Ok well a guy I work with has a Samsung Focus, pretty decent device. BTW this is the only person I know that has a windows phone. ATT gave him the Focus free because of him having problems with his previous dumb phone. That was nice of ATT.
So recently this guy told me that the Focus has been giving him problems of late and he is hating it, like when he opens the camera and press the camera button the phone restarts.
So another guy I work with sold him an iphone 3g as a backup. So he goes home and plays with a non activated iphone 3g and he is wowed by the 3g. He told me how he downloaded apps and the phone was so fun without it even being activated. Now he wants an iphone which is fine because WP didnt win him over. They lost a user by ATT even giving him the WP device for free.
One thing I have noticed is that people tend to follow the fad. Siri is nice, which makes Tellme have a lot of work to do. I stand behind Windows Phone and will continue to. Everyone I know either are a Android or iphone user besides my cousin who is still a Symbian user but im slowly converting him over to Windows phone with the Nokia device.
My question is, how will WP overcome the competition or will they ever. They have a long way to go keeping up with the competition and passing them up. What will Windows offer that will appeal to more users? How will Windows wow people?
I have a kid that had an iPhone 3GS and Apple swapped her 3GS *FIVE* times, because all of them would either reboot, drop service, etc, etc. Got her an HTC Surround and she loves it. Couple weeks ago she dropped her surround and cracked the display. I asked her if she wanted to switch back to using her iPhone 3GS and she said "not thanks, I'd rather user this one with a cracked screen than my iPhone".
Molly Wood obviously got a problematic HTC Trohpy when she did her review, as she said it rebooted once to twice a day. Anyone who has a Windows Phone 7 knows that they are very stable and if you have one with issues, its probably HW related. The iPhone is considered a fairly stable platform, yet you hear problems all the time of stability and signal issues. All platforms have hardware issues and its how the carriers and OEM deal with this is really what is the big impact.
I have an InfiniTV that has never had an issue, yet I ordered one for a friend and his stops working every once in a while. Again, probably bad hardware.
My best friend works for AT&T as a floor sales person and I was talking to him about Windows Phone. He said the reason that he doesn't push them is that they have a high return rate. I asked him if it was because the OS is poor or that it was different from Android and iOS and he said he didn't really know.
I was showing a good friend of mine my focus yesterday and he really liked it. However, when he went into T-Mobile, he got an Android "because it was cheap and did what he needed". Both of my kids have Windows Phone and all of their friends with Android and iPhones say they wish they had a Windows Phone. None of them have switched, though.
And Siri? Lets just say "No Sir-e". Android, iPhone and Windows Phone all have voice commands. When was the last time you saw someone use them? Probably sames answer as when was the last time you saw someone else with a Windows Phone.... Voice commands are cool, but not actually used much, yet?
Different people have different views about how to use their phone.
Siri is a nice feature, but you don't use it all the time.
I bet 99% people here used to love playing around with Voice Features when it first came out, but then they find themselves hardly use it. I know i did.
People would find themsleves a suitable device and OS, because it really depends on how they use it, how much they have, which features they want, and how it helps their life. Everone has a different taste, just like when you say the HD2 is too big and then a lot of people still love it.
You never expected the phone gonna answer you the whole thing you throw to it, so don't depend on it, they don't have a human brain to reconize everything we said from slang... pros vocabs and a supersmart and large database to give you the answer. Just pull it out from your pocket, spend 5s to type it in Bing Search doesn't make your world end. And it isn't always suitable to speak to the phone, some craps like "i need a bathroom" you will never speak it in front of people... most people prefer to deal with it by their own and in silent.
WP7 has Microsoft TellMe, but i hardly use it, mostly, i just enable it to read messege for me when i play games "in my own room".
But i agree, Tellme need to be upgraded, and Microsoft just published a new video about it. Look impressive to me.
I am no fan of apple product, but siri seems to have some real potential. At the release, people are disappointed because they thought it was just voice control. But actually I think it's not. Controlling the phone with voice is not a brand new idea, just like touch screen was not brand new when iphone was released. I might be wrong, but I feel Google and Microsoft will be following up on this idea.
If you hear about more people with iPhone issues than WP7 issues, it might be due to the fact that there are about 30 times as many iPhones as there are WP7 devices in circulation.
And I think is just a bit disingenuous to put the voice command features of WP7 and Android in the same league as Siri (not directed at you, resol341). Yes, they will get there, but they aren't there today. They aren't even close.
I agree, voice features are nice to have, but all I use on my Titan is the read out text thing when in the car ( which is very useful), thing is though Siri just looks really neat and will impress people enough that it will significantly add to the reasons to buy an iPhone. Microsoft is still playing catch up even after mango, they need to overhaul the competion with some killer features if they want to get mindshare, time is limited.
From another thread.
I had a friendly WP7 vs Siri Face-off today at work. It was actually pretty funny. I can't remember everything that was said, but it did involve:
"Naked Football Statistics" (WP) weather reports of Clear during a thunderstorm (Siri), Escorts to the Vikings-Bears game (WP), I can't answer that or I don't know what you mean every other question (Siri), "There are no nearby adult services" (Siri) and "Bubble, Bladder shoe powder" (WP).
Not to mention... WP won't cuss when sending a text. Gives you, "No [email protected]!" instead of No ****. Siri will cuss. And, Siri read that obscured expletive as, "Dollar sign at".
Siri also didn't know what my co-worker meant by LMFAO. WP sends lol as L-o-l. But, if it receives it as lol, it says, "laugh out loud". While siri says, "Lawl".
We spent about 30 minutes doing this as we weren't too busy. It was pretty funny all the crazy stuff coming from the two platforms.
They both got a lot of things right and did pretty well but they definitely got things wrong. Overall, they turned out to be roughly the same in their understanding of spoken phrases and repeating said phrases.
In the end, Siri's biggest advantage was that it has more commands at its disposal than Windows Phone allowing some context in questions and search. Whereas, windows phone is fairly straight forward and has less commands. That being said, believe it or not, they're fairly equal in capabilities.
Wyn6 said:
From another thread.
I had a friendly WP7 vs Siri Face-off today at work. It was actually pretty funny. I can't remember everything that was said, but it did involve:
"Naked Football Statistics" (WP) weather reports of Clear during a thunderstorm (Siri), Escorts to the Vikings-Bears game (WP), I can't answer that or I don't know what you mean every other question (Siri), "There are no nearby adult services" (Siri) and "Bubble, Bladder shoe powder" (WP).
Not to mention... WP won't cuss when sending a text. Gives you, "No [email protected]!" instead of No ****. Siri will cuss. And, Siri read that obscured expletive as, "Dollar sign at".
Siri also didn't know what my co-worker meant by LMFAO. WP sends lol as L-o-l. But, if it receives it as lol, it says, "laugh out loud". While siri says, "Lawl".
We spent about 30 minutes doing this as we weren't too busy. It was pretty funny all the crazy stuff coming from the two platforms.
They both got a lot of things right and did pretty well but they definitely got things wrong. Overall, they turned out to be roughly the same in their understanding of spoken phrases and repeating said phrases.
In the end, Siri's biggest advantage was that it has more commands at its disposal than Windows Phone allowing some context in questions and search. Whereas, windows phone is fairly straight forward and has less commands. That being said, believe it or not, they're fairly equal in capabilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then i would say Siri has more command but Bing on Windows Phone is a smart searching engine.
The title has nothing to do with the actual thread as from the story the guy was wowed by an iPhone 3G so that has nothing to do with Siri.
This is the real issue... Even without Siri people would still go and buy the iPhone 4S, that has nothing to do with voice command.
Windows Phone is great, the UI is smooth, it rarely crashes (well except on HTC phones it seems) and integrates social quite well. However for most people, once the first 2-3 weeks are gone the novelty comes from apps and games and these are not there on WP. If you need a particular app for your phone, you will definitely find it on iOS and will probably find it on Android. It's very unlikely you will find it on WP unless it's a very popular app and even then there's no guarantee. A typical conversation between a WP an a android/iPhone user goes like this:
- Let me call you, do you have skype?
- It's not available yet (no one cares if it's "coming")
- How about Tango?
- Not there either but I have WhatsApp
- Alright, fine
- Do you have "X" app? It's pretty great
- Nope
- How about "X" game? It will blow you away
- Neither but I do have Xbox Live on my phone
- Cool, I have an Xbox 360, what games do you get on the phone?
- (better not to mention)
Rince and repeat the last bit with facebook and Zune. It's nice to have if you're into these things but it's not groundbreaking.
Most people get their phone on a 2 years contract, they don't want a phone that's just nice and promises more apps and games, they can just get that phone in 2 years time!
I was definitely going to recommend WP to my friends after Mango but the truth is there hasn't been an app or game worth downloading in 2 or 3 months so once the novelty wears off they would be pretty bored. My girlfriend has been playing 3 different Angry Birds games on her Nexus S lately and she got them all for free. She has dozens of apps that don't exist on WP so I can't possibly push her towards the platform. Same goes for my gamer friends who have tons of great games on their iPhone. Windows Phone could have competed on price but now you can get an iPhone 3GS for free or an iPhone 4 for 99$ so you would need seriously good arguments.
So all in all the issue isn't just Siri impressing people, it's also Microsoft not having a "Siri feature", i.e. a feature that makes you go "I want that phone".
RoboDad said:
If you hear about more people with iPhone issues than WP7 issues, it might be due to the fact that there are about 30 times as many iPhones as there are WP7 devices in circulation.
And I think is just a bit disingenuous to put the voice command features of WP7 and Android in the same league as Siri (not directed at you, resol341). Yes, they will get there, but they aren't there today. They aren't even close.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Has microsoft finally released sales figures for wp7, or is this speculation ? 30:1 seems quite high on the wp side.
No the guy wants a 4s. The guy who sold him the 3g upgraded to the 4s and he saw that. He doesn't want the 3g as his primary.
Lets be real the only reason the 4s is selling crazy like it is because of the iPhone reputation and siri. No one cares about the dual core and obviously a bigger screen didn't matter wither in which plenty of people gripped about.
Sent from my Venue Pro using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
937dytboi said:
No the guy wants a 4s. The guy who sold him the 3g upgraded to the 4s and he saw that. He doesn't want the 3g as his primary.
Lets be real the only reason the 4s is selling crazy like it is because of the iPhone reputation and siri. No one cares about the dual core and obviously a bigger screen didn't matter wither in which plenty of people gripped about.
Sent from my Venue Pro using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most people buy the iPhone for its status symbol... they want to be in line for 4 days, show off their brand new iPhone and use about 1% of its abilities.
You do have a number of geeks, nerds and power users that make the best of a great smartphone like the iPhone, but the majority of them are just sheep, that buy into a trent or very well marketed brand (where MS needs to seriously catch up).
937dytboi said:
No the guy wants a 4s. The guy who sold him the 3g upgraded to the 4s and he saw that. He doesn't want the 3g as his primary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't matter. The point is when he tried an iPhone he knew he wanted that. Now he wants the 4S most likely because it's the latest iPhone but his choice of OS was already made so this has nothing to do with Siri to start with.
4 million in 3 days is freaking amazing.
The biggest let down around here, has become the highest selling.
Remember we don't need dual cores, stupid app launcher OS, and only one device with a small screen.
vetvito said:
4 million in 3 days is freaking amazing.
The biggest let down around here, has become the highest selling.
Remember we don't need dual cores, stupid app launcher OS, and only one device with a small screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is impressive, but not unexpected. Now that Sprint, Verizon, and AT&T all have the iPhone, it's a guaranteed record breaker.
In all honesty though, who really cares? I prefer to have what I think is best for me. I do not care what anyone else thinks of my phone. I do go through phones quickly because I am addicted to technology and just like to keep up with it. I would never buy a phone so that I can prove to the world how cool I am.
I think Siri is great technology (even if Apple didn't really develop it). I also know that it is something I would only use when trying to impress others. I am not one to broadcast what I am doing on my phone out loud. There are few scenarios where voice control would appeal to me. But, this technology is important and needs to continue developing and improving.
I tried Siri in my natural language (Italian) and it couldn't even place a phone call or open an application. I didn't read any manual about it, but it tried saying phrases like "Call <Name>" or "text <someone>" or "open mail" or "search for <thing>". And it never worked!
Never had such problem with WP7.5, except for once when I tried to "search for GLEE" and it opened Bing searching for "teen ass" :-/
Wyn6 said:
In the end, Siri's biggest advantage was that it has more commands at its disposal than Windows Phone allowing some context in questions and search. Whereas, windows phone is fairly straight forward and has less commands. That being said, believe it or not, they're fairly equal in capabilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're kidding, right?
Can you schedule an appointment or set a location-specific reminder with WP7's voice commands?
Sure, WP7 can find a few things on Bing searches, but that is only a small part of Siri. It is integrated into the OS on a much deeper level than Tellme, and can do a lot more. They are not fairly equal.
No, sir. I'm not kidding. Fairly equal doesn't mean exactly equal. Siri can do a few more things than WP can do as I stated. But, having watched/listened to the tech firsthand, it doesn't do a ton more than WP does. I'm not saying it isn't better I'm just saying it isn't overwhelmingly superior as some believe.
My post above was anecdotal and not really a comparison of which was better. It was more me dwelling on the humorous things that both of the services came up with when asked to do certain tasks. Siri may have more commands but it's understanding of what a user is saying doesn't really surpass WP per se.
But, just for you, Robodad ... when I go back to work tomorrow, I'll play with it some more and see if we missed something. Although, she had me playing a game of Words with Friends against her brother-in-law. So, Siri experimentation might take a backseat.
Wyn6 said:
That being said, believe it or not, they're fairly equal in capabilities.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I played with both, there is no comparison.
Also, day to day usage is a big plus, as far as voice commands go. Its possible to navigate to a friends house, txt them you're on the way, and check traffic without much hassle. Pretty badass from a phone.
Where's that speach to text video that was so laughable not long ago....
kevyn82 said:
I tried Siri in my natural language (Italian) and it couldn't even place a phone call or open an application. I didn't read any manual about it, but it tried saying phrases like "Call <Name>" or "text <someone>" or "open mail" or "search for <thing>". And it never worked!
Never had such problem with WP7.5, except for once when I tried to "search for GLEE" and it opened Bing searching for "teen ass" :-/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's why i love Bing/TellMe/windows phone, it knows what i want
Related
We all know that most, if not all the people, on this forum are "abnormal". We use our phones in ways that most people do not, and we expect/demand features and capabilities that most people do not use or don't care much about.
My simple question is, if you were "normal", if you forget all those extraordinary demands and ways you use your phone, would Windows Phone 7 Series appeal to you?
Feel free to leave a response as to why you answer as you do.
I guess if I were a "normal" person I'd have likes WP7S.. the reason is that, when I got my first WM phone.. it took me about 2 weeks to get everything going (I was a symbian user before).. for me, I could use all the functions of the phone.. but if I gave it to one of my "normal" friends he can't even get access to the music player, they didn't know what the start button was.. I mean let's face WM is complicated for someone who haven't used it before.. but look at the iPhone.. all so plain and is like "click on the program, do what you want, press the home button".. anyone one can use it from the first time.. WP7S is easy to use and that's what is gonna to get it a big market share with the "normal" people..
Experimented...
I did a 15 minutes demo to my girlfriend (not tech savvy at all) to present her the general concepts and behaviors with the unlocked emulator. She liked what she saw a lot. She mostly liked the apparent ease of use and the overall appearance (metro).
I think the iPhone brand is far too entrenched in an mass-market and ordinary consumer's mind by now. That's the biggest huddle for MS to overcome. It might be through very clever marketing campaign as well as to sell WP7S extremely cheaply to appeal to the more budget conscious consumer, or by other method. Likelihood is, by now, every many "normal" consumer will have at least a few friends with iPhone/iPod Touch and they might also have briefly played with these devices and love what they see in iPhone/iPod Touch, which has achieved such incredibly high level of smoothness, user friendliness, and versatility (arising from the fact that you can find applications for almost anything under the sun by now). Among my friends, those who do not already own a smartphone all talk only about iPhone if they're going to get one. They have not even heard of WP7S up to now, if they're "normal". So, ya, lots of work to be done to get them, IMO.
I've shown the thing to my wife, non-tech-savvy colleagues, and my 4 year old daughter (not a target audience, but she uses her mom's iPhone easily). I haven't encountered a single person who wouldn't like it. Many say "wow, that's cool".
I tried to show my girlfriend it and she called me a nerd, but that doesn't matter because I like it anyway.
If I was "Normal" I would not even know about WM7 yet, there has been not official advertising or releases that would be mainstream visible.
When it was finally advertised i would see it in the same light as iPod vs Zune. And we all know who won that.
So, if I was going to go for any device it would be the iPhone, but as a normal person it would be more than I needed so I would likely stick with whatever came free with my plan.
Thank god I am not normal.
No, realy not
If I'm a normal, I'll not go to M$ anymore
Nokia for stability, or if I need an advanced one (as a normal) I'll go to IPHONE
but Microsoft, never ever
The WM6.xx is the best OS ever for business and truly advanced users.
Fa7my said:
I guess if I were a "normal" person I'd have likes WP7S.. the reason is that, when I got my first WM phone.. it took me about 2 weeks to get everything going (I was a symbian user before).. for me, I could use all the functions of the phone.. but if I gave it to one of my "normal" friends he can't even get access to the music player, they didn't know what the start button was.. I mean let's face WM is complicated for someone who haven't used it before.. but look at the iPhone.. all so plain and is like "click on the program, do what you want, press the home button".. anyone one can use it from the first time.. WP7S is easy to use and that's what is gonna to get it a big market share with the "normal" people..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i know here most people either use a nokia phone or the iphone.
y b normal?
If I were "normal" I had a nokia/samsung/whatever dumb phone. actually I even had such a phone before I got myself a Topaz.
Kloc said:
I tried to show my girlfriend it and she called me a nerd, but that doesn't matter because I like it anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha. Exactly the same here!
"Why are you showing me this - it's not even a real phone yet"
In all honestly, I think the majority of "normal" people will like it (I like the sexyness of it) - though there will always be those that don't!
I don't think WP7 will ever appeal to me! It's simply not a nice OS to look at. Just wait and see, Microsoft will still stay at the same spot. Don't expect them to make a leap forward with this WP7.
The whole premise of this thread is the issue.
There is no "normal user". There are only 3-4 big os right now and the fact is, anyone can like anything. The innovators tell us what we like in accordance to their discoveries and business model.
To contribute fully though. I would be like, "why does this look like my zune?" and I think I would be a little pissed. I think a normal person wouldn't mind some USB mass storage either.
Moved to WP7 Q&A as D&H is the wrong place for this thread
I may get roasted over this post, but it bugs me. First and formost not a big fan of the open source model. Have a friend that called me a freetard (I looked it up, some one who champions the cause for open source) when I had something positive to say about Andriod. Crazy! He is an iPhone, iPad user. iOs is based on Darwin which is open source. So when he made the argument for paying for software to drive innovation, it seemed a little odd. This guy is a rockstar in the IT world, but the iPhone smug is deffinately keeping him down. I was handed a Windows CE 1.0 device years ago and I could see the potential of this handy piece of equipment. Over the years I had some Windows CE based device at my side ever since. I have seen the rise of the Palm Pilot, listing to users complaing about how it synchs with outlook or doesn't until you buy something. I had my Pocket PC with Outlook, but the Pocket PC was not the rage so customers refused to even look. I was scratching my head as the Blackberry rose to power without the basic features I had enjoyed for years, it looked like a colorized version of a Palm Pilot. Enter the iPhone with the commercials touting listening to your music then answering a call. I was able to do that for years what was the big deal? Lotsa features in the iPhone at first were lacking.. how bout using songs as a custom ringtone... just plain old mp3 files.... nope you gotta jailbreak it. It was the must have items, if you had one you had status... it's a phone for crying out loud! Enter the G1 WITH NO OUT OF THE BOX EXCHANGE SUPPORT!!!! Use football, it sucks but it kinda works. Andriod is growing up into a much better phone O/S, better than the iSmug 4 (iPhone 4 for those who don't know a iPhone user or own one). Enter WP7 already condemed in the forums, even before official launch in the US. Windows CE from 1.0 to 6.5 were designed for lower resolution, smaller screens (excluding the screen size of the jornada and 1.0 devices) and a stylist. Phones are not like that anymore. A re-write has been long over due! From what I have read it's more like the Zune and it didn't act as a mass storage device either untill you installed a hack. I see the things it won't do as concerning sure, but as gamers argue the PS/3 is a better gaming box, it doesn't matter xbox is a more of a social network. I have seen the capabilities and it does now have huge potential. How many of you have installed Zune software and used it as a music player? Sure, internet radio is missing like a Winamp and it won't synch without a zune, that now has changed, but Winamp, itunes, any of them don't come close to the visual experiance and presentation of the zune software. Games that update your gamer score has my nephew frothing. Still has exchange support, better than Andriod when initially released on the G1.
Phones that had no out of the box tethering initially:
iPhone
Blackberry
Andriod
Palm O/S
All very successful O/S's. I think time will tell if WP7 is a hit or a miss, but in the tech world mediocre is usually the big winner. If tethering, mass storage support, and a few others are fixed in short order then who will you get behind? In all honesty I see huge potential in WP7. I have an xbox, use my phone as my music player... so bring on Zune software support! Work and play all in one device redesiegned for touch phones, I'm down to give it a try, to give it a chance to have some of it's limitations worked out in a few months. Don't be such a hater before it even has a chance.
You seem to be forgetting that not everyone wants what you want, there's loads of features which I consider unnecessary and others feel essential, and vice versa, does it matter? I don't think so. A friend of mine just got an iPhone 4, it's perfect for what *she* needs, I've never felt the need to ***** about how iOS is 'not for me'.
Using apps whilst on a call - I have never felt the need to do that, ever. I can, and it's nice to know that, but I can do without.
MS Exchange - I'm a teenager, what the hell am I going to do with exchange support?!
Tethering - I find it essential. No android doesn't have it built in (well, not included in shipping ROMs anyway), but I installed a *free* app, and now I can. I'm still able to sleep at night.
I agree that sometimes vendors can be a bit stupid about what they allow consumers to do (my girlfriend still can't set a wallpaper on her iPod touch, srsly), but as long as people are happy with their choice of device, does it really matter?
AdrianK said:
You seem to be forgetting that not everyone wants what you want, there's loads of features which I consider unnecessary and others feel essential, and vice versa, does it matter? I don't think so. A friend of mine just got an iPhone 4, it's perfect for what *she* needs, I've never felt the need to ***** about how iOS is 'not for me'.
Using apps whilst on a call - I have never felt the need to do that, ever. I can, and it's nice to know that, but I can do without.
MS Exchange - I'm a teenager, what the hell am I going to do with exchange support?!
Tethering - I find it essential. No android doesn't have it built in (well, not included in shipping ROMs anyway), but I installed a *free* app, and now I can. I'm still able to sleep at night.
I agree that sometimes vendors can be a bit stupid about what they allow consumers to do (my girlfriend still can't set a wallpaper on her iPod touch, srsly), but as long as people are happy with their choice of device, does it really matter?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're, in a way, making my point... I am not banging on Andriod here... not in any way. Stating a fact that all phone O/S's must grow over time. WP7 is a re-write, not an upgrade to 6.5 it will need to mature like the rest of them did. What your taking as a ***** about something is just the opposite, just saying hey there is potential there for a good device... see where it goes. As far as iPhone's go, maybe it is different in England... never been there, but people who own one here often times use it as statis. There is a funny youtube video on a lady who just wants one regardless and all they have in stock is an EVO. As I mentioned in my post... my nephew cares about the xbox points, I did not say I did. People should buy a device that does what they want not what others are buying. A phone doesn't make you better, it doesn't raise your status, and certainly doesn't make you more aware of the environment. An p.s. it is based on open source like the others. All that said isn't even a rip on the phone itself.
Many of those of us that are complaining about WP7 are long standing WinCE owners. My first WinCe phone was the BlueAngel but prior to that I had a jornada and acer n20w.
We don't hate M$ but we do feel let down by the focus of the new WP. I don't use face book or twiter, I don't want to play games, I don't give a toss about Zune, I don't want to have to open a windows live account.
I reserve the right to feck my phone up in an attempt to improve/personalise it.
I don't want a model T-ford with the engine hood welded down.
I would tend to agree with most of that a year ago. I got kicked in the a$$ by regular users.. same reason I got into this years ago. I was embracing change in the tech world it drove me to a point, but times have changed the way family's and businesses communicate. My supplier went off shore to the Phillipines, all my contacts there are on facebook. They know more about me then they probly should but has had a stronger team effect on our interaction. Good or bad technology is making leaps... it's a new direction. I am confident we are in the right place to drive the kind of change WP7 will need to make to have a more universal appeal. Nov 8 is big date for the O/S. I have a strong hunch no developer is gonna release a damn thing untill after that date.
awagner said:
You're, in a way, making my point... I am not banging on Andriod here... not in any way. Stating a fact that all phone O/S's must grow over time. WP7 is a re-write, not an upgrade to 6.5 it will need to mature like the rest of them did. What your taking as a ***** about something is just the opposite, just saying hey there is potential there for a good device... see where it goes. As far as iPhone's go, maybe it is different in England... never been there, but people who own one here often times use it as statis. There is a funny youtube video on a lady who just wants one regardless and all they have in stock is an EVO. As I mentioned in my post... my nephew cares about the xbox points, I did not say I did. People should buy a device that does what they want not what others are buying. A phone doesn't make you better, it doesn't raise your status, and certainly doesn't make you more aware of the environment. An p.s. it is based on open source like the others. All that said isn't even a rip on the phone itself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, yeah I get your point, and I agree. Somewhat thankfully, I don't think I've ever heard someone try to sound big because they own an iPhone, but I've never been to the states
I didn't see your post as complaining really. The title of the thread made me think "oh no, here we go again." But your post was not what I expected from that title.
I completely understand how some people consider no tethering a deal breaker. However, just look at other phone OSs and you will realize that tethering will happen, with or without the consent of the carrier or the OS builder.
The bottom line is simple. If any of the missing items are what someone considers a deal breaker, just wait it out. We will find out soon enough how development, both official and unofficial, will add to WP7s feature set.
I personally have a few concerns but nothing that would cause me any serious grief. This may not be the case for others. Comparitively, iTunes is a deal breaker for me with the iPhone. Android's lack of native and consistent music sync is driving me crazy. I doubt we will ever see the perfect device, so I just try to find something that provides me with the features that are most important to me.
Your mileage may vary!
awagner said:
I would tend to agree with most of that a year ago. I got kicked in the a$$ by regular users.. same reason I got into this years ago. I was embracing change in the tech world it drove me to a point, but times have changed the way family's and businesses communicate. My supplier went off shore to the Phillipines, all my contacts there are on facebook. They know more about me then they probly should but has had a stronger team effect on our interaction. Good or bad technology is making leaps... it's a new direction. I am confident we are in the right place to drive the kind of change WP7 will need to make to have a more universal appeal. Nov 8 is big date for the O/S. I have a strong hunch no developer is gonna release a damn thing untill after that date.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Much like you I am seeing that communication is very different than it was 2 or 3 years ago and it has nothing to do with the iphone (most users I know don't really text, send mms or even watch videos on thiers). What has changed things is twitter and facebook. A company or individual can accomplish more in getting the name and recognition of a product faster through these type of mediums than anything previous. Email is secondary to texting, updating your facebook or tweeting when it comes to communication with most of the younger generation (under 30). Most of my family that I had to force to use facebook is all over it now (ages 15-20) and our ability to cross reference our products (music, photography, etc...) or simply keep up to date with family events is much easier than before.
Windows Phone 7 taking advantage of these services makes it a desirable, easy to use product that looks great and allows growth in the future. The last 5 years has proven Windows Mobile is not going to sell and targeting only the closed in person who shuns social interaction through these mediums will be the fastest way to have a product fail.
no cut/paste will be the ultimate demise of wp7
Wow! I was expecting to get ripped from one side to another for merely mentioning a wait and see attitude. I am surprised to see other people get the point it is a direction change and much needed. A Great phone just does no cut it. With HTC sense and an Energy ROM I have everything I want to know right on the home screen, plus internet sharing, etc, etc... for me it's better than Andriod, but look at the market share for a once dominate phone. It's just not good enough, I think we can all agree a new direction for Microsoft is needed like it or not. I for one am looking forward to it, just need to rethink how I might get around the obsticals of the stuff that does not work. Hopefully, the HD2 will see a ROM soon hacked or not so I can get into it without pluncking down a bunch of cash for it.
orangekid said:
no cut/paste will be the ultimate demise of wp7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Isn't that supposed to be in the first update? Don't you think an xda developer will do anything with it or somebody else might write something?
awagner said:
Isn't that supposed to be in the first update? Don't you think an xda developer will do anything with it or somebody else might write something?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is already in the next update and is already being tested with the latest builds of the OS. There is no reason to be concerned unless waiting a couple months without c/p is going to cause a major problem for you.
orangekid said:
no cut/paste will be the ultimate demise of wp7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not to veer this topic off course....but it is stupid comments like this that annoy me...and apparently he doesn't pay attention to the news that copy/paste is coming in Jan.
Hi I had a Windows Mobile Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 and an Htc Diamond 2 but when Android arrived in the Market from Hero 1.5/2.1 to Desire 2.2 is been a great experience now. I am very happy and life is very easy. Android is the future of smartphones. Go for Android you won't make a mistake!!
I love Microsoft! I especially love developing for them. I think Visual Studio 2010 could quite easily be considered the best development environment in the world.
I love the fact that most people world wide use the same operating system, and that I can develop a single program and expect it to work on most peoples machines.
This is why I want WP7 to work well. I want to feel happy with it. I want others to feel happy with it too, because I want it to be a roaring success.
This is why I b**ch and moan about features that have been intentionally left out
That's exactly how I feel, except mines is from a consumer point of view.
MS always makes something with great potential, but then they half do it. Its like that with every MS product except the desktop.
Hmm... Could Microsoft do better? Sure. If you think Google has the magic pixey dust to make the perfect phone O/S that will make everyone happy you need to get out more. Apple and Blackberry have their own issues. I cringed creating a gmail account when I setup Andriod on my phone. Sure Microsoft has privacy issues, but at least I know with them I am the customer. With Google more often than not, your not. Has anybody listened to Eric Schmidt talk? The guy is just plain creepy, Google had to shut him up. "If you don't like street view just move." Ok, so where is it safe Eric? Your place? Oh I get it he is saying he is Noah and we must follow him to his ark. Look, all I am saying is give WP7 a chance.
Just FYI
HTC Support
Will there be any upgrade path to WP7? Free or purchase?
"I understand the importance of having the most up to date software for your HTC HD2. At this time, there are no plans on releasing a Windows Phone 7 update for any HTC device. I do apologize for any confusion that you may have had, I hope this clears things up for you"
XDA is officially my only hope for the HD2 and if nada then this phone will be worth very little in short order
The only thing that could change the path of t-mobile and HTC if t-mobile is sitting on thousands of HD2's only way they could unload them after the 8th is upgrade the phone!
Im pretty sure all WP7 updates will come via Zune
francomur99 said:
Hi I had a Windows Mobile Sony Ericsson Xperia X1 and an Htc Diamond 2 but when Android arrived in the Market from Hero 1.5/2.1 to Desire 2.2 is been a great experience now. I am very happy and life is very easy. Android is the future of smartphones. Go for Android you won't make a mistake!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If the future means having to reboot you phone, Or even worse have it fail to restart because a poor App. [I will give it a miss thanks.]
I have not enjoyed being left without a phone the few times this has happened.
Just give me a stable OS any day. [ Reliability is a key for success]
What do your friends think of your device?
I told my friend what device I planned on getting for my upgrade, he had immediate disgust, being a Apple loyalist. He told me I was better off going to Android because its open, he doesn't have reason why open is good. When I finally got my HD7 in the mail he was there to see me unbox it. And it amazed him, which surprised me. Then I was playing with it around a few other friends and they loved it....Especially my girlfriend, she loved how easy it was yo navigate the OS compared to my last device, Cliq with Android.
when introducing my friends to phones, i try and be as neutral as possible. as a result, one of my friends is getting a htc 7 trophy this week.
in the end, those that know the name first think about the old windows mobile, and hence give that response. the best way to get them past that is to have yours at hand, unlock it, and let them play with it.
let the phone do the talking. then end of story.
Coming from WM 6.5
My experience has been similar. My friends and family are used to me with my FUZE and WM 6.5.5 custom ROM. I just hand them my Focus and let them try it, answer any questions, and they are off and running and don't want to give it back to me LOL. Android, Apple, WM users, doesn't matter. The UI grabs them, especially the ease of navigation. When they use the MSN Movies app and watch the trailers, they are blown away.
Same experience here. This girl i know saw me using my focus and asked if she could see it. I hand her the phone and she just fell in love with it. I show her all the different hubs and all she could say was "this is sick..when is verizon getting one" lol. Like JamesAllen said.....the UI really grabs them.
Experience
My most memorable experience was walking into a larger Radio Shack store in NJ and asking for a pouch for the Focus and pulling out the phone. The sales clerk was a girl about 20 years old who grabbed the phone from me, asked what it was (they only sell the LG WP7 phone and that was a model) and immediately began playing with it. She was very technical and moved through the tiles and apps with ease, logged into Marketplace etc. and forgot all about my pouch. It was funny to see a young, technical person latch onto the phone with amazement.
jtn04 said:
Same experience here. This girl i know saw me using my focus and asked if she could see it. I hand her the phone and she just fell in love with it. I show her all the different hubs and all she could say was "this is sick..when is verizon getting one" lol. Like JamesAllen said.....the UI really grabs them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you young people say something is "sick" does that mean it is unwell?
3 people have bought wp7 phones after seeing mine, everyone else who has seen it was impressed but at the wrong point in their contract to change phones, although they will now seriously consider wp7 when they renew.
I am such a fan of the WP7 OS that I make a point of telling everyone I know about it. Anyone who sees me use it is impressed. I don't know if I have facilitated any actual WP7 purchases but I have definately opened it up for possibility with people who probably would have remained Android or iPhone fanboys for the near future.
I even make a point of walking into T-Mobile stores to talk about WP7 and to give feedback to them. The reason is because I have asked reps what other people think about WP7 and they usually just say, "I haven't heard much about it." At least it'll plant he seed with the reps to talk up WP7. I feel like an infantry unit for MS haha.
I also get favorable responses when I show the phone. A few fell head over heels for it. The one comment I don't like and should scare Microsoft is the one where the person says, "This is a fantastic phone but...I got my iTunes and Ipod and want everything organized together." I know every platform has hooks to make it difficult for the user to leave. It can be from an electronic device to a bank. Just that Apple has big hooks.
adesonic said:
When you young people say something is "sick" does that mean it is unwell?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least in the US, "Sick" is oftentimes used as a replacement word for "Awesome" or "Amazing" or "Rad".
nonameleft said:
Just that Apple has big hooks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hooks which suck.
iTunes is the hell on earth. That's why i sync my really old iPod only every 2 or 3 months.
First my friends where like"uhh that's just another Iphone clon (because they are used to everything that has a touchscreen is apple stuff)" then i would say "why is it a clon of apples iphone, tell me one thing that makes it a clon" and they can't answer. This just tells is how "stupid" some people are sometimes.
But as times go my friends are falling in love whit the smooth interface with live tiles, and actually one of my friends are going to buy one because of that.
This comes from a former Iphone and Ipad owner, noe on Omnia 7 and love it <3
So I showed my phone off to a friend and she loved it. She was a Blackberry user and loved how fluid my phone is and it's feature set. For the record I have a Samsung Focus.
She came to me today with her brand new phone "just like mine" and was wondering how to make the screen look like mine does. I looked at her phone and she bought an iPhone 4...
/sigh
She thought for sure my phone had to be an iPhone because who else is there?
I wonder if this lack of knowledge will be the doom of WP7...
it's like how people want to know the difference between an ipod and an mp3 player.
blame the retailers. and blame us geeks for knowing too much.
To OP......guess you didn't pass on enough info to your friend. I have a mate who after playing with my HD7 ditched his iPhone & bought an HD7 the next day. I keep passing on info about updates to him as coming from iPhone it's obvious to him a lot of features he's been used to are currently missing. Guess we've gotta keep flying the flag for this wonderful OS until MS catch up.
Sent from my HD7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
I told her multiple times it was a Windows phone. I guess it just didn't sink in. I have gotten over ten new WP7 users at work and 3 friends jumped on it out of work. I am doing my part! lol
A lot of the doctors I work with think anything Microsoft is evil and Apple is righteous (how backwards they have it) so converting them is a challenge but I am working on it.
Here come to all retards at my school, who have iPhone. They can sing out loud the song "Windows Phone sucks, iPhone rocks" for all day... Since i am the only one in the school have the Windows Phone.
The lacks of understanding the different between Windows Mobile 6.5 and Windows Phone 7, also some missing features , make they feel good about their iPhone.
My Friend also proud of his iPhone because his Fruit Ninja version run smoother than the Windows Phone version and that mean my phone sucks! LMAO...
Even i show them the correctly example of how Windows Phone 7 beat the crap out of iOS4 in speed and multi-tasking, they just tell me to shut up and they don't even care because they know the iPhone is the best! LOL...
Not only me, even Android user at school be blamed about this too...
The respond that i hear about my phone usually : "Okay, that's cool, but your phone sucks d*** "
I have nothing to tell them because they are all retarded, they don't even know what the different between Megabyte and Gigabyte is...
Strike_Eagle said:
Here come too all retards at my school, who have iPhone. They can sing out loud the song "Windows Phone sucks, iPhone rocks" for all day... Since i am the only one in the school have the Windows Phone.
The lacks of understanding the different between Windows Mobile 6.5 and Windows Phone 7, also some missing features , make they feel good about their iPhone.
My Friend also proud of his iPhone because his Fruit Ninja version run smoother than the Windows Phone version and that mean my phone sucks! LMAO...
Even i show them the correctly example of how Windows Phone 7 beat the crap out of iOS4 in speed and multi-tasking, they just tell me to shut up and they don't even care because they know the iPhone is the best! LOL...
Not only me, even Android user at school be blamed about this too...
The respond that i heared about my phone usually : "Okay, that's cool, but your phone sucks d*** "
I have nothing to tell them because they are all retarded, they don't even know what is the different between Megabyte and Gigabyte...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, the insecurities of youth. We've all been there. Your friends will look back one day and realize how stupid they were. Just enjoy your phone and don't worry about what others think. You'll be a happier person because of it.
Strike_Eagle said:
...
The respond that i heared about my phone usually : "Okay, that's cool, but your phone sucks d*** "
I have nothing to tell them because they are all retarded, they don't even know what is the different between Megabyte and Gigabyte...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just tell 'em your phone lets you get **** done and on with your life instead dicking around like them as if their phones were their pricks.
I just smile and laughing at them because they are being so stupid. They can laugh at me, but they don't even know what they are actually laughing about... Since i am the student from another country, so they think they are smarter than me...
Tell her to return the iPhone and take her yourself to get a new WP7... or there are ways to make the iPhone look like the WP7
TIGGAH said:
So I showed my phone off to a friend and she loved it. She was a Blackberry user and loved how fluid my phone is and it's feature set. For the record I have a Samsung Focus.
She came to me today with her brand new phone "just like mine" and was wondering how to make the screen look like mine does. I looked at her phone and she bought an iPhone 4...
/sigh
She thought for sure my phone had to be an iPhone because who else is there?
I wonder if this lack of knowledge will be the doom of WP7...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
*Facepalm*
Did you tell her to take it back?
Yeah, I suggested she bring it back.
I think her reality matrix is blown right now though. How could a non-Apple product be so much better?! The commercials say that's not right!?
Everyone who looks at my phone asks me if it is a iPhone. Like mentioned before they only seem to know about Blackberry and Apple. Unless they are of a younger age they usually are not familiar with Android products either.
I was in a Panda Express watching a baseball game on my phone through Slingplayer. A woman commented on how awesome that app was and how its so neat what you can do on iPhones these days.
*sigh*
TIGGAH said:
So I showed my phone off to a friend and she loved it. She was a Blackberry user and loved how fluid my phone is and it's feature set. For the record I have a Samsung Focus.
She came to me today with her brand new phone "just like mine" and was wondering how to make the screen look like mine does. I looked at her phone and she bought an iPhone 4...
/sigh
She thought for sure my phone had to be an iPhone because who else is there?
I wonder if this lack of knowledge will be the doom of WP7...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BB users are desperate for anything other than a BB these days, Lol.
BTW (not to the person I quoted, someone else after him) it's not cool to generalize an entire class of people as idiots just because they prefer another product.
And I'm still wondering why my post that said the above was deleted out of this thread...
I've lost count of the number of times someone has accused my HD7 of being a bloody iPhone.
I always take great pains to correct them and to point out the iPhone is merely a minority interest in the great pool of smartphones out there. Apple have less than 50% of the smartphone market, therefore if you see someone with a smartphone, the chances are it is NOT an iPhone.
Jim Coleman said:
I've lost count of the number of times someone has accused my HD7 of being a bloody iPhone.
I always take great pains to correct them and to point out the iPhone is merely a minority interest in the great pool of smartphones out there. Apple have less than 50% of the smartphone market, therefore if you see someone with a smartphone, the chances are it is NOT an iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
id loooooove to have that kind of minority interest in my product !!!
Minority riiight.
It's the best recognized smartphone product ever.
doministry said:
Minority riiight.
It's the best recognized smartphone product ever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What Jim said is accurate. The iPhone's marketshare is in the minority in the smartphone sales. But boy that is a surface analysis of the market.
The iPhone is the best selling smartphone in 2010. If someone was interested in walking around with multiple smartphones from the same maker then I would see the point of citing marketshare.
I could understand if you owned a Samsung Galaxy device and it be mistaken for an iPhone, but not an HTC. When you see the UI you would have to see the difference immediately.
This discussion is pointless anyway.
nicksti said:
What Jim said is accurate. The iPhone's marketshare is in the minority in the smartphone sales. But boy that is a surface analysis of the market.
The iPhone is the best selling smartphone in 2010. If someone was interested in walking around with multiple smartphones from the same maker then I would see the point of citing marketshare.
I could understand if you owned a Samsung Galaxy device and it be mistaken for an iPhone, but not an HTC. When you see the UI you would have to see the difference immediately.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its the best selling smartphone but its in the minority? That made no sense at all.
http://www.tipb.com/2011/05/06/appl...eed:+TheIphoneBlog+(TiPb:+iPhone,+iPad,+iPod)
Today june 10 i walk into a Orange shop in the UK to ask a question as i was having some network issue and wanted to know if it was from the carrier side of things But when i got in the shop i got distracted because there was a couple there to upgrade a phone ( the wife was ) you know they were speaking loud so me been nosey started tolisten keenly
Well the husband was saying to his wife get the Lg e900 which is a Windows Phone and the salesman was saying to get a HTC Wildfire S well this lady explain and said i want it for basic internet browsing,facebook app and a few other things and so on.
The lady herself really like the Lg e900 but didnt wanna chose it ONLY because she trusted the salesman knowledge over her husbands ( which was obviously the wrong thing to do ) so he the husband kept saying i know my wife for 18 years and i know what she'll like this is a guy that doesnt own a WP7 himself but obviously done his research unlike the salesperson. But he got so fed up of telling his wife so he said (you know what honey get HTC just know that i will not be coming to return it with you.
Like i said this woman liked the Lg WP7 over the HTC Android but because the Orange guy kept saying get the Htc she was a little convinced, so I (just a random guy in the shop) walked over and handed her my own LG e900 and said heres a live model give it a go then decide for yourself, she loved the tiles she like zune i explained it was a simple to use phone and never have to worry update the software been upto date showed her facebook and so on. Right there and then the lady was convinced her husband was smiling all the way through because he knew his wife was confused.
And yes she walk out the store with LG Wp7 maybe my phone broke so i could help someone else out. Microsoft really need to step into these retail stores if they're going to sell Windows Phone because the salesteam dont have a clue and are not promoting the platform. The guy did not have a clue about windows phone he ask me if it was easy to use just imaging that. If i wasnt there at that time the woman would have gone home not even knowing how to set up a email on her Wildfire becuase of confusing UI on the phone... i dont know what to think
I agree its pretty bad. I would think MS has gotten wind of this, but if not, they are going to get it now with all the blogs running stories on it (like the PCMag article). Not only do they typically not have a clue the difference between WM & WP, they are almost always hellbent on selling iPhone or Android, and have plenty of misinformation on the wp7 as a whole.
Its very easy to sway the typical consumer as they will not have much knowledge on platforms, and need to rely on the sales reps to guide them. This is not helping wp7.
Now now. Android, u see is a mature platform which doesn't have a confusing ui. What's confusing? A 5 page homescreen where u can put some Widgets to dress up? Then press a button at the bottom and access your apps in alphabetical order? I think that is a much cleaner ui. And no offence but wp7 has no 3d games which can entertain u for countless hours when ur stuck somewhere. So no disrespect to another os. And btw, when u first start a android phone it takes u thru a setup guide including logging in to ur gmail.
Sent from my LG-P999 using XDA App
Exactly this poor woman didn't have a clue, her husband said she all liked the Omnia 7 but it was too big which tell me she was more interested in the wp7 she just wanted a phone that was easy to use for Facebook and social stuff.
The salesman had a Motorola Atrix which I'm guessing is a good android dualcore phone but a 600mhz Wildfire running android can't compare with wp7 at all. Its just bad. Funny enuff there were 2 wp7 sales guy there I'm guessing they didn't notice what was going on right under thier noses doe becus when I convince the lady they were the ones that showed her how to use the phone.
Sent from my LG-E900 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
There was an article just yesterday about that: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2386647,00.asp
Microsoft certainly knows the issue but I think they're waiting for Mango and Nokia to be ready to make a proper push. Alos they need to make Apple like TV adverts to show people how easy it is to use instead of the generic spots they're running at the moment. That way people would walk into the shop knowing what they want and won't be dependent on salesmen. Mind you I had a similar experience with Android... My girlfriend was due an upgrade (from a Blackberry) so I advised her to go for a Nexus S to get stock Android, good battery life, Gingerbread and all future updates fast. I have a Windows Phone myself but knowing her she would be frustrated by the lack of apps (most of what she uses isn't on WP7 yet) and broken notifications/tiles.
The guy fought her on the choice, saying the Nexus S was the worst Android phone . He wanted her to go for a Galaxy S 2 because of the huge screen and dual-core processor. I mean, come man you're talking to a woman who will mostly use the phone for basic purposes so
a) 4.3" is way too big a screen and
b) what's dual-core to her? She couldn't care less, she's not a geek.
Salesmen are usually useless and don't know what they're talking about.
The woman didn't care about 3d games or what os is more mature. She actaully used my phone with her own hands and knew exactly what she was getting. Fair enough if she prefered the android phone but I believe the salesman was trying to sell her one strictly because he used one and didn't have a clue about the other os. I'm quite sure the wildfire does not use the latest version of android and only god knows when she would of got it and how troublesome it would have been for her. I ain't disrespecting another Os just talking from experience
jamreal said:
The woman didn't care about 3d games or what os is more mature. She actaully used my phone with her own hands and knew exactly what she was getting. Fair enough if she prefered the android phone but I believe the salesman was trying to sell her one strictly because he used one and didn't have a clue about the other os. I'm quite sure the wildfire does not use the latest version of android and only god knows when she would of got it and how troublesome it would have been for her. I ain't disrespecting another Os just talking from experience
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't see why the salesman would only promote android. I mean he must have had a go with a phone from all sorts of OS's. Oh well, im happy she is happy
webstar1 said:
And btw, when u first start a android phone it takes u thru a setup guide including logging in to ur gmail.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And WP7 doesn't?
(it does)
webstar1 said:
Now now. Android, u see is a mature platform which doesn't have a confusing ui. What's confusing? A 5 page homescreen where u can put some Widgets to dress up? Then press a button at the bottom and access your apps in alphabetical order? I think that is a much cleaner ui. And no offence but wp7 has no 3d games which can entertain u for countless hours when ur stuck somewhere. So no disrespect to another os. And btw, when u first start a android phone it takes u thru a setup guide including logging in to ur gmail.
Sent from my LG-P999 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For gadget geeks like us, Android isn't confusing. It's actually the easiest system of them all for all-around usefulness. But for ordinary everyday users, yes, Android can be quite confusing compared to the utter simplicity of WP7. You can't get more simplistic than WP7 and that is what the ordinary user will desire. WP7 has 2 screens. One screen is where the apps are. The other screen is the live tiles of the chosen apps. There is no confusion of how to add widgets on a screen or find specific features to enable. The ordinary user will most assuredly be confused by Android at first. But if they did stick with it and put a little time into knowing it, it will become utterly simple to them. The out-of-the-box simplicity, though, goes to WP7. There is really no learning at all. They just tap the tile of the app they want to use and off they go.
The ordinary user can also simply go into the app drawer of Android and tap an icon of any app they want to use, but the customizing features in Android cause them to be confused about how they need to use Android....do they add the widget to a screen to make it work properly or do the enable some menu setting to make it work properly. Maybe they feel they aren't getting the most out of the apps they want to use because they don't understand Android completely right out of the box.
As I said, for us, Android is a no-brainer. But we are acutely familiar with it. The ordinary customer who wants a system to be familiar right from the box will find WP7 fits the need. And the quality and smoothness of WP7 will sell them immediately. Then when they have used it for a while, they will start seeing how reliable it is and be quite content with it in its utter simplicity.
They probably get better commission if you take an android phone. Simple.
Especially a cheap low end device like a wildfire.
It's not like a salesman actually gives a crap about what's right for the customer, once your out of that door it's not his problem anymore.
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....
I said this on a different forum, and I believe it is relevant in this thread.
MS does a good job of having their reps go around to stores like Office Depot, Best Buy, etc to inform reps about their products, give them free stuff, and in general make the sales reps have positive things to think about MS. They need to do this in the mobile channel, otherwise this is going to be a even harder uphill battle for them. They can advertise all they want, but getting on the good side of sales reps is where it is going to help them a ton.
conantroutman said:
They probably get better commission if you take an android phone. Simple.
Especially a cheap low end device like a wildfire.
It's not like a salesman actually gives a crap about what's right for the customer, once your out of that door it's not his problem anymore.
Sent From My Fingers To Your Face.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, walked into a Verizon store about a week and a half ago and asked if they had the Trophy in yet as it was rumored to be in some stores. The rep immediately asked me why I wanted a WP7. Then tried to sell me an android. I left. BUt, afterwards I got to thinking, and went back to the store.
I asked him if they received a larger commission on android phones and he said, no. So, I asked why he was so intent on pushing android over WP7. He claimed that wp7 was only good for business purposes but not for everyday use, "social stuff" and games. It was obvious that he was confusing it with WM. He also had an android.
I showed him my DVP and some games and "social stuff". Told him about the finer points of WP7 and that it wasn't WM. He had to admit it was cool. Told him when the Trophy came in, play around with it and learn about it.
Otherwise, this was a typical in-store scenario.
Wyn6 said:
Actually, walked into a Verizon store about a week and a half ago and asked if they had the Trophy in yet as it was rumored to be in some stores. The rep immediately asked me why I wanted a WP7. Then tried to sell me an android. I left. BUt, afterwards I got to thinking, and went back to the store.
I asked him if they received a larger commission on android phones and he said, no. So, I asked why he was so intent on pushing android over WP7. He claimed that wp7 was only good for business purposes but not for everyday use, "social stuff" and games. It was obvious that he was confusing it with WM. He also had an android.
I showed him my DVP and some games and "social stuff". Told him about the finer points of WP7 and that it wasn't WM. He had to admit it was cool. Told him when the Trophy came in, play around with it and learn about it.
Otherwise, this was a typical in-store scenario.
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Absolutely the same experience I get everywhere. Why do you want windows phone? Why not get android?
It gets to the point to where I say either you give me what I want or I leave this store you don't get comission, and I demand users don't give the store patronage...
Then I get what I want =)
That brings back the question... Is the Windows name hurting WP7? Reading your post it seems it does.
Wyn6 said:
Actually, walked into a Verizon store about a week and a half ago and asked if they had the Trophy in yet as it was rumored to be in some stores. The rep immediately asked me why I wanted a WP7. Then tried to sell me an android. I left. BUt, afterwards I got to thinking, and went back to the store.
I asked him if they received a larger commission on android phones and he said, no. So, I asked why he was so intent on pushing android over WP7. He claimed that wp7 was only good for business purposes but not for everyday use, "social stuff" and games. It was obvious that he was confusing it with WM. He also had an android.
I showed him my DVP and some games and "social stuff". Told him about the finer points of WP7 and that it wasn't WM. He had to admit it was cool. Told him when the Trophy came in, play around with it and learn about it.
Otherwise, this was a typical in-store scenario.
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Click to collapse
Sent from my Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Peew971 said:
That brings back the question... Is the Windows name hurting WP7? Reading your post it seems it does.
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I'd say the Windows name definitely gives people a slightly negative first reaction, but I think that will subside over time as people see the quality of product MS is releasing as of late. I admit, I didn't give wp7 the time of day when I first saw it. I thought the tiles were ridiculous. Boy was I wrong. But a few months after its release I started looking at it more and tried it, it took about 5 minutes to fall in love with its modern UI, and see where MS was headed.
The media being 90% pro apple doesn't help them any either. Its amazing how much coverage of Apple goes on, and how little goes on about MS. And the tone of the coverage is much different for the respective companies as well. But I do think respect for MS is steadily growing as of late, and people will not be able to ignore the quality of their products for very long.
dtboos said:
I'd say the Windows name definitely gives people a slightly negative first reaction, but I think that will subside over time as people see the quality of product MS is releasing as of late. I admit, I didn't give wp7 the time of day when I first saw it. I thought the tiles were ridiculous. Boy was I wrong. But a few months after its release I started looking at it more and tried it, it took about 5 minutes to fall in love with its modern UI, and see where MS was headed.
The media being 90% pro apple doesn't help them any either. Its amazing how much coverage of Apple goes on, and how little goes on about MS. And the tone of the coverage is much different for the respective companies as well. But I do think respect for MS is steadily growing as of late, and people will not be able to ignore the quality of their products for very long.
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it's not really the windows name
it's the opinion csr's indicate to people about windows
I still think it's all down to advertising, people need to see what the WP7 experience is about on their TV. Apple gets criticism for the adverts they put out but that's what talks to people. Sure every iPhone feature exists on other phones but they've never been advertised so simply as to make someone think "I wish I had that". This is what Microsoft needs to do once Mango is out to make people wish they had a WP7 even before stepping into a shop.
Sent from my Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Peew971 said:
I still think it's all down to advertising, people need to see what the WP7 experience is about on their TV. Apple gets criticism for the adverts they put out but that's what talks to people. Sure every iPhone feature exists on other phones but they've never been advertised so simply as to make someone think "I wish I had that". This is what Microsoft needs to do once Mango is out to make people wish they had a WP7 even before stepping into a shop.
Sent from my Omnia 7 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
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+1 on that. I rarely see advertisments for WP7 over here in Germany. And the few I see point out features Android and iOS is already famous for. From my point of view what they need to let people know is what makes WP7 unique. First of all the UI, but not to forget about how deeply features are integrated into the system in comparison to other mobile OSes. And of course the ease of use even for people who are not as much of a geek as most of us here at XDA are. Which is still the majority of smartphone users.
jamreal said:
Today june 10 i walk into a Orange shop in the UK to ask a question as i was having some network issue and wanted to know if it was from the carrier side of things But when i got in the shop i got distracted because there was a couple there to upgrade a phone ( the wife was ) you know they were speaking loud so me been nosey started tolisten keenly
Well the husband was saying to his wife get the Lg e900 which is a Windows Phone and the salesman was saying to get a HTC Wildfire S well this lady explain and said i want it for basic internet browsing,facebook app and a few other things and so on.
The lady herself really like the Lg e900 but didnt wanna chose it ONLY because she trusted the salesman knowledge over her husbands ( which was obviously the wrong thing to do ) so he the husband kept saying i know my wife for 18 years and i know what she'll like this is a guy that doesnt own a WP7 himself but obviously done his research unlike the salesperson. But he got so fed up of telling his wife so he said (you know what honey get HTC just know that i will not be coming to return it with you.
Like i said this woman liked the Lg WP7 over the HTC Android but because the Orange guy kept saying get the Htc she was a little convinced, so I (just a random guy in the shop) walked over and handed her my own LG e900 and said heres a live model give it a go then decide for yourself, she loved the tiles she like zune i explained it was a simple to use phone and never have to worry update the software been upto date showed her facebook and so on. Right there and then the lady was convinced her husband was smiling all the way through because he knew his wife was confused.
And yes she walk out the store with LG Wp7 maybe my phone broke so i could help someone else out. Microsoft really need to step into these retail stores if they're going to sell Windows Phone because the salesteam dont have a clue and are not promoting the platform. The guy did not have a clue about windows phone he ask me if it was easy to use just imaging that. If i wasnt there at that time the woman would have gone home not even knowing how to set up a email on her Wildfire becuase of confusing UI on the phone... i dont know what to think
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email is fairly simple on any platform now. username, password, sync options, done.
i hear ya being an evangalist for your chosen platform. nothing like helping a person out.
this past week, i paid attention around the hotel (vacation @ the beach) and noticed one wp7 being used by the pool. everything, and i mean everything (the maids too) was android. i'd count 8 android devices for every 2 iphones. really surprised at the ratio myself.
sooooo, the one wp7 device was a teenage/twentysomething girl @ the pool, and her friends are all "Hey what is that ?" i'm assuming they didn't recognize the UI. she showed them, and they were impressed with the "swooshies" of the UI. there was a bar, so i'm assuming anything that looks neat to a 20 something crowd is 'swooshie' after a few drinks.
a couple of minutes into her impromptu demo, they said, who made it ? she answered samsung... and they asked again, "No, i mean like is that a new android, cause it's not my iphone!"
when she replied "it's a windows phone, my dad develops or something"
immediately there was no interest. none. back to texting, fb'ing, whatever 20somethings do poolside on handsets.
keep in mind i'm watching my kids play (not drown) and there's music, beach, a fire pit, etc so plenty to distract me. the level of crickets chirping silence after declaring it was 'windows' was astonishing.
ignorance ? yep. bliss ? yep.
i did notice two other wp7 devices while i was logging WAP's from the room though. lets assume the wp7 users were very techy, and trying to hack the crap ATT wireless access points, cause otherwise their connections were not secured.
my age group is a bunch of idiots. Time and time again, we don't know anything...the above example proves that