokia WP7 phone, but that could take a while and the HTC Titan is kinda expensive over here.
I'll prolly just get a Samsung Omnia W if I get too impatient, really wanna see what the better CPU/GPU can do for my emulator.
Also I'd really like to see some 32GB storage phones, 8GB is just killing me on my Trophy.

1. Storage, it must be at least 32gb
2. Nokia
I will only consider getting a phone that isn't a nokia if the storage space is 32gb or above (and nokia only offer 16gb variants).
If storage space doesn't improve by the end of the year I will probably jump ship to android, even though I prefer Windows Phone my music collection is a must for me.
I'm hoping *fingers crossed* that the Nokia 800 will come in 16gb and 64gb variants like the N9 and thus will be my next phone (in blue )

Manufacturer is gonna come into play for my next WP7. IE i'm not having another Samsung phone.

I went with screen size. 3.5" ish would be good. Also, want good battery life. At least a 1500mah battery.

Funny how so few people picked FF Camera when it's supposed to be an epic fail not to have it since Apple "invented" video chat

I would have bought that Samsung Omnia 7 W like today if it came with 16 GB...
Sent from my OMNIA7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

1. Storage...at least 32 GB
3. Camera quality
3. Screen quality
I don't know any one that actually uses the FFC...nothing but a gimmick.

I´m asking myself if I need a new WP in general...
My OMNIA 7 has all features I use daily (less DLNA and skype support).
So today I took a look at the new HTC devices:
1. HTC Omega is too small.
2. HTC Titan is too big for my taste.
The display is much better than the HD7 display but not even better than the OMNIA 7 display. Also the general quality of the phone is very good: less plastic parts and good working hardware buttons (compared with the HD7).
Do I need a HTC Titan 4.7" notebook in my pocket ? I don´t think so.
The upcoming OMNIA W will only have 8 GB, maybe 16GB... is this what I need ? I don´t think so either.
A general question is: Do I really need a FF cam ? How many videocalls I made in the past ? I only made normal voip calls...
I would say the only hope is that the NOKIA Empire strikes back... and I don´t think that the new devices will have more than 16 GB.
I hope that I´m wrong, but I think it´s better to wait 3 or 4 month before buying a new WP.
Regards
contable

I never thought I'd say this, but camera is my #1. Since everyone seems to be pinching pennies these days and both of my old 5MP point-and-shoots are just crappy, my phone has become my #1 camera for both stills and video. I remember when cameras first came out on cell phones and I was thinking, "why?" All that, and baby is now 12 weeks old, so I'm taking pictures like crazy!
Screen size is a close second. I doubt I could ever go smaller than my 4" Focus screen at this point.

High Praise Nokia From Gizmodo Of All Places

http://m.gizmodo.com/5857409/nokia-lumia-800-lightning-review-the-unattainable-foreign-beauty
Makes me want to hunt one down. Group buy anyone?

I would buy, easily. Shame it's not selling here, and if I buy from another country, when it arrives I would have to pay 100% of tax.

I don't get this preconceived ideas on some media outlets. Why "from Gizmodo of all places"? Maybe you only read some website because you think they're biased but I try to read a bit from all of them. For information this is how Gizmodo reviewed things before this phone:
- Zune HD: they loved it and wished it was a phone
- WP7: they loved that Zune HD turned into a phone, loved the OS, only hoped MS would update it quickly
- Mango: they loved it, just what they wanted from WP7
So really when you say "from Gizmodo of all places" you must really think they're just Apple fanboys who hate everything else when actually recent history proved they're not.
---------- Post added at 04:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:45 PM ----------
Should I Buy This
The Lumia 800 is by far the best Windows Phone you can buy.
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If it is better than the HTC Titan then it is some phone.

This is the kind of statement that always makes me question integrity (ironic given what I said above). Best Windows Phone when it's missing features that are on both the Titan and Focus S, that's a bit odd.

Peew971 said:
I don't get this preconceived ideas on some media outlets. Why "from Gizmodo of all places"? Maybe you only read some website because you think they're biased but I try to read a bit from all of them. For information this is how Gizmodo reviewed things before this phone:
- Zune HD: they loved it and wished it was a phone
- WP7: they loved that Zune HD turned into a phone, loved the OS, only hoped MS would update it quickly
- Mango: they loved it, just what they wanted from WP7
So really when you say "from Gizmodo of all places" you must really think they're just Apple fanboys who hate everything else when actually recent history proved they're not.
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It's quite simple, all websites in the Gawker network are known for from time to time write very bad articles just to piss people off. Because that gives them traffic boosts.
Here are two examples of articles that has been criticized:
http://gizmodo.com/5833787/my-brief-okcupid-affair-with-a-world-champion-magic-the-gathering-player
http://kotaku.com/5818213/professional-gaming-on-the-downturn-cheesy-tv-to-blame
They may give publicity to Windows Phone, which is a very good thing (for us), but I can't help to wonder if it isn't just to piss off the MS haters.

This anti-WP7 bias that supposedly exists on review sites is total BS.
Accept it people - it's entirely possible reviewers just don't like WP7 OS or hardware vs the Android and iPhones they're used to.

Aphasaic2002 said:
This anti-WP7 bias that supposedly exists on review sites is total BS.
Accept it people - it's entirely possible reviewers just don't like WP7 OS or hardware vs the Android and iPhones they're used to.
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Quite possible, but that should not preclude an honest review of the inadequacies AND capabilities of WP7 without going on a rant about how MS should give up and concede the market. And for the record, anti-WP7 reviewer bias is not BS.

you know it's part of advertising right? Companies like Apple, MS and Google paid big bucks to splatters their name all over the web. In this case....probable Nokia.
I never trust any review on the web...unless it's by the consumers.

The Nokia might be a nice phone, but all I know is that if I were to settle for such a small phone, I would go with the Focus Flash. I much prefer a perfectly flat screen and the shape and style of the Flash is outstanding. Combined with a better AMOLED display and the style, the Flash is more appealing to me than the Lumia 800 and it has pretty much the same hardware...both are just as featureless, I mean (no FFC and such).

Peew971 said:
This is the kind of statement that always makes me question integrity (ironic given what I said above). Best Windows Phone when it's missing features that are on both the Titan and Focus S, that's a bit odd.
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The best Windows Phone to me is the Lumia 800. The Windows Phone with the most bells and whistles is the Focus S.

If Samsung went back to some captivate-esque build quality then I'd be onboard. The lumia 800 just dominates the build quality department though.

nicksti said:
The best Windows Phone to me is the Lumia 800. The Windows Phone with the most bells and whistles is the Focus S.
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It's your right to prefer the Lumia 800 as best for your needs. I just think that as a media outlet that has access to all the phones I find it a bit odd to give this title to this particluar phone when the Titan and Focus S have bigger screens, removable batteries or FFC for instance. You would have to give some considerable weight to Nokia Drive but it doesn't look like it was a factor there.

Peew971 said:
It's your right to prefer the Lumia 800 as best for your needs. I just think that as a media outlet that has access to all the phones I find it a bit odd to give this title to this particluar phone when the Titan and Focus S have bigger screens, removable batteries or FFC for instance. You would have to give some considerable weight to Nokia Drive but it doesn't look like it was a factor there.
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If smaller screen and lack of removeable battery were ever a negative, the iPhone should have never gotten the 9s it got in every iteration on Engadget. There is little difference between the Titan and 800; both have smaller storage and lack of FFC.
But to be honest, if I was an online reviewer and I had to say which phone is currently the best Windows Phone, I would say the Lumia 800. You may not read my articles ever again
Let us face facts, in the Windows Phone world the experience from phone to phone is going to be so similar that something like looks, camera, and colours could be the differentiator. I have been harping on the lack of colours on these feature phones for a while now. I think Nokia really has something with that.

nicksti said:
There is little difference between the Titan and 800; both have smaller storage and lack of FFC.
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The Titan comes with a 1.3MP FFC.

nicksti said:
If smaller screen and lack of removeable battery were ever a negative, the iPhone should have never gotten the 9s it got in every iteration on Engadget. There is little difference between the Titan and 800; both have smaller storage and lack of FFC.
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Sometimes I cannot tell if you're serious with some things you say. The Titan has a FFC and a much bigger screen. Same goes for the Focus S. The iPhone wasn't compared to another iPhone in the ecosystem unlike the Lumia 800. It's not like you had the choice of a 4" iPhone you can compare it to. In the same ecosystem the Lumia is missing features other phones have so to call best WP out there is questionable when this is coming from a tech website reviewer (if you want to believe that good for you). Unless like I said you consider Nokia Drive to be an amazing must have feature.

Peew971 said:
Sometimes I cannot tell if you're serious with some things you say. The Titan has a FFC and a much bigger screen. Same goes for the Focus S. The iPhone wasn't compared to another iPhone in the ecosystem unlike the Lumia 800. It's not like you had the choice of a 4" iPhone you can compare it to. In the same ecosystem the Lumia is missing features other phones have so to call best WP out there is questionable when this is coming from a tech website reviewer (if you want to believe that good for you). Unless like I said you consider Nokia Drive to be an amazing must have feature.
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It was an error on my part. I dunno why you say that about me. I thought we agreed it is a personal thing. Why is a "much bigger screen" a positive thing? The best selling phone in the last 3 years has a 3.5" screen. Yes, there are no iPhone options, but choice is choice, and people choose to own a 3.5" iPhone.
I am wrong about the FFC, my error, but I am serious that I think the Lumia is the best Windows Phone on the market.
All my opinions and needs:
The Lumia 800 is the most gorgeous phone I have ever seen. Ever. This is the RAZR of 2004. The iPhone 4 of 2010.
I am strongly considering getting the blue.
The features that it does lack I do not care too much about. My Defy was 2GB internal, 2GB microSD card. Plenty of space left. I do not need a FFC.
I want a phone that looks good, is easy to pocket and hold, has a nice screen, wonderful battery life, is stable, and has a high end camera. The compromise I am making is in the app department with the ecosystem (no EA scrabble, do they have words with friends?) but I will live.
I am serious. So the Focus S with its AMOLED screen, 1GB RAM, and bigger storage is the best one out of the three to you?

I probably won't get any of the 3 due to the lack of 32GB (although you never know since I've just repurchased a Zune HD) but yes in my eyes the Focus S is the best one. 4" and 4.3" are the two screen sizes that suit me so the Lumia is too small and the Titan too big. Also Samsung phones tend to get better battery life and camera experience when compared to HTCs. FFC I can live without so I don't hold that too much against the Lumia 800 (but then again I'm not a reviewer).
Ultimately none are worth getting a new contract for when they're not significantly better than my Omnia 7 so I'll wait and see what comes in 2012.

Peew971 said:
I probably won't get any of the 3 due to the lack of 32GB (although you never know since I've just repurchased a Zune HD) but yes in my eyes the Focus S is the best one. 4" and 4.3" are the two screen sizes that suit me so the Lumia is too small and the Titan too big. Also Samsung phones tend to get better battery life and camera experience when compared to HTCs. FFC I can live without so I don't hold that too much against the Lumia 800 (but then again I'm not a reviewer).
Ultimately none are worth getting a new contract for when they're not significantly better than my Omnia 7 so I'll wait and see what comes in 2012.
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We are def in two different segments from that standpoint. I love my Defy. It is the most compact 3.7" phone I have ever seen. Smaller than an iPhone with a 3.5" screen (thicker but in all more compact). I used a SE X10 for a day and it was a bit of a struggle getting out of my jeans when sitting.
I really wanted an Omnia 7. But I knew WP was not for me then due to missing apps I needed. Then I read all the issues with Omnia and updates. So I would be hesitant to get the Flash. But I agree that there is not enough reason to go from Gen 1 to Gen 2. Its like the HTC wildfire/desire to wildfire s / desire s.
Call me superficial but the N9 had me at hello. When I read the Sea Ray rumour I could not wait. Unfortunately, I read the unlocked version may not be available until 2012

Peew971 said:
Sometimes I cannot tell if you're serious with some things you say. The Titan has a FFC and a much bigger screen. Same goes for the Focus S. The iPhone wasn't compared to another iPhone in the ecosystem unlike the Lumia 800. It's not like you had the choice of a 4" iPhone you can compare it to. In the same ecosystem the Lumia is missing features other phones have so to call best WP out there is questionable when this is coming from a tech website reviewer (if you want to believe that good for you). Unless like I said you consider Nokia Drive to be an amazing must have feature.
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A bigger screen isnt always a plus esp as they have the same resolution and thus the lumia has a higher pixle density and its got the clear black amoledscreen. Big screen = big ugly device that sits heavy in my pocket. I would not only say the lumia has a better screen than the titan i would say it smashes it to the ground. I drive a 7 seater hyundai is that a better car then my old Subaru Impreza i think not. Bigger isnt always better.