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Importing phones is obviously possible now because tons of carriers all over the world share AT&T's GSM and UMTS/HSPA bands.
When LTE starts to become the dominant source for cell-phone signals (especially when Voice-over-LTE appears), will AT&T still share bands with the rest of the world like it does now?
In other words, will AT&T still have the advantage over Vzw and T-Mobile that early adopters of phones will be able to import them and use them months before they show up in the US? Or will the proliferation of LTE cause AT&T to suffer from the same problem from which Verizon suffers: You will ONLY be able to use phones designed specifically for the AT&T network?
I ask because right now I have AT&T and Verizon, and I have unlimited data on both. I'm going to be canceling one of them within the next week or so. Right now I actually prefer AT&T's service, and I love the fact that I can import phones that are not available in the US. But if the "importing phones" advantage of AT&T disappears, perhaps Verizon becomes the more desirable carrier for me.
You haven't read much about LTE, I guess. By conforming to the LTE standards, a multi-band LTE phone will be able to be as much of a "world phone" as a multi-band GSM phone. While there are some differences in frequency spectrums around the planet, there are many in common.
The allocated frequencies are 700 and 1700 MHz in North America; 800, 1800, 2600 MHz in Europe; 1800 and 2600 MHz in Asia; and 1800 MHz in Australia.
So, a quad-band LTE phone with frequencies of 700/1700/1800/2600 would get you coverage almost anywhere.
The end result is this: If the manufacturers want to make an LTE "world phone" just like they have in the past with GSM, they certainly can (within the laws of physics, if the antenna technologies will allow it). The same economics apply for the manufacturers, and possibly better - since there are a smaller set of frequencies with greater chance of coverage - and a greater market potential for a single design.
I suspect that with modern fractal antenna technology, this won't be a huge issue.
In North America, are the 700 and 1700 different carriers, or is it better for a phone to support both like the current att 850/1900?
¿GotJazz? said:
You haven't read much about LTE, I guess. By conforming to the LTE standards, a multi-band LTE phone will be able to be as much of a "world phone" as a multi-band GSM phone. While there are some differences in frequency spectrums around the planet, there are many in common.
The allocated frequencies are 700 and 1700 MHz in North America; 800, 1800, 2600 MHz in Europe; 1800 and 2600 MHz in Asia; and 1800 MHz in Australia.
So, a quad-band LTE phone with frequencies of 700/1700/1800/2600 would get you coverage almost anywhere.
The end result is this: If the manufacturers want to make an LTE "world phone" just like they have in the past with GSM, they certainly can (within the laws of physics, if the antenna technologies will allow it). The same economics apply for the manufacturers, and possibly better - since there are a smaller set of frequencies with greater chance of coverage - and a greater market potential for a single design.
I suspect that with modern fractal antenna technology, this won't be a huge issue.
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Thanks. That was actually pretty helpful. But for instance, it is my understanding that AT&T runs in the low-700s, and Vzw runs in the high-700s. And Vzw has tentatively stated that its LTE phones will not be compatible with AT&T's. So I guess when you say they could make a multi-band LTE phone, it would need to cover "all of" 700 MHz for it to have both AT&T and Vzw compatibility.
In any event, does this favor AT&T or Vzw for future phones? My guess would be for at least the next several years, if not decade or more, all LTE phones will have 3G radios in them as well. And those 3G radios, just like today, are going to be GSM. So I guess you could start seeing phones world phones that are both quad-band GSM and quad-band LTE, and theoretically these would work on AT&T, but not Vzw.
Am I on the right path here? Do you agree that it seems likely at least until GSM/3G completely die (if ever), most/all LTE phones will continue to have 3G radios, and this would suggest that if anything, importing international phones will still be possible on AT&T but not Vzw?
chrikenn said:
Thanks. That was actually pretty helpful. But for instance, it is my understanding that AT&T runs in the low-700s, and Vzw runs in the high-700s. And Vzw has tentatively stated that its LTE phones will not be compatible with AT&T's. So I guess when you say they could make a multi-band LTE phone, it would need to cover "all of" 700 MHz for it to have both AT&T and Vzw compatibility.
In any event, does this favor AT&T or Vzw for future phones? My guess would be for at least the next several years, if not decade or more, all LTE phones will have 3G radios in them as well. And those 3G radios, just like today, are going to be GSM. So I guess you could start seeing phones world phones that are both quad-band GSM and quad-band LTE, and theoretically these would work on AT&T, but not Vzw.
Am I on the right path here? Do you agree that it seems likely at least until GSM/3G completely die (if ever), most/all LTE phones will continue to have 3G radios, and this would suggest that if anything, importing international phones will still be possible on AT&T but not Vzw?
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Almost every LTE deployment other than VZW runs alongside an existing 3GPP (GSM) network and most all chipsets will natively support the combination. Therefore, I doubt you will see many devices without the UMTS radios. No one is turning their 3G networks off any time soon. Verizon will be one of very few sources for LTE devices WITHOUT any other GSM radios.
As for LTE frequencies, there are A LOT of them. What chipsets will support which radio combinations is still a subject of much debate. Don't expect full interop out of the box.
You can always import regardless
the only risk you face is all the different LTE radio bands that you might or might not get with certain phones
chrikenn said:
Importing phones is obviously possible now because tons of carriers all over the world share AT&T's GSM and UMTS/HSPA bands.
When LTE starts to become the dominant source for cell-phone signals (especially when Voice-over-LTE appears), will AT&T still share bands with the rest of the world like it does now?
In other words, will AT&T still have the advantage over Vzw and T-Mobile that early adopters of phones will be able to import them and use them months before they show up in the US? Or will the proliferation of LTE cause AT&T to suffer from the same problem from which Verizon suffers: You will ONLY be able to use phones designed specifically for the AT&T network?
I ask because right now I have AT&T and Verizon, and I have unlimited data on both. I'm going to be canceling one of them within the next week or so. Right now I actually prefer AT&T's service, and I love the fact that I can import phones that are not available in the US. But if the "importing phones" advantage of AT&T disappears, perhaps Verizon becomes the more desirable carrier for me.
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Does the Galaxy Nexus LTE version also support the Penta-Band GSM bands for international travel?
Verizon version = GSM + LTE?
Sorry I'm a noob at Verizon's ways.
player911 said:
Does the Galaxy Nexus LTE version also support the Penta-Band GSM bands for international travel?
Verizon version = GSM + LTE?
Sorry I'm a noob at Verizon's ways.
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Don't think so. Verizon version = CDMA + LTE. So it will only work in the US, on Verizon.
chrikenn said:
Don't think so. Verizon version = CDMA + LTE. So it will only work in the US, on Verizon.
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I always thought that Verizon always had bands for international travel also? I mean not really a big deal. Verizon is the clear winner for coverage nationally and since my work is paying for it, its even sweeter.
Right now I just have a blackberry
player911 said:
I always thought that Verizon always had bands for international travel also? I mean not really a big deal. Verizon is the clear winner for coverage nationally and since my work is paying for it, its even sweeter.
Right now I just have a blackberry
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It's possible that the Verizon version has GSM/UMTS radios, it's also possible that it has those but are disabled somehow. We really don't know all that much about the LTE version of this phone, we don't even know the exact dimensions of it and what battery it comes with. So we'll just have to wait until it passes through the FCC or is released.
Chirality said:
It's possible that the Verizon version has GSM/UMTS radios, it's also possible that it has those but are disabled somehow. We really don't know all that much about the LTE version of this phone, we don't even know the exact dimensions of it and what battery it comes with. So we'll just have to wait until it passes through the FCC or is released.
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Click to collapse
+1 for storming Google HQ
G2x - 2.3.7 CM7
Transformer - 3.2 Revolver OC/UV
Chirality said:
It's possible that the Verizon version has GSM/UMTS radios, it's also possible that it has those but are disabled somehow. We really don't know all that much about the LTE version of this phone, we don't even know the exact dimensions of it and what battery it comes with. So we'll just have to wait until it passes through the FCC or is released.
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Click to collapse
I do recall seeing a negatory on the world phone status in Verizon's inventory system. And I suppose there is still the option for dormant or disabled radios but I ain't holding my breath.
Do all the GNote 2 variants have the same hardware? (Int'l, US ATT US TMobile).
Not concerned about LTE, but HSPA -
Can a different radio be flashed to enable HSPA on the AWS bands (like the 1st GNote ) -
I'm going to Europe and and may bring back a GNote 2.
Is it still too early to know the answer to this (since the TMo USA GN2 has not dropped yet)?
Thanks all !!!
McNoob said:
Do all the GNote 2 variants have the same hardware? (Int'l, US ATT US TMobile).
Not concerned about LTE, but HSPA -
Can a different radio be flashed to enable HSPA on the AWS bands (like the 1st GNote ) -
I'm going to Europe and and may bring back a GNote 2.
Is it still too early to know the answer to this (since the TMo USA GN2 has not dropped yet)?
Thanks all !!!
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No, an international Note will not be able to get AWS bands. The AT&T one...possibly. The Inernational will not contain the 1700 band. When the AT&T note was released, they produced them with the 1700 radio anticipating a release on T-mobile, which was why the radio enabling the 1700 band could be flashed. If they mass produce the US versions again, then it should be possible. The T-mobile variant will be pentaband no matter what, since they are starting to use the 1900 band that AT&T uses for HSPA+. Actually, now that I think about it, they will probably be produced seperately because the AT&T version will include LTE, and T-mobile will not...so...nope.
I appreciate the quick response, thank you!
Now, GNote 1 had different chipsets for the Int'l and NAmerican variants (Exynos vs. Qualcomm) - I've been reading that the GNote 2 has Exynos on all its variants, which I haven't been able to verify -
I also read about TMo moving its HSPA to the 1900 Band, which would make the GNote2 compatible...remains to be seen how reliable HSPA service will be on that band (although I must admit, HSPA AWS has been pretty darn good for me in Southern California).
Thanks again, lowandbehold.
McNoob said:
I appreciate the quick response, thank you!
Now, GNote 1 had different chipsets for the Int'l and NAmerican variants (Exynos vs. Qualcomm) - I've been reading that the GNote 2 has Exynos on all its variants, which I haven't been able to verify -
I also read about TMo moving its HSPA to the 1900 Band, which would make the GNote2 compatible...remains to be seen how reliable HSPA service will be on that band (although I must admit, HSPA AWS has been pretty darn good for me in Southern California).
Thanks again, lowandbehold.
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The chipsets are exactly the same. The 1900 band will go into affect next year. They are still using the 1700 band.
I am really confused by all the info I am reading about the 4G capabilities. It would seem that some Note II's do not ship with it, or am I wrong and reading the articles? Does this phone have 4G on Sprints network?
So assuming that it does have 4G, I don't see any reason not to get this phone. Can anyone tell me why I shouldn't get it?
SightUp said:
I am really confused by all the info I am reading about the 4G capabilities. It would seem that some Note II's do not ship with it, or am I wrong and reading the articles? Does this phone have 4G on Sprints network?
So assuming that it does have 4G, I don't see any reason not to get this phone. Can anyone tell me why I shouldn't get it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The International Note II (model GT-N7100) does not ship with 4G (LTE). There are European regional variants that currently ship with LTE radios, but they might not be frequency compatible with your carrier so you are taking a risk by ordering one of the LTE versions currently on the market.
You will see some carriers advertise their networks as 4G, when what they are actually referencing is HSPA+, which is a high-speed version of 3G service capable of 21Mbps download on the Note II. When I ordered my Note II I decided that the compromise of not getting LTE but having the true International phone, which tends to have more 3rd party developer (read: XDA-Developers) support for firmware updates, etc. was worth it. I'm happy with HSPA+ for this generation of phone.
With all this said, Sprint is also a CDMA network rather than GSM, which means the GT-N7100 is not going to be the phone you need if you want to use it with Sprint. It will work with AT&T and many other GSM regional providers (I'm using mine on the GCI network in Alaska) but you will not have true 4G/LTE. For Sprint, you are probably best waiting for them to release their official version.
r.andom said:
The International Note II (model GT-N7100) does not ship with 4G (LTE). There are European regional variants that currently ship with LTE radios, but they might not be frequency compatible with your carrier so you are taking a risk by ordering one of the LTE versions currently on the market.
You will see some carriers advertise their networks as 4G, when what they are actually referencing is HSPA+, which is a high-speed version of 3G service capable of 21Mbps download on the Note II. When I ordered my Note II I decided that the compromise of not getting LTE but having the true International phone, which tends to have more 3rd party developer (read: XDA-Developers) support for firmware updates, etc. was worth it. I'm happy with HSPA+ for this generation of phone.
With all this said, Sprint is also a CDMA network rather than GSM, which means the GT-N7100 is not going to be the phone you need if you want to use it with Sprint. It will work with AT&T and many other GSM regional providers (I'm using mine on the GCI network in Alaska) but you will not have true 4G/LTE. For Sprint, you are probably best waiting for them to release their official version.
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So in other words, just wait until the 26th and pick one up at the local store?
Yep.
I'm VERY concerned about buying this phone now. T-Mobile have only listed LTE bands 4 & 17 on their site.
International
Quad Band GSM; LTE: 4, 17; UMTS: Band I (2100), Band II (1900), Band IV (1700/2100), Band V (850)
What in the eff?
Des just answererd this question on Twitter: https://twitter.com/askdes/status/581568102015569920
It has:
GSM - 850/900/1800/1900
UMTS - B1/B2/B4/B5
LTE - B2/B4/B12/B17 with CA + B3/B7 roaming
This is the perfect T-Mobile phone.
So the T-Mobile version does not have 1700, and is therefore identical to the other models? Do we know if it includes wifi-calling, or if we would be able to flash the T-Mobile ROM onto the unlocked dev version?
malakai1911 said:
Des just answererd this question on Twitter: https://twitter.com/askdes/status/581568102015569920
It has:
GSM - 850/900/1800/1900
UMTS - B1/B2/B4/B5
LTE - B2/B4/B12/B17 with CA + B3/B7 roaming
This is the perfect T-Mobile phone.
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Click to collapse
But doesn't the AT&T, Unlocked, or Dev model include all of those bands and then some?
pongalong said:
So the T-Mobile version does not have 1700, and is therefore identical to the other models? Do we know if it includes wifi-calling, or if we would be able to flash the T-Mobile ROM onto the unlocked dev version?
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Click to collapse
It does have 1700! That's Band 4, and for both LTE and HSPA.
The T-Mobile version also supports WiFi calling and texting. I have no idea if the T-Mobile firmware can be flashed to the unlocked version, but I don't see why it wouldn't be feasible.
ohiosux said:
But doesn't the AT&T, Unlocked, or Dev model include all of those bands and then some?
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T-Mobile (Des) confirmed: 2, 3, 4, 7, 12, and 17
AT&T lists: 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, 12, 17, and 29 (adds +5 and +29)
HTC Dev & Unlocked versions (per HTC on Twitter): 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, 12, 13, 17, 29, 30 (adds +5, +13, +29, +30)
Maybe the T-Mo phone supports more that could be unlocked, who knows. The extra bands aren't useful to me.
Sorry, but I just want to clarify.
Do all versions of this phone support BAND IV UMTS or not?
ohiosux said:
But doesn't the AT&T, Unlocked, or Dev model include all of those bands and then some?
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Click to collapse
HTC has done this on the past couple of phones. Only the T-Mobile phone will do their specific bands (HSPA+). On past models I don't recall anyone getting the ATT/DEV models to work with those T-Mobile bands. I don't believe we ever found out why. Some speculated it was due to cost to license all the bands, or that it is actually different hardware. The M7 and M8 were both like that.
If you are on T-Mobile, I'd get the model specifically for them.
stevedebi said:
HTC has done this on the past couple of phones. Only the T-Mobile phone will do their specific bands (HSPA+). On past models I don't recall anyone getting the ATT/DEV models to work with those T-Mobile bands. I don't believe we ever found out why. Some speculated it was due to cost to license all the bands, or that it is actually different hardware. The M7 and M8 were both like that.
If you are on T-Mobile, I'd get the model specifically for them.
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Click to collapse
Oh yeah I remember my Dev version being like that. Fortunately, I live in an area that has been upgraded to mostly lte. This was actually beneficial for me and maybe others in the same situation because it actually saves battery life when the phone isn't constantly switching between edge, 3g/+, and lte. I'm sure many others have been in an area that's barely out of lte but still within h+ range and it's still slow as edge or even slower.
Teo032 said:
Oh yeah I remember my Dev version being like that. Fortunately, I live in an area that has been upgraded to mostly lte. This was actually beneficial for me and maybe others in the same situation because it actually saves battery life when the phone isn't constantly switching between edge, 3g/+, and lte. I'm sure many others have been in an area that's barely out of lte but still within h+ range and it's still slow as edge or even slower.
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Click to collapse
Yes, it is OK if you live in a major area that has lots of LTE. Here just north of LA, I get into the other bands pretty frequently.
I am not sure this was answered? Do all versions of the HTC one m 9 support band 4 UMTS? Many ATT carrier unlocked models are for sale and no one seems to know if they will pick up the UMTS 1700 band 4 on T- Mo?
maddie01 said:
I am not sure this was answered? Do all versions of the HTC one m 9 support band 4 UMTS? Many ATT carrier unlocked models are for sale and no one seems to know if they will pick up the UMTS 1700 band 4 on T- Mo?
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Click to collapse
The AT&T M9 I bought does.
maddie01 said:
I am not sure this was answered? Do all versions of the HTC one m 9 support band 4 UMTS? Many ATT carrier unlocked models are for sale and no one seems to know if they will pick up the UMTS 1700 band 4 on T- Mo?
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Click to collapse
They will not pick up the T-Mobile specific bands, which use 1900/2100 for 41bps speed. They will work with the T-Mobile LTE band.
Wow, still a mystery. I have the AT&T SIM Unlocked One M9 and I have a TMobile prepaid SIM and get Edge, 3G, 4G, LTE Band 2,4,12...I cannot find an app that shows the actual WCDMA (4G) Bands ? But, it notates 42 MBPS when it says HSPA+ 4G using Network Signal Info-Pro App..and also shows 384 Kbps when it says 3G....
So, seems Des is correct unless the Network Signal Info Pro app is wrong?
I turned off everything except WCDMA, and this is what I get being reported by LTE Discovery. HSPA+ @ -113. I have a ATT unlocked M9. I do have the T-Mobile 2.11.531.19 firmware installed as well as the T-Mobile rom.
Using XDA to unleash the power of Android on my HTC One M9
Thanks but as I mentioned I cannot find an App that shows the WCDMA Bands to confirm. As you can see even LTE Discovery says N/A for DL and UL Freq...when on WCDMA...
The only App I can see that helps is Network Signal Info Pro...and unfortunately it is limited and shows me the below in my market;
HSPA+ 42.2 MBPS
HSDPA 7.2 MBPS
UMTS 386 KBPS
But, does not indicate which Band or Frequency ?
Anyone know of an App or Command that will show WCDMA Bands???
Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
I was looking at purchasing a Verizon version of the LG G4. It appears it supports all the bands of AT&T, except for Band 17.
Can anyone confirm that it does not in fact support Band 17? Will this impact AT&T service or coverage?
Probably depends on which bands ATT uses in your area in particular.
Being that band 17 is AT&T's primary 4g LTE band I'm going to say, no, it will not work "reliably"