Related
With the addition of a gyroscope (see 1:25 in the video) and the 960 x 640 screen to the iPhone 4, certainly WP7 developers will try to one-up or match Apple on these features. This makes me wonder if we'll end up with a Windows Phone 7 market with tons of different hardware features and form-factors (an achilles heel for the dead Windows Mobile market) that would create a hell for developers. Or, will WP7 be perpetually one step behind Apple in these regards?
wp7 has a gyroscope. a gyroscope isnt a matter of hardware as much as it is programming. obv it requires hardware though dont get me wrong.
pretty much its like this....wp7 releases in october. they arent going to be bested by whats released in june. if you found out about this recently, imagine how long ago windows found out about it.
davidstre said:
wp7 has a gyroscope. a gyroscope isnt a matter of hardware as much as it is programming. obv it requires hardware though dont get me wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but I think only the iPhone 4 has the gyroscope so far. Not to be confused with accelerometer (which both devices have). Check out the video link in the OP.
I understand that manufacturers will try to compete. But the problem is, is you don't want to have so many different hardware capabilities between WP7 phones as soon as they are released. It will just fragment the market and make the software suck. For example, find good accelerometer support on windows mobile or an app that takes GOOD advantage of WVGA screens.
WP7 devices aren't supposed to have gyroscopes, only accelerometers ("g-sensors"). And yes, these are hardware components.
WhyBe said:
But the problem is, is you don't want to have so many different hardware capabilities on WP7 as soon as it is released. It will just fragment the market and make the software suck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, adding gyroscope will fragment the appstore as well, won't it?
vangrieg said:
Well, adding gyroscope will fragment the appstore as well, won't it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thus the point of my thread. If WP7 doesn't hit the market with these features, it will be perpetually behind Apple. If it DOES have these features upon RTM, they haven't been announced yet and it flies in the face of Microsofts already announced strict hardware standards. Either way it doesn't look good.
Gyroscope /= accelerometer.
Well, I'm not at all convinced that the gyroscope will add that much to the user experience in practice. And at least for a year or so developers will build apps that will work without one, so it'll play a marginal role. You can substitute pretty much everything a gyroscope does with a g-sensor and a compass, IMO.
vangrieg said:
Well, I'm not at all convinced that the gyroscope will add that much to the user experience in practice. And at least for a year or so developers will build apps that will work without one, so it'll play a marginal role. You can substitute pretty much everything a gyroscope does with a g-sensor and a compass, IMO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the iPhone 4 will get those apps a lot sooner than a year just because the hardware specs and phone upgrade path are so streamlined in that market.
Some creative people will come up with something, even if it's just a game.
Gyroscopes, I believe, add a level of precision and responsiveness that you don't get with accelerometers and compass alone.
I want MS to step their game up before RTM and not try to rationalize 2nd best. I expect nothing less than something sexy and amazing come end of year from MS and partners.
Well, I'm afraid it's not just up to MS, and it's too late for OEMs to change their designs, find suppliers etc. etc. I'm not even sure there is capacity to produce enough gyroscopes to satisfy Apple's demand and then some - we're talking about production growth to tens of millions from essentially zero.
I don't think a gyroscope will be a deal maker/breaker. If you are into game phone, you will notice a larger screen and X Box Live before wondering if it would be better with a gyroscope.
The Wii sold a lot but it never lived to its potential. There aren't that many Wii games that used the controllers better than Nintendo's Wii sports resort.
A gyroscope's usefullness is subjective. But I would prefer my phone to have it and it be widely supported by developers. Another losing point for the WP7 phones upon release will be the WVGA screen (compared to the iPhone 4 screen). Maybe many people won't know the difference, but as a photographer who uses his phone to show off pics, the higher the res of my phone the better.
My main point is, I don't want MS and partners to be perpetually one generation behind the competition. They need to be innovators on the software and hardware side.
I'm sure Samsung will implement their SuperAMOLED tech into WP7 devices. And S-AMOLED is pretty much the same as the retina display. The resolution is not the same but 800x480 on a 3.8 screen plus super vivid colors and sunlight readability is absoluetly on par with the iPhone 4. In fact Apple is playing catch-up here
You know, I've been thrilled after the Jobs-keynote. But as soon as my brain got sober from all the marketing blahblah I started to realize Apple didn't innovate that much with the iPhone4. Sure it is good but I am absolutely sure that HTC and Samsung can best this until october or so.
WhyBe said:
Another losing point for the WP7 phones upon release will be the WVGA screen (compared to the iPhone 4 screen). Maybe many people won't know the difference, but as a photographer who uses his phone to show off pics, the higher the res of my phone the better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm a photographer too and I think WVGA is quite good for the form factor.
Have you used OLED screens? They are great for photos and the resolution isn't even true WVGA.
The main thing I'm missing in WM6.5 is color management, or even just an icc profile for my phone which I can convert to manually.
As i came to know the size of the screen is the same on the iPhone 4, this means that the Pixels density is too high.
Notice that the eye cannot see anything smaller than 0.1mm and in the iPhone case it is 0.07 so the pixels cannot be seen by the naked eye. if the iPhone's screen was larger (maybe like the HD2) it would make more sense to include this high resolution.
Anyhow, choosing this resolution is a matter of technical implementation as the old one is 480x320 (new is 2*480x2*320) so this means that all they have to do to allow old iPhone apps to run full screen is to render the screen with 2 times hight and 2 times width (much easier and way better than the iPad).
Now regarding viewing photos! come on, you need a full HD TV to see a photo taken by a 2Mega Pixels camera.
CSMR said:
I'm a photographer too and I think WVGA is quite good for the form factor.
Have you used OLED screens? They are great for photos and the resolution isn't even true WVGA.
The main thing I'm missing in WM6.5 is color management, or even just an icc profile for my phone which I can convert to manually.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, my X1 and TP2 look pretty nice displaying the pics. Only time I've seen OLED in action they had animation videos running...no real people. I'll have to look into the color accuracy.
anaadoul said:
As i came to know the size of the screen is the same on the iPhone 4, this means that the Pixels density is too high.
Notice that the eye cannot see anything smaller than 0.1mm and in the iPhone case it is 0.07 so the pixels cannot be seen by the naked eye. if the iPhone's screen was larger (maybe like the HD2) it would make more sense to include this high resolution.
[...........]
Now regarding viewing photos! come on, you need a full HD TV to see a photo taken by a 2Mega Pixels camera.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The MP of the original photo is irrelevant (I shoot 14.2MP). The high PPI (of mobile screen) just gives you the ultimate sharpness. WVGA displaying of photos is quite nice, but I think the 960x640 should be that much better. I'm wondering what's the likely hood of seeing a 2x(800x480) anytime soon? Probably nil on mobile form-factors.
Has anyone found out the CPU speed of the new iPhone 4 ? EDIT: Never mind...
Microsoft just built this OS and Iphone has been around for years now. They will eventually get all the features packed in that you would expect to have it's just going to take sometime because they want to bring those features to you in a manner that is easy to use so they aren't going to just throw it in there and call it good. They released an article saying that it will probably take around 5 years to get every single feature that they have planned into the devices and working the way it should. They made something that looks great and although right now it lacks functionality of Windows 6.5 it;s way more polished and no one can deny that. If you want to maintain your backwards compatability get yourself a Windows Phone handheld edition when it comes out.
WhyBe said:
Yeah, my X1 and TP2 look pretty nice displaying the pics. Only time I've seen OLED in action they had animation videos running...no real people. I'll have to look into the color accuracy.
The MP of the original photo is irrelevant (I shoot 14.2MP). The high PPI (of mobile screen) just gives you the ultimate sharpness. WVGA displaying of photos is quite nice, but I think the 960x640 should be that much better. I'm wondering what's the likely hood of seeing a 2x(800x480) anytime soon? Probably nil on mobile form-factors.
Has anyone found out the CPU speed of the new iPhone 4 ? EDIT: Never mind...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hell there aren't even many 17" monitors that have more then a 1600x960 display so I doubt it will happen on a mobile but they do have support for HVGA which means that by scaling that 2x they can get there 960x640 and match what Apple has to offer and I bet the resolution would look so much better on a 4.3" device. I don't even know how people use a 3.5" these days lol.
I don't mind small screens. I love the SE X1 form factor. The bigger TP2 is cool too though.
If it takes 5 years for Microsoft to implement everything into WP7, then imagine the features being added to the competition products for the same 5 years. In order to catch up, MS is going to need to come up with some revolutionary ideas (to give the 'impression' of being ahead like Apple did) and work twice as hard as the other developers.
WhyBe said:
I don't mind small screens. I love the SE X1 form factor. The bigger TP2 is cool too though.
If it takes 5 years for Microsoft to implement everything into WP7, then imagine the features being added to the competition products for the same 5 years. In order to catch up, MS is going to need to come up with some revolutionary ideas (to give the 'impression' of being ahead like Apple did) and work twice as hard as the other developers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think their 5 year plan involves catching up to the competition I think they are more about how long it's going to take to pass the competition in terms of offerings. If it was just about adding what's out there now then they should just give up already. I don't think they are that naive. I think they are pulling out there most important features right out the gate which makes the most sense. Xbox live intergration, Zune services, a better marketplace, and a great marketing campaign. These are what the average consumer is looking for. Cut and paste, 3rd party multitasking, etc is not going to cross the average person's mind when they look at a phone but it will make the experience better and that's what they are going for next.
I use the TP2 right now. I like the 3.7" screen but I still think something HD2 size with a keyboard would be the greatest device on the planet. But that's because I love landscape sliders but not everyone else shares the same opinion.
Its hard to say if they'll pass the competition or not, because Im sure the competition is working on some innovations too. This makes the task very difficult for MS unless they're working on some groundbreaking technology no one else has.
Hi I want to start this post so everyone can post their experience with the new 720 Recording Feature on the HTC Desire!
Please post Like this:
Video
Description
Problems
FPS
Rom used
I'll start:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxxPdPd8ea4
Description:
Me being very concentrated while playing the Drums... new song Bad Lighting hard sound situation (way too loud for this little Phone ) so worst case
Problems:
I see constant drops in FPS, or more likely a stuttering ever few seconds video playback just kida stops, audio is fine though! I did not have this Problems with other Roms so I think its not my SD card acting up?
FPS: 5-11 not very constant at all, although lighting was very constant (although very bad)
ROM used: LeeDroid 7.1b
Before official update:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugjI5ygsXzQ
Average/good lighting
20fps
Can't remember the rom, I think MCR v5, it was before the official update.
Not a lot of stuttering that I can notice, but the lens cover was a bit smudged and so the video came out a bit opaque.
After the update:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6KuPCn6_2M [quality should improve in a bit]
Probably a tad better lighting conditions
23fps
ieftm semi-stock rom
This is the best sample of three, one was ok, but the last one was stuttering quite a bit, as I think some background program was accessing the sd card heavily. Also lens here was a bit dirty
by the way, youtube quality doesn't render properly, linking videos should be better.
andycted said:
by the way, youtube quality doesn't render properly, linking videos should be better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did not know that, your Video looks very pixelated... Is that because its on Youtube? I will edit main thread thx
finnschi said:
Did not know that, your Video looks very pixelated... Is that because its on Youtube? I will edit main thread thx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, I think it was me that turned contrast a bit too high and the fact that without optical zoom or camera lens optics you can get lose details in the distance on such high resolution
I gave up 720p, it is not good. Jumpy, low fps and especially ****ty voice quality.
I use 480p, but it is also not good, not too jumpy ... still ****ty voice quality.
I have 2.2 rom from here and 720p keeps freezing every few seconds.
720p is ok for me. Is it possible that its to do with the internal memory available? I have 60mb or more free, I know some people are down to low numbers. my card is a class2 too. I think the clips look better played on the PC in VLC lpayer than when I upload them to youtube. I think youtube might be introducing some of the negative aspects seen... maybe?
finnschi said:
I'll start:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxxPdPd8ea4
Description: Me being very concentrated while playing the Drums...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please please please... Can we please take advantage of the user interface of the XDA site?
For six months XDA has now supported YouTube embeds -- You can even see the icon in the COMPOSE screens -- though admittedly they don't tell you how to use it very easily.
BEHOLD! It's your video, and I don't have to click a new tab to see it. Magic!
Format for YouTube Embeds:
(remove spaces)
[ youtube ]just-the-video-letter/numbers[ /youtube ]
From your video above, the part that goes in between the [ youtube ] brackets follows v= NxxPdPd8ea4
Please, could you edit your first post to include the instructions. It has taken years to get XDA to embrace video. Now that they have, please support svetius, the User Experience designer of the new site, and use the tools. That's why they're here. Thank you.
P.S. -- is this jamming to the old WHO classic I CAN SEE FOR MILES ? -- just curious... in the event it is because Roger Daltrey still tours this very summer playing it -- and a friend of mine, a session guitarist in L.A., does Townsend's parts. ... Me, waiting for the answer:
"Dude, who are The Who?"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
P.S.S. Is this not the coolest thing? DUDE! Your bio here at XDA!
Occupation:
R&D at Apple Inc.
Working at Apple research... hating the iPhone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I gotta applaud you. I have used Apple products for 25 years. And I currently use primarily Mac computers, but I also use Windows machines. Very agnostic. But I have never used the iphone, especially since Apple was nowhere in sight when I started with touchscreen smartphones 5 or 6 years ago (but I salute the Newton!)... But I'm a usability designer, so i consider myself fair. And even though I have wanted my Desire to match or exceed the 720p capability of iphone4 -- i was at the Apple store a few weeks ago getting my damp MBP repaired for 3rd time and played with the iP4 -- and the 720p recording is pretty damn good. ... Lastly -- are you familiar with the various TEST PROJECTS that have been going on here since the Nexus One to optimize 720p in this HTC class of phones? If not, search... There are a whole bunch of serious collaborative engineering projects here, and as always XDA-devs work miracles -- so I'm not giving up hope yet. We may smash that iphone yet in recoding quality -- though I doubt it... I am told it records 30fps and no matter what backflips are done here, thru Froyo or other enhancements, we can't get this hardware to meet or exceed that. Is that true?
720p is crap, its just upscale from lover res., dont use it.
more info:
The data rate of 720p is over 4 times greater than 800x480. 6000kb/sec versus 1200kb/sec. It's not purely upscaled at all. I made two sample videos of a page of text and compared.
There was ALOT more detail in the 720p video. Even when I zoomed up the 800x480 one. I agree it's not as good as "true 720 HD" but its certainly not 100% upscaled.
mcgon1979 said:
The data rate of 720p is over 4 times greater than 800x480. 6000kb/sec versus 1200kb/sec. It's not purely upscaled at all. I made two sample videos of a page of text and compared.
There was ALOT more detail in the 720p video. Even when I zoomed up the 800x480 one. I agree it's not as good as "true 720 HD" but its certainly not 100% upscaled.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1200:6000 it's 5 times more. Yes it's not true 720 hd, but I can perfectly live with that quality if we get a couple of fps more
I've taken two short videos of a label, took screenshots from video player, cropped them, resized the 480 to fit the same size as the 720 one. It's very blurry compared to the normal 720p. See the hour in the fake pda, you can't read it in the upscaled one.
Video upscalers tend to do a better job than a simple photo resize and they do introduce more data leading to a larger file size. The disire may truly just upscale the video after all. In any case, its a shame that video capture on this device is as poor as it is. I dislike Apple and their iphone, but i'll give them this; all aspects of the software work very well from go and if not, a fix/upgrade is provided in a reasonably short time.
Jaa-Yoo said:
Video upscalers tend to do a better job than a simple photo resize and they do introduce more data leading to a larger file size. The disire may truly just upscale the video after all. In any case, its a shame that video capture on this device is as poor as it is. I dislike Apple and their iphone, but i'll give them this; all aspects of the software work very well from go and if not, a fix/upgrade is provided in a reasonably short time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Given the current state of their last shiny toy, I think it's a bit funny to say so.
Anyway, I've done some more tests and I can take the screen captured from a 480 video and upscale it with any tool with best quality or other algorythms and you always end up with a lot less detail than 720p, especially when there is a lot of light (unlike that test above). I don't think the desire has the processing power to do a better upscale than what I'm trying and while there might be a bit of upscaling given you have a tiny lens, it's not all there.
Also any tiny lens without zoom is pointless when taking videos from the distance anyway.
I can only get 15-16 fps... anyone can do higher?
I can easily get 25 average, outside in. good lighting, with a class 6 sd
quicksite said:
P.S. -- is this jamming to the old WHO classic I CAN SEE FOR MILES ? -- just curious... in the event it is because Roger Daltrey still tours this very summer playing it -- and a friend of mine, a session guitarist in L.A., does Townsend's parts. ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No its our own song, although i can see how the beginning sounds kinda like the Who
quicksite said:
I gotta applaud you. I have used Apple products for 25 years. And I currently use primarily Mac computers, but I also use Windows machines. Very agnostic. But I have never used the iphone, especially since Apple was nowhere in sight when I started with touchscreen smartphones 5 or 6 years ago (but I salute the Newton!)... But I'm a usability designer, so i consider myself fair. And even though I have wanted my Desire to match or exceed the 720p capability of iphone4 -- i was at the Apple store a few weeks ago getting my damp MBP repaired for 3rd time and played with the iP4 -- and the 720p recording is pretty damn good. ... Lastly -- are you familiar with the various TEST PROJECTS that have been going on here since the Nexus One to optimize 720p in this HTC class of phones? If not, search... There are a whole bunch of serious collaborative engineering projects here, and as always XDA-devs work miracles -- so I'm not giving up hope yet. We may smash that iphone yet in recoding quality -- though I doubt it... I am told it records 30fps and no matter what backflips are done here, thru Froyo or other enhancements, we can't get this hardware to meet or exceed that. Is that true?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I talked to some iPhone engineers about how the iPhone can archive 30Fps ... its because all the decoding of pictures delivered by the camera is handled by the GPU... for Android its all done on the CPU! so we need to find a way to decode the video stream using the Desires GPU, but I think the iP4's GPU is far better than the Desires... i am a hardware engineer... i am in no way able to code anything like that! What Makes me curios is file size comparison between an iP4 and the Desire.
Also: Desire running a non sense rom (AOSP) just like the Nexus gives much better 720 Quality!!! so I guess its in the software
finnschi said:
I talked to some iPhone engineers about how the iPhone can archive 30Fps ... its because all the decoding of pictures delivered by the camera is handled by the GPU... for Android its all done on the CPU! so we need to find a way to decode the video stream using the Desires GPU, but I think the iP4's GPU is far better than the Desires... i am a hardware engineer... i am in no way able to code anything like that! What Makes me curios is file size comparison between an iP4 and the Desire.
Also: Desire running a non sense rom (AOSP) just like the Nexus gives much better 720 Quality!!! so I guess its in the software
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
SInce I am NEITHER a hardware nor software engineer, I am useless here, other than to ask obvious questions. Your apple access to methodology of iP4's video capture is itself useful information -- something that if I were a software engineer working on the various test projects here at XDA, I would want to know. Maybe that's something they could infer, or maybe its published somewhere, or maybe it's one of those "Geez, it's so obvious do i really need to be told that?" points.
That then gets blurred and muddied by the REAL armchair knowitalls (*I* disclose that I know nothing) who pounce on a pronouncement by someone here and say "That's impossible, or that's bullcrap, look here at my image, it proves you wrong, end of story" -- only to often find --- NOT end of story and that person got it wrong.
All i know is -- my experience has told me never presume -- because this site is SO HUGE, it is actually quite often that the right hand doesn't know what left hand is up to.
I wish there were a better means of coordinating the total knowledge holders of XDA site on this 720p issue regarding TOTAL CAPABILITY, software and hardware, so there is 100% collaboration. In the end, there is only one answer: Yes, desire can meet or exceed iphone4 720 p in every measure of resolution, or not.
THE PART I DIDN"T GET:
What Makes me curios is file size comparison between an iP4 and the Desire.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which is bigger? what is your initial inference? larger file size = higher rez?
thank you
roufianos cooked a Rom that achieved 29-30 fps but the phone restarted after 50 seconds of recording. Was that due to overheating of the processor? I don't know. His phone gave up spirit and he is waiting for a replacement so the development of his Rom is on pause at the moment.
andycted said:
I can easily get 25 average, outside in. good lighting, with a class 6 sd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've not seen more than 23fps in 720p with great lighting. anyone else? I use a Class2 card so maybe using class 6 is why you get 25fps average?
mcgon1979 said:
I've not seen more than 23fps in 720p with great lighting. anyone else? I use a Class2 card so maybe using class 6 is why you get 25fps average?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ive managed 26fps @ 720p with my Desire running official unbranded 2.2. Im using a Class 4 card, so that might help over your Class 2.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saS39iqjDgs
I just compared the youtube clip to the original on my PC (i scaled the VLC window down to the same size as playing the youtube clip in its 'expanded' size) and there is definatly a small quality difference. The details on the original are noticable finer, so even @ 720p on youtube the bitrate must take a small hit.
Here is a screenshot of the comparison.
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/9005/720pcomparison.jpg
So I'm sitting here with a Samsung Cetus running Windows Phone 7 and beside the about menu in system settings, is there anyway to check for more specs.
I'm looking for CPU, RAM and so on.
There's a "more info" button on that page that shows the memory, etc. Don't think CPU or other chipset info is exposed anywhere.
And pics?
Woha, that's the only phone I think will have something else than Qualcrap, Cetus is the one I will buy.
Disassemble it now!! I want to know the specs
Sadly the more info button only shows model, Windows Phone 7 and storage. Total Storage: 7.39gb -- Ava. Storage: 6.88gb
And then revision of firmware, hardware, radio, bootloader and chip SOC.
Not sure I can share pics of it. It's not Cetus btw, my bad, had them mistaken. (CORRECTION: IT IS CETUS) It's the Samsung GT-i8700, not sure it has a name, unless they decide to call Samsung GT-i8700 Cetus.
Giz has pictures of it: http://gizmodo.com/5634058/leaked-shots-of-windows-phone-7+running-samsung-gt+i8700 The version I have is identical in looks, though a newer build in software.
Would probably require you to sketch up a quick application. Not sure if there's any APIs that allow you to read out any significant information.
Yeah you are properly right, but I'm not even sure if I can install an app, if it's not on the market
Erroneus said:
Yeah you are properly right, but I'm not even sure if I can install an app, if it's not on the market
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Should be able to hook it up to a pc and deploy one (might require you to be a dev in the marketplace though). That doesn't change the fact that we don't have an app to do the checking hah.
Hmm, using the GraphicsAdapter stuff from XNA you might be able to glean some information to close in on the stuff. For instance, would it say something like "Adreno 205" (assuming there's such detailed information there and that the WP7 XNA API supports it), you'll know that it's the second generation chipset.
Good idea, installing XNA 4.0 now.
Ideally the whole Visual Studio Express for WP7 shebang, or whatever it is called.
http://www.storageserver.be/images/xnagraphics.jpg
The Vendor ID in there is the one from NVidia and the Device ID the one of the 8800GT. Coincidentally, there's a NVidia 8800GT in my system.
I figure that the ARM SoC's or the internal graphics devices have similar IDs registered.
--edit:
http://www.storageserver.be/gatest.zip
That silly project. It's possible that you need to register the device as developer device on the WM marketplace to deploy stuff. No idea.
--edit2:
http://www.pcidatabase.com/
Vendor ID's here.
Tom Servo said:
http://www.storageserver.be/images/xnagraphics.jpg
The Vendor ID in there is the one from NVidia and the Device ID the one of the 8800GT. Coincidentally, there's a NVidia 8800GT in my system.
I figure that the ARM SoC's or the internal graphics devices have similar IDs registered.
--edit:
http://www.storageserver.be/gatest.zip
That silly project. It's possible that you need to register the device as developer device on the WM marketplace to deploy stuff. No idea.
--edit2:
http://www.pcidatabase.com/
Vendor ID's here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does it have a 4 inch screen?
Doesn't look like this is going to be easy. Windows can't see the phone, because of missing drivers
It's a 4 inch screen.
Erroneus said:
Doesn't look like this is going to be easy. Windows can't see the phone, because of missing drivers
It's a 4 inch screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, you need the Zune 4.7 that's posted on the private Microsoft Connect site.
Is that a late developer phone, or did you get your hands early on a different way?
Tom Servo said:
Is that a late developer phone, or did you get your hands early on a different way?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hands early on a different way for a couple of days, giving back some feedback to one who lend me it.
I also had Desire HD for some days, I'm more impressed with this one though, but that's properly because everything is so new and fresh
OMG you lucky b*stard lol! Other than the 4in screen, and 8gb storage which you've mentioned. Things I (we) need to know:
CPU, GPU (if possible), RAM, overall device dimensions, and last but not least, Battery size. Hope you get back to us soon, I really like this device, cus its probably the only one that might not have a Qualcomm/Adreno200 chip.
The battery is at 1500 mAH, but I have no way to check for CPU, GPU and RAM sadly. But it's really fast, even in this beta version of Windows Phone 7.
Dimensions:
Length: 122 mm (4.8 inches)
Width: 64 mm (2.52 inches)
Height: 11 mm (0.43 inches)
Thanks Erroneus.
Wow, battery and dimensions looks to be the same as the Galaxy S (tho about 1mm thicker). The 4in (super?) amoled screen and 1500mah battery has put this to the top of my wish list.
The LG phone supposedly has a speech-to-text feature. Would you know if this sammy device has that feature also?
Also does it have a front facing camera?
The screen is very good, it looks like super amoled, because the colors are very vibrant comparing to iPhone 4 and Desire.
It has voice to command features, like "open internet explorer", I don't see any "speech-to-text feature", but the software is still beta and without special customizations from Samsung.
There seems to be a front facing camera, I just can't find anywhere to enable it.
Windows Phone 7 has been a fresh change from the millions of rows and columns of icons we have seen in smartphones in the recent past. Although the operating system is super fast and effective, it does lack in a few areas, when compared to Android and iOS. Here’s what we would love to see in the next Windows Phone 7 handset.
Guest Mode
Everybody has personal stuff on their phone. From stored passwords, to ‘logged-in’ social networks, to credit card details, to personal images and documents. There’s a constant fear of spilling out ‘classified information’ when somebody wants to view your new smartphone. What do you do then? Enter guest mode.
I’ll quickly explain this once, if you’ve not understood it already. Guest mode allows you to hide your personal data like e-mail, social networking updates, files and login info. You have two passwords on your smartphone. Password A enables guest mode, while password B enables your normal phone functionality. It’s an extremely simple to implement feature, but somehow hasn’t been included. No longer do you have to stay worried about showing your latest WP7 handset to your friends, as you’ll have guest mode! C’mon Microsoft, please do this for us and everybody else.
Media formats and Zune
The single most irritating feature in Windows right now is Zune and how it greatly limits media formats for your smartphone. Why do all videos have to be transcoded by Zune? It’s similar to iTunes for iOS devices, but we’d have loved a free approach by Microsoft. Anyway, all is still not over and removing Zune dependency would definitely be a ‘feature’ we’d all love to have. And while we’re at it, more media format support out of the box would definitely be a brilliant addition. After all, they’re all ‘smart’phones, aren’t they?
No more Zune!
To think of it, everything in their user interface is slick and fast. From sending emails to updating your Facebook status, to clicking pictures, to accessing music - the whole experience is a breeze. Why doesn’t the same outlook have to be carried over to connectivity to the PC, data transfer and playback? Playing any video format is definitely on our priority list and transferring music files using mass storage is an easier task to accomplish as well. Even phone updates currently require you to connect your phone via Zune, whereas OTA it's quicker, faster and sexier!
More UI customization
Not particularly happy with the look of the user interface? Too bad, you can’t do a thing about it. Like iOS, WP7 is a closed system and while i ain't particularly complaining out here, how you feel about the interface from the word go, will clearly decide your overall experience and satisfaction with the phone. WP7 is as rigid as iOS. The best you can do at the moment is change tiles, add or remove them or simply change the background and tile colour.
I’ll reiterate this again, we aren’t complaining about the user interface. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with the UI, but sometimes you might want that slight amount of customization that might alter the look and feel of your phone. A desktop wallpaper, an alternate launcher, or simply minor tweaks in the layout mean that you’ll never get tired of the tile interface and you’ll have one more option to choose from.
1080p recording support
So, the UI is fluid, the phone can do all your basic tasks efficiently without too much of a hassle. But, for WP7 to stay in the hunt for the top spot, it’s the ‘small’ things that need to be maxed out, starting with 1080p video recording. Take, for example, the Nokia Lumia 800. It’s one of the top smartphone offerings, it competes with the likes of the HTC Sensation and the Atrix 2, two relatively older phones. The 800 can do ‘only’ 720p, while the other two are capable of ‘1080p’. True, this isn't a major deal, because on a screen that small, there’s absolutely no visible difference. but hey if you’re paying big bucks for your smartphone, you might as well get the best of everything!
This could also be due to the fact that Microsoft has been extremely restrictive with OEMs so far. Single core CPUs, max 480 x 800 pixel resolutions are frustratingly low-end specs. That may change however, but we’re hoping the transition is quicker than their updates!
External memory card support
Another simple addition that we definitely would want in the next Windows Phone 7 device is support for an external memory card. Depending upon your phone, you may either get 8 or 16 gigs of storage, and that is definitely enough for a lot of people, but as of now, most of the handsets don’t have a microSD card slot, with a few exceptions like the Samsung Focus.
How difficult is it?
There’s a certain trend with the increasing use of cloud services and the elimination of memory card slots, and there are chances that more and more devices in the near future would come with ‘just’ the internal memory. For personal reasons, ease of use and poor operation of cloud services in the country at the moment, we’d definitely want the next-gen devices to have an external memory card. It’s just - convenient and easy! For the record, even the Nokia Lumia 900 isn’t going to have an external memory card slot, just like the Galaxy Nexus and the Sony Xperia S. With cloud becoming more and more popular, can you see the trend? Give us back our ‘microSD card support up to 32GB’ spec!
NFC support
In the year 2012, 100 million NFC-enabled smart-phones are going to be sold, according to a study. We can bet that most of them won’t be Windows Phone 7 devices. Why? Because NFC hasn’t still come to Windows Phone 7 devices. According to a Microsoft spokesman, “While NFC is not currently supported on Windows Phone 7.5, it is coming. We expect NFC-enabled Windows Phone devices to ship within the next year.” This statement was recorded in 2011, so hopefully we will get to see NFC this year.
100m in 2012, none will be WP7??
Though NFC is still in its nascent stages here, it’s quite the future of a lot of mobile related services. So, for the love of those of us who don’t change our devices for a long, long time, could you please have that option in your next WP7 phone, Microsoft ? At the moment, it’s not up to the OEMs to include or exclude this feature, so we know who’s got to buck up.
TV Out
Want to show your videos and photos from your WP7 device on your swanky new HDTV? Well, it’s not easy as 1 - 2 - 3. You’ll have to get them onto your laptop or another device and then showcase it to your friends and family. TV out via HDMI or MHL is definitely an option we would love to have. Nokia Play To is coming soon, so that limitation might have a workaround in the future, but not all HDTVs are equipped with Wi-Fi or an Ethernet port.
Well I would say more freedom to devs so better apps can be made possible.
Thanks A Lot Sir For Your Opinion
lamborg said:
Well I would say more freedom to devs so better apps can be made possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks Sir,
Agree
I think they should improve the software of the camera. Lumia Nokia 800 has a great sensor, but the picture quality leaves much to be desired
davidwar said:
I think they should improve the software of the camera. Lumia Nokia 800 has a great sensor, but the picture quality leaves much to be desired
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but, it's been claimed by WPcentral the Titan 2 has a much better sensor than ever the Lumina 900 and pictures have been great (read into the reviews on WPcentral)
As with the OP.
UI customisations- YES !! No question, the option for simple but, advanced features.
1080p recording- No brainer, everyone else is doing it but, a 1080p camera that actually looks like a 1080p recording (a good quality lens and sensor standard)
NFC and TV out, sure that would be nice.
I would also like
1. New battery tech so devices can last a TRUE 4-5 days with out a charge (I'm dreaming)
2. Better graphics upgrade TO take gaming to the level of Android and the iPhone. Just compare the videos of Spinter Cell for WP7 and look at Rage for the iphone (and that's not a new game), you'll see what I mean. They are not even in the same class. To take the Xbox Live brand serious...
Advice, developing a high end video compression codec on Shield Android TV for Camera Acquisition and HQ video.
Hi
Aims
I am researching doing a high end streamlined video compression/decompression codec that can be installed and registered under Android, and be available to third party camera, editing and video apps.* Shield seems like a good top end development target.* I am hoping it will be able to compress 4k+ video streams, with small file sizes and reduced processing overheads.
Even though it is meant to be more for high end camera acquisition on Android in general, it also has other uses on the web.
I am trying to find out general, and detailed, information to see what I need to address.* I'm a newbie to all this, from back in the days that C++ was new and untaught in my college. I'm going to have to reteach myself programming, but have a lot of knowledge on the design side due to previous work.
Codec Programming?
So basically, I need advice on broad programming info on programming and registering a codec on Android and gp-gpu use?
But with Android things seem a bit more complicated to get performance due to the way things are structured:
Backend Camera Streamlining?
Previous high level camera projects have failed due to the underlying restrictions of the android camera interface and customisations from phone to phone, but also Android's slow nature. This is an attempt to bypass this with a high performance codec section.* L and M, reportedly address the deficiencies somewhat, but for the codec I realise the data rate of video data coming in might be poor, and* I might have to write a back end to acquire the frames from the hardware to the codec quick enough, which I don't want to do, but if I can't get frame data delivery fast enough I will have to look at it. I want to use mainly the GPU or other processing units instead of the main processor, for power efficiency and speed, but realise nothing is simple. All that sort of stuff that you have to do because it was not done right in the first place. So, avoiding going through slower high end camera interfaces as much as possible. I understand it is all based on a standard Linux camera API. If the camera software does not have to be rewritten and it can deliver frame data at streamlined timely speeds to a codec, then I can avoid much of this. So, I probably need advice in these things too.
Backend Storage Streamlining?
Now, on the other side we have storage**Hopefully the data rate can be small enough to avoid issues, but that is unlikely on a 4k-8k frame and would need advice on this too.
JavaScript to Android, Android to JavaScript transportability?
I actually want to develop the core of it within JavaScript primarily, for transportable use on the web and Firefox OS, so will have to find out the best way to transfer it to Android for compilation? As I know next to nothing about these new languages, it will be an uphill learning curve. As I understand, JavaScript syntax is separate from Java, and not a even a logical subset, which makes life hard.
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Anyway, it is a shame we don't have a kick starter like funding scheme, to pay a good programmer to do most of the background stuff, and upgrade the Linux code and drivers, so anybody can use the new code with any codec and camera app combination. My main interest is my own codec, not all the other stuff, that is really fixing Android and Linux camera code, which would help everybody.
This is not an official project start, just implementation research.
If anybody knows of anybody that can contribute, please direct them here?
Thanks.
Stevio2 said:
Advice, developing a high end video compression codec on Shield Android TV for Camera Acquisition and HQ video.
Hi
Aims
I am researching doing a high end streamlined video compression/decompression codec that can be installed and registered under Android, and be available to third party camera, editing and video apps.* Shield seems like a good top end development target.* I am hoping it will be able to compress 4k+ video streams, with small file sizes and reduced processing overheads.
Even though it is meant to be more for high end camera acquisition on Android in general, it also has other uses on the web.
I am trying to find out general, and detailed, information to see what I need to address.* I'm a newbie to all this, from back in the days that C++ was new and untaught in my college. I'm going to have to reteach myself programming, but have a lot of knowledge on the design side due to previous work.
Codec Programming?
So basically, I need advice on broad programming info on programming and registering a codec on Android and gp-gpu use?
But with Android things seem a bit more complicated to get performance due to the way things are structured:
Backend Camera Streamlining?
Previous high level camera projects have failed due to the underlying restrictions of the android camera interface and customisations from phone to phone, but also Android's slow nature. This is an attempt to bypass this with a high performance codec section.* L and M, reportedly address the deficiencies somewhat, but for the codec I realise the data rate of video data coming in might be poor, and* I might have to write a back end to acquire the frames from the hardware to the codec quick enough, which I don't want to do, but if I can't get frame data delivery fast enough I will have to look at it. I want to use mainly the GPU or other processing units instead of the main processor, for power efficiency and speed, but realise nothing is simple. All that sort of stuff that you have to do because it was not done right in the first place. So, avoiding going through slower high end camera interfaces as much as possible. I understand it is all based on a standard Linux camera API. If the camera software does not have to be rewritten and it can deliver frame data at streamlined timely speeds to a codec, then I can avoid much of this. So, I probably need advice in these things too.
Backend Storage Streamlining?
Now, on the other side we have storage**Hopefully the data rate can be small enough to avoid issues, but that is unlikely on a 4k-8k frame and would need advice on this too.
JavaScript to Android, Android to JavaScript transportability?
I actually want to develop the core of it within JavaScript primarily, for transportable use on the web and Firefox OS, so will have to find out the best way to transfer it to Android for compilation? As I know next to nothing about these new languages, it will be an uphill learning curve. As I understand, JavaScript syntax is separate from Java, and not a even a logical subset, which makes life hard.
----------
Anyway, it is a shame we don't have a kick starter like funding scheme, to pay a good programmer to do most of the background stuff, and upgrade the Linux code and drivers, so anybody can use the new code with any codec and camera app combination. My main interest is my own codec, not all the other stuff, that is really fixing Android and Linux camera code, which would help everybody.
This is not an official project start, just implementation research.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wish you all the luck in your endeavour, as this sounds really interesting, and different........
Saying that, i dont think your suppose to post anything in the dev thread that is'nt an actuall work, im just giving you a heads up, incase a moderator might come along............also i could be wrong, if this has changed recently
Your best bet i reckon, is to post in this thread
http://forum.xda-developers.com/general/general
Its the main general thread of the entire xda, so you'll have more eyeballs.........and maybe a better chance of getting a "start in the right direction" from someone knowledgeable
Ive also read many android technical question being asked at the "stackexchange" website, by devs working on their projects, so that might be another avenue to explore if your unlucky here
Anyways, wish you luck with this
Development Forums (ones with the word development in the title) - For Developers to post release threads e.g. ROMs and Kernels including modifications to kernels, bootloaders, ROMs, etc., as well as R&D development discussion threads designed with an end goal
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. From forum discussion rules. I mistook this to mean development research discussion as well. If it actually should, then I'm happy for it to be moved to general.
Stevio2 said:
Thanks. From forum discussion rules. I mistook this to mean development research discussion as well. If it actually should, then I'm happy for it to be moved to general.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Shield is based on the Nvidia X1 chip. Nvidia also just released the Jetson TX1 development board which is similar. If you register as a developer with nvidia (which is easy) you get access to all the dev docs (including video codec docs) for the TX1, which boots Ubuntu. That should be a good start.
Sounds good, it was an andriod development related question though (using shield hardware under android so it can be shared with different platforms, you just can do more on the shield hardware. Maybe there is a Linux overlap with andriod in codec support but I doubt it isva full story. I am interested in dealing with 8k content too. There is a way to do a 8k over HDMI 2, but muchntoo involved at this stage, the display has to also be modified or an adaptor made to interface to a future 8k interface.
I have just realised the shield might be good for touch table work (not so good on the software side as there are no established software base to work on). I located a new good cheap fine grained more transparent touch surface overlay technology a little while ago that is being used to do cheap touch tables in Asia. Using a 4 subpixel screen I can do a semi 8k display out of a 4k (though you can't directly access the white pixel through hdmi, which is useless). There is also now 6 color pixels. A firmware change might allow a display to sub pixel address. However, you can get panel frames without the internal section and get direct access to the internal panel interface (why hdcp is probably useless). Anyway, 8k would yeild 16k, a nice minimum for a 80 inch table, with OLED, or projector. Reprogramming a display to use display port/thuderbolt interfaces on a display would be more useful. I tried to negotiate access to a 16k projector chip once to connect up to a low powered processing array, but got nowhere. Henceforth I've been dealing with embedded machine code level concerns for decades off and on and let the newer high level language and OS stuff (like C# and Linux) go, due to health issues.
Another intetesting thing that can be done with a shield, is it can be hooked up to a camera head and rigged up to be a camera (or the next version). Problem is that USB 3 is useless compared to Thuderbolt 3 etc (though camera head computet interface standards take a while to catch up). My codec could be used for recording. We used to do this with PC's but the Shield offers a much better power consumption. There is Linux software around to do this, but the development board is half powered and expensive.
Bump
Well, when I said bump, I didn't really mean to move it to a third subforum
Seriously, I want to do a less than 20mbit/s 8k visually lossless codec. But at the moment I'm waiting to get checked out for dementia, which explains a lot about the last few decades and my decreasing amount I can do (beta amyloid in particular builds up for 10-20 years with low grade symptoms before it gets seriouse enough that it is can be picked up on older scanning, by then it has permanent problems. Apart from other types of dementia). At this stage I can't do much much of the time.
Anyway, as the thread has skipped to a second forum in two days, any more short cut advice is welcome.